WEBVTT

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<v ->This meeting of the Public
Utility Commission of Texas</v>

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will come to order to consider matters

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that have been duly posted

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with the Secretary of State of Texas

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for December 16th, 2021.

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For the record, my name is Peter Lake.

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And with me today are
Will McAdams, Lori Cobos

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and Jimmy Glotfelty.

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Mr. Janae, would you please walk us

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through the consent
items on today's agenda?

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<v ->Good morning, Commissioners.</v>

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By individual ballot, the
following items were placed

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on the Commission's Consent Agenda,

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one, eight, 10, 11, 12,
13, 14, 15, 18, 19 and 20.

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<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

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Is there a motion to approve

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the items just described by Mr. Janae?

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<v ->So moved.</v>

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<v ->Second.</v>

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<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

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<v ->Aye.</v>

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<v ->None-opposed,
the motion passes.</v>

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As you all know,

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we are expecting lots
of public comment today.

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And so in order to balance that

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with a need to comply
with a rule submittal

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for the Texas register, and
because of a PUC staff event,

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we're gonna take up
as much of our agenda

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as we can get through
the key rules and priorities

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between now and in 10:30.

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At 10:30, we're gonna open
for public comment until 11:00.

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We'll get through as
much of that as we can.

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At 11:30, we're gonna
break for the staff event

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and reconvene at 12:30 for
any remaining public comment

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or the remainder of the agenda.

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First up, and we will take up item 28

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on market redesign as the
last item on our agenda today.

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We will not be taking
items two and five.

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And in order to knock out
as much of the critical rules

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as we can before 10:30,

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we're gonna start with
items three, 22 and 25.

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Mr. Janae, item three please.

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<v ->Item three is project 52845.</v>

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Middle Mile Broadband.

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Staff has filed a memo and
a proposal for publication.

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<v ->Mr. Smelser, you're welcome.</v>

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<v ->Good morning,
Commissioners Davidson Meltzer,</v>

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Commission staff.

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This is one of our legislative
implementation measures

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that will implement HB3853.

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Big picture, just moving fast.

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If utilities have extra fiber capacity,

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they can share some of that with,

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or they can lease it out rather

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to internet service providers
to provide broadband

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to underserved areas of the state.

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The implementation that
we're doing largely track statute,

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we added a few extra
disclosure elements,

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cybersecurity concerns,

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making sure that rate
payers are not burdening

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any of these shoulder need the costs.

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So it's a pretty straightforward,
this is proposal stage.

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Happy to answer any questions.

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<v ->Thank you, Mr. Smelser.</v>

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Any questions, comments,

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or a motion to approve
the proposal for publication?

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<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

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Good shape right now. I
would move to approve.

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<v ->Second.</v>

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<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

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<v ->Aye.</v>

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<v ->None-opposed,
the motion passes.</v>

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Item 22, please sir.

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<v ->Item 22 is project 51830;</v>

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the review of certain retail

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electric customer protection rules.

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Commission staff has filed a memo

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and a proposal for adoption.

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<v ->Commissioners, the proposal
for adoption is based largely</v>

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on comments that we
received filed by the public,

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along with direction
that we received from you

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at the last open meeting in
response to questions by us.

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A few of the highlights on
how we implemented that are;

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I guess the big picture
decisions are fixed means fixed.

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And so we have in the
definition of fixed rate product,

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that the price of a fixed rate product

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cannot vary along with
the changes in service costs

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as per our discussion last time.

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We also last time had
an extended discussion

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about different risk
profiles of products

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that are in the market.

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And the way we implemented
that was by going forward

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with extending the ban on
wholesale index products,

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all index products for
the small and residential

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small commercial
and residential classes.

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And we made it clear in the preamble

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that sort of a liberal interpretation

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of the other types of products
can sort of fill in the gap

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for seasonal products,
time of use, offsets,

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and solar incentives, all
of these sorts of products.

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So we think that was
our attempt to reflect

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what we understood the
discussion to be last time.

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One aspect where the
draft varies a little bit

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from the discussion is,

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we ended up removing
the AOR requirements

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from their residential and
small commercial section.

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Because by the end of the discussion,

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we had gotten through
like, in the proposal,

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those were supposed to be linked

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to these ancillary service
products and the index products.

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And since we ended up
taking those out of the draft,

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there wasn't anything left
that they are would attach to.

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So I think those were the
sort of high level decisions.

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And we can pivot from this
point based on your direction.

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I'm happy to answer any
more specific questions,

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but as long drafts, I'm
not gonna detail all of it.

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<v ->Thank you, Mr. Smelser.</v>

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And as you acknowledged,

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this Commission had a long discussion

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at our last open meeting
about this very matter.

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And a thorough discussion.

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As we all know, this is a
key customer protection item

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from the last legislative
session to ensure that our,

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especially our residential
customers are more protected

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than they were this time last year.

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And I think staff's done a very good job

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in a very short amount of time

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with a fairly, very big undertaking.

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This is one of those
items that in normal times

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would have been substantial on its own.

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But in these extraordinary times,

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is just one of the many
reforms going into place.

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Questions, comments, thoughts?

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<v ->Would you lead Commissioner,
but I have thoughts.</v>

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<v ->Okay, Mr. McAdams.</v>

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Okay, all right, well, great.

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So as you've noted, Chairman Lake,

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Winter Storm Uri demonstrated
the need for the Commission

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to proactively protect consumers.

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And this role reflects our
continued and strong commitment

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to protect our state's consumers.

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As I've said at the last open meeting,

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the storm exposed
many risks for consumers,

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essentially busted the
seams of our retail market,

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and further direction of House Bill 16

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that was passed by the legislature,

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signed into law by the Governor.

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We must ban wholesale price index plans.

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And the bill, the
legislation also provides us

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with the ability to add
additional customer protections

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for our consumers.

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And that is why we are here today;

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to ensure that we can
proactively protect residential

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small commercial consumers,

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and really all consumers in the future.

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And so, with respect to the three items,

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I am currently open to comment.

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I know I've stayed in my position.

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And Commissioner McAdams,

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you may have some
additional thoughts on that?

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<v ->Yeah.</v>

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I mean, I'm gonna wax poetic
here because I think this rule

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offers a great window

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into the broader market
design conversation

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that we are having later today.

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But for the public's benefit,

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and certainly I know
the market appreciates

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a bit of history;

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for more than 20 years,

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this state has enjoyed the benefits

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of the energy only
deregulated market design.

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For over a decade,
energy prices within ERCOT

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had been among the
lowest in the country,

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and by some estimates in the world.

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I think it is fair to say
that our energy costs

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have played a major role in making Texas

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one of the most dynamic
places to either start

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or grow a business in the country.

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This Commission over
that time has pursued

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a light touch approach to regulation

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in the spirit that market
forces would produce

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the lowest cost, most efficient,

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and best outcomes for consumers.

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Then came February
and everything changed.

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Through your leadership, Mr. Chairman,

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we have undertaken a
crash course program

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to address the directors
from the legislature

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through statute and statutory
reforms and the Governor.

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We have also attempted to
address operational challenges

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facing ERCOT as the
resource mix of our system

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shifts to a more
variable source of power.

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Throughout this process,

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an overarching thought has nagged at me.

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And that is, any policy
change we consider,

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the cure should not be
worse than the disease.

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And by that, I mean, we
should not consider policies

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that eliminate some of
the most important virtues

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of the deregulated market.

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Because if we do that, what is the point

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of having a deregulated market?

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So all that said, your
blueprint, our blueprint,

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that we will consider later today,

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I believe threads the needle.

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I believe it provides us a
measured and incremental approach

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where this Commission
can stand at the tiller,

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guiding the ship through the
rocks of what the future holds

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for the deregulated market,
the changing resource mix,

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the variability that that holds,

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to help manage the costs
incrementally to consumers,

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so that ultimately they
don't experience price shock.

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So, how that segues into
implementation of House Bill 16

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in the rulemaking.

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One of the most important
aspects of our market

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is that consumers have
optionality to a degree.

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Now, I think what we are considering

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as part of this rulemaking,

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attempts to maintain that optionality,

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but also manage the risk

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for both the market and the consumer.

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We have heard through filings

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and also anecdotally through
market participant feedback

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that the ancillary service condition,

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the ability to pass
through ancillary services

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is something that will
weigh on their ability

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to develop products.

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Namely fixed one year
and two year products.

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In years past, in 2019,
when this market experienced

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a price shock of sorts,

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we hit $9,000 a megawatt
hour for only one hour,

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which caused wholesale
prices to increase.

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It gave comfort to
legislators and policymakers

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that two year and one
year products were available

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to help smooth out
that risk to consumers,

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so that they didn't
experience those high prices

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all in one bill.

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if the threat of the menu
of ancillary services

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that we will consider later today,

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cast a cloud over the ability
for the retail market to offer

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one and two year products,

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then I think we should take every effort

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and make every effort
to clarify to the market

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how we will help manage
this moving forward,

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and act as a natural breaking system.

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So, I think a change should
be considered to the PFA

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as it relates to the
portion of the rulemaking

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on 25.475.

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And if you go to
subsection B five, okay?

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So if you have your red
line, that's on page two.

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As it relates to fixed rate product.

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And the change that
says the price may not vary

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from the disclosed
amount to reflect changes

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in ancillary service charges.

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I would propose and welcome
feedback by adding one word.

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In between changes in,

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I would add existing to
ancillary service charges.

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Meaning that what we
have in the system today,

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those charges and those
fluctuations in charges

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shall not be passed
through to consumers.

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Upholding the fixed
means fixed principle.

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However, as we look at FFRS,

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which has not been implemented yet,

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ECRS, which is being considered
as a part of the blueprint,

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voltage support, which
is part of the blueprint,

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winter ancillary service,

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which is the backup fuel
storage ancillary service,

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which is part of the blueprint,

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that we would consider
these on a case by case basis

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to give guidance to the market,

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that we would set the size, the scope,

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and how those charges may
be passed through to the market.

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So hopefully, that gives
comfort to the retailers

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so that they can continue to
market one and two year plans

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with the knowledge that
there will be a process

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at the Commission,

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and that they have the due process

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associated with our consideration.

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And with that, Mr. Chairman,
I'd welcome any feedback.

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<v ->That's an interesting
change to me.</v>

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This all comes down to the question of,

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are individual residential
households better

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at managing the financial
risk of the ERCOT market,

00:13:26.260 --> 00:13:28.670
or are the retail electric providers

00:13:28.670 --> 00:13:30.400
who these households pay their money to

00:13:30.400 --> 00:13:32.033
better at managing that risk?

00:13:32.990 --> 00:13:34.660
For me, the answer
is the retail providers

00:13:34.660 --> 00:13:36.710
who collect those monthly checks.

00:13:36.710 --> 00:13:40.010
Our job is not to provide
comfort to those companies.

00:13:40.010 --> 00:13:42.920
Our job is to provide
a level playing field

00:13:43.950 --> 00:13:46.910
so that multiple companies can compete

00:13:46.910 --> 00:13:50.850
to deliver the best service
and the best price to consumers.

00:13:50.850 --> 00:13:53.710
It's not our job to
manage the risk for them,

00:13:53.710 --> 00:13:57.280
and it's not our job
to provide a cushion

00:13:57.280 --> 00:13:59.080
to enhance their profits,

00:13:59.080 --> 00:14:02.920
so they can go sell themselves
to the next big Jen Taylor

00:14:02.920 --> 00:14:03.753
who comes along.

00:14:04.860 --> 00:14:06.960
I do appreciate your point

00:14:06.960 --> 00:14:11.873
that unexpected costs can
be harmful to any business.

00:14:13.760 --> 00:14:15.530
And so I can see how this fits in

00:14:15.530 --> 00:14:17.763
with the changes going forward,

00:14:18.770 --> 00:14:22.758
and the new products
that we're bringing to bear

00:14:22.758 --> 00:14:24.550
and bringing to market.

00:14:24.550 --> 00:14:29.550
However, I don't want to
allow a backend default setting.

00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:33.010
So then a year or two years,

00:14:33.010 --> 00:14:34.960
whenever these products come into play,

00:14:36.400 --> 00:14:40.390
I don't want the default
setting to just be allowed

00:14:40.390 --> 00:14:43.130
to allow these retail providers
to sneak the next product

00:14:43.130 --> 00:14:47.210
in the back door so it
passed through to customers

00:14:49.900 --> 00:14:53.673
without any measure
or checks and balances.

00:14:54.940 --> 00:14:56.980
So what can we do?

00:14:56.980 --> 00:14:59.373
I don't think that's
your intention either.

00:15:00.220 --> 00:15:05.220
So what do we do to
ensure that when we do get

00:15:05.630 --> 00:15:07.700
firm fuel product, when
we do get voltage support,

00:15:07.700 --> 00:15:09.113
when we do get ECRS,

00:15:10.370 --> 00:15:15.370
how can we ensure that those new costs

00:15:16.410 --> 00:15:19.800
as new ancillary services are
not passed on to consumers?

00:15:19.800 --> 00:15:24.800
And I am happy to
ensure that retail providers

00:15:25.050 --> 00:15:28.283
have visibility on costs that
their businesses will incur.

00:15:31.310 --> 00:15:33.180
And I think that's our only obligation;

00:15:33.180 --> 00:15:34.467
is to give them visibility.

00:15:34.467 --> 00:15:37.110
And I know this last summer,

00:15:37.110 --> 00:15:38.740
there were some unexpected costs

00:15:39.730 --> 00:15:43.910
that was unavoidable and unfortunate.

00:15:43.910 --> 00:15:45.730
And I don't think anybody
on this Commission

00:15:45.730 --> 00:15:47.380
intends for that to happen again.

00:15:48.900 --> 00:15:50.980
But what insurance can we put into place

00:15:50.980 --> 00:15:55.980
to make sure that the next
suite of ancillary services

00:15:56.070 --> 00:16:00.470
are not snuck in the back
door and end up unfiltered

00:16:00.470 --> 00:16:02.343
and unchecked going to the household?

00:16:04.170 --> 00:16:05.300
<v ->Happy to answer that, but.</v>

00:16:05.300 --> 00:16:10.300
<v ->Yeah, so, Chairman, like, I
think you sort of highlighted</v>

00:16:10.600 --> 00:16:12.840
the balance that we're
trying to strike here today

00:16:12.840 --> 00:16:13.673
with these roles.

00:16:13.673 --> 00:16:18.520
And that is, continue in
our commitment to protect

00:16:20.040 --> 00:16:22.330
residential and small
commercial consumers,

00:16:22.330 --> 00:16:26.180
and maintain a healthy,
competitive retail market.

00:16:26.180 --> 00:16:30.550
And so, I agree with
you that at some point

00:16:30.550 --> 00:16:32.160
there is a slippery slope

00:16:32.160 --> 00:16:34.540
in which fixed rate products can be...

00:16:34.540 --> 00:16:39.540
You know, if we're not very
clear as to how we move forward,

00:16:39.720 --> 00:16:43.150
there is a slippery slope
in which fixed rate products

00:16:43.150 --> 00:16:45.170
could be modified to the point

00:16:45.170 --> 00:16:47.030
that they become variable rate products.

00:16:47.030 --> 00:16:47.863
<v ->That's right.</v>

00:16:47.863 --> 00:16:50.970
<v ->And so, that is what we're
trying to prevent here today.</v>

00:16:50.970 --> 00:16:53.840
With respect to the
pass of ancillary services

00:16:53.840 --> 00:16:58.080
and just ancillary services
in general, as many know,

00:16:58.080 --> 00:17:00.540
during the winter storm,
the ancillary service charges

00:17:00.540 --> 00:17:04.270
were significantly high.

00:17:04.270 --> 00:17:07.030
And as a result of all of those costs,

00:17:07.030 --> 00:17:09.400
the legislature, the
Governor signed into law,

00:17:09.400 --> 00:17:12.600
securitization legislation
that allowed us to stabilize

00:17:12.600 --> 00:17:15.200
the market, the integrity of the market,

00:17:15.200 --> 00:17:18.563
and maintain stability in the market.

00:17:19.850 --> 00:17:23.110
As later, ERCOT has
modified their market rules

00:17:23.110 --> 00:17:25.860
to cap their ancillary
service costs at the price cap,

00:17:25.860 --> 00:17:27.880
which has now been lowered by

00:17:29.780 --> 00:17:32.260
just under 50% by the Commission.

00:17:32.260 --> 00:17:34.960
So those two actions together

00:17:34.960 --> 00:17:37.630
create some protections
for consumers going forward

00:17:37.630 --> 00:17:39.993
that we saw exposed during the storm.

00:17:41.410 --> 00:17:45.483
To your point about this summer,

00:17:46.912 --> 00:17:48.750
and going forward,

00:17:48.750 --> 00:17:51.810
I think we have to be
very clear going forward

00:17:51.810 --> 00:17:53.500
on our actions.

00:17:53.500 --> 00:17:55.800
It is incumbent on us as we look

00:17:55.800 --> 00:17:59.840
at all of the suite of
products and services

00:17:59.840 --> 00:18:03.340
that we will be asking
ERCOT to implement,

00:18:03.340 --> 00:18:06.910
that we not only act with
vigilance on reliability,

00:18:06.910 --> 00:18:09.380
but as stewards of consumer costs.

00:18:09.380 --> 00:18:13.373
And so, as those
products are scoped, like,

00:18:15.100 --> 00:18:17.730
or caught contingency reserve service,

00:18:17.730 --> 00:18:20.670
ancillary services, voltage support,

00:18:20.670 --> 00:18:23.520
the winter from fuel
winter resiliency product,

00:18:23.520 --> 00:18:26.600
that we, the Commission,

00:18:26.600 --> 00:18:29.240
determine the size of those products.

00:18:29.240 --> 00:18:31.817
How many megawatts ERCOT
will be required to procure?

00:18:31.817 --> 00:18:34.880
What is the cost allocation methodology?

00:18:34.880 --> 00:18:38.330
And make all of those
determinations so that we can provide

00:18:38.330 --> 00:18:41.380
as much visibility, as much transparency

00:18:41.380 --> 00:18:43.310
to the retail electric provider,

00:18:43.310 --> 00:18:45.770
so they can properly
hedge going forward.

00:18:45.770 --> 00:18:48.030
And so that residential and
small commercial consumers,

00:18:48.030 --> 00:18:50.990
and really all consumers
will have an expectation

00:18:50.990 --> 00:18:54.290
that the adjustment,
the markets will adjust

00:18:54.290 --> 00:18:55.810
to our actions here.

00:18:55.810 --> 00:19:00.810
So I see your point
Commissioner McAdams on that.

00:19:02.076 --> 00:19:06.960
And so, that is, I believe what
we have to do going forward;

00:19:06.960 --> 00:19:09.010
is ensure transparency and visibility

00:19:09.010 --> 00:19:10.560
for the reps and the consumers.

00:19:12.340 --> 00:19:15.250
<v ->So happy to respond.</v>

00:19:15.250 --> 00:19:17.160
Oh, okay, all right.

00:19:17.160 --> 00:19:18.370
The overarching concern

00:19:18.370 --> 00:19:19.990
and the way this is gonna roll out

00:19:19.990 --> 00:19:21.720
in practical effect, I believe.

00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:24.810
And it's only, this isn't me
being a financial wizard,

00:19:24.810 --> 00:19:25.793
this is just logic.

00:19:26.750 --> 00:19:31.750
Which is with the suite
of ancillary services,

00:19:31.800 --> 00:19:33.690
again, everything that
we were proposing,

00:19:33.690 --> 00:19:36.450
I believe it is in our
interest to have implemented

00:19:36.450 --> 00:19:39.140
to some degree in the next two years.

00:19:39.140 --> 00:19:40.831
Sooner if practicable.

00:19:40.831 --> 00:19:42.830
<v ->Absolutely.</v>

00:19:42.830 --> 00:19:47.400
<v ->So reps are going to
market now with the view that,</v>

00:19:47.400 --> 00:19:51.040
all right, if I wanna
have a two year plan,

00:19:51.040 --> 00:19:55.150
I've got to hedge the
exposure to take into account

00:19:55.150 --> 00:19:57.470
the spectrum of ancillary services

00:19:57.470 --> 00:19:59.160
that this Commission is considering.

00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:01.130
Sam who is sitting in
the front row over there,

00:20:01.130 --> 00:20:02.190
and could get called up here,

00:20:02.190 --> 00:20:05.960
but he has proposed 25 gigawatts

00:20:05.960 --> 00:20:09.780
of winter backup fuel ancillary service.

00:20:09.780 --> 00:20:13.250
That's 25,000 megawatts
on a seasonal basis.

00:20:13.250 --> 00:20:17.310
We're looking at 3.9 gigawatts of ECRS.

00:20:17.310 --> 00:20:22.310
So my point is the
scale is gigantic risk

00:20:22.400 --> 00:20:24.920
for any middleman trying to byproducts

00:20:24.920 --> 00:20:26.310
and then pass them through to customers.

00:20:26.310 --> 00:20:28.190
So the intended effect is,

00:20:28.190 --> 00:20:30.230
they're not gonna market
to your plans anymore.

00:20:30.230 --> 00:20:32.610
So we're gonna be left with one month,

00:20:32.610 --> 00:20:34.600
two month and three month plans.

00:20:34.600 --> 00:20:36.130
Which means my father,

00:20:36.130 --> 00:20:39.070
who is not the most technically
savvy person in the world

00:20:39.070 --> 00:20:42.040
is gonna have to renew his
contract every one month,

00:20:42.040 --> 00:20:43.820
two month and three months.

00:20:43.820 --> 00:20:46.700
And that's going to cause some issues.

00:20:46.700 --> 00:20:51.700
So I believe just words
matter, words on paper matter.

00:20:51.700 --> 00:20:55.990
And that's why I'm arguing
that if we could bolster.

00:20:55.990 --> 00:20:58.360
<v ->I agree with that
addition to that word,</v>

00:20:58.360 --> 00:20:59.260
I just wanna make sure.

00:20:59.260 --> 00:21:01.404
<v ->I was arguing
against myself then.</v>

00:21:01.404 --> 00:21:04.650
(audience laughs)

00:21:04.650 --> 00:21:06.760
<v ->I felt like letting you
go on a little longer,</v>

00:21:06.760 --> 00:21:08.510
but we've got a tight agenda today.

00:21:10.980 --> 00:21:13.010
I just wanna make sure that we don't get

00:21:13.010 --> 00:21:14.733
to the implementation point,

00:21:15.713 --> 00:21:17.330
and there's a back door wide open

00:21:17.330 --> 00:21:21.688
for these reps to sneak those $5,000.

00:21:21.688 --> 00:21:24.370
The chance for a day, I
had procurement at $5,000

00:21:24.370 --> 00:21:29.230
a megawatt hour of ECRS or from fuel.

00:21:29.230 --> 00:21:30.320
And they will.

00:21:30.320 --> 00:21:31.610
They aren't gonna
raise their hand and say,

00:21:31.610 --> 00:21:32.800
hey, y'all forgot it.

00:21:32.800 --> 00:21:34.840
Y'all forgot about the restriction on us

00:21:34.840 --> 00:21:36.530
to not limit our risk.

00:21:36.530 --> 00:21:38.080
Like they'll sneak it in there.

00:21:40.199 --> 00:21:45.050
So, let's adopt the change
that you propose there.

00:21:47.010 --> 00:21:49.150
And I would ask ERCOT

00:21:51.181 --> 00:21:53.131
to ask this Commission to direct ERCOT,

00:21:54.370 --> 00:21:59.140
to provide us with an update on sizing,

00:21:59.140 --> 00:22:03.080
or proposed sizing at
least six months in advance

00:22:03.080 --> 00:22:07.850
of any rollout of a new
ancillary service suite.

00:22:07.850 --> 00:22:08.683
<v ->I would agree with that, sir.</v>

00:22:08.683 --> 00:22:09.516
<v ->And require.</v>

00:22:09.516 --> 00:22:10.349
Does that work for you?

00:22:10.349 --> 00:22:11.182
<v ->Absolutely.</v>

00:22:11.182 --> 00:22:12.287
<v ->Require ERCO</v>

00:22:14.510 --> 00:22:18.250
so that we, the Commission can affirm

00:22:18.250 --> 00:22:21.803
what the appropriate size of
these ancillary services are,

00:22:23.130 --> 00:22:26.900
and have a fixed requirement
that we address that.

00:22:26.900 --> 00:22:31.900
And if need be, open up
this rule again to ensure that

00:22:32.660 --> 00:22:34.773
any new ancillary services are included.

00:22:35.700 --> 00:22:36.533
Does that work?

00:22:37.402 --> 00:22:38.893
<v ->Yes.</v>

00:22:40.360 --> 00:22:41.210
<v ->Commissioners.</v>

00:22:41.210 --> 00:22:42.720
<v ->Yes, Mr. Smelter.</v>

00:22:42.720 --> 00:22:43.553
<v ->Sorry.</v>

00:22:43.553 --> 00:22:45.980
Is we're talking about
implementing that change.

00:22:45.980 --> 00:22:47.550
Staff just wants to clarify.

00:22:47.550 --> 00:22:51.630
So I have a proposed edit here,

00:22:51.630 --> 00:22:55.540
but then also, so if we talk
about how ancillary services

00:22:55.540 --> 00:22:57.770
could vary within the
context of a contract,

00:22:57.770 --> 00:23:00.870
there's existing
ancillary services change

00:23:00.870 --> 00:23:03.450
every minute of every day,
just like the price of energy.

00:23:03.450 --> 00:23:06.100
And so clearly those
have never been something

00:23:06.100 --> 00:23:07.187
that you could pass
through to customers,

00:23:07.187 --> 00:23:09.890
and will continue to not
be under your proposal.

00:23:09.890 --> 00:23:12.800
And then the two new aspects
our reps were talking about

00:23:12.800 --> 00:23:16.170
where if ERCOT decides
to procure a greater amount

00:23:16.170 --> 00:23:18.386
of an existing ancillary service,

00:23:18.386 --> 00:23:20.070
like what happened last summer,

00:23:20.070 --> 00:23:23.690
I would read the modification

00:23:23.690 --> 00:23:26.210
is not allowing them to do
that because that's an existing,

00:23:26.210 --> 00:23:28.305
not allowed to pass that through

00:23:28.305 --> 00:23:29.138
because that's an
existing ancillary service.

00:23:29.138 --> 00:23:31.893
But if there is a new ancillary
service that is created,

00:23:33.000 --> 00:23:35.803
the default is that they
cannot pass that through.

00:23:35.803 --> 00:23:37.470
Is that the intention?

00:23:37.470 --> 00:23:38.628
<v ->No.</v>

00:23:38.628 --> 00:23:42.410
SO the trigger is that
this Commission, I believe,

00:23:42.410 --> 00:23:45.460
wants to ratify every
new ancillary service

00:23:45.460 --> 00:23:46.840
that goes to market.

00:23:46.840 --> 00:23:50.850
Meaning, we are okay
with it, functionally.

00:23:50.850 --> 00:23:54.170
The volumes once
ratified can be adjusted

00:23:54.170 --> 00:23:56.180
on an operational basis,

00:23:56.180 --> 00:23:59.300
depending on the operational
needs of the system.

00:23:59.300 --> 00:24:01.580
We still wanna be
involved in that process,

00:24:01.580 --> 00:24:04.450
but we don't necessarily
wanna get up here and say,

00:24:04.450 --> 00:24:07.520
okay, 3,900 is appropriate.

00:24:07.520 --> 00:24:08.360
All right?

00:24:08.360 --> 00:24:11.850
But in terms of any new products,

00:24:11.850 --> 00:24:13.570
and that's the problem;

00:24:13.570 --> 00:24:16.840
these are new products
that have not gone to market.

00:24:16.840 --> 00:24:20.637
They haven't gone through
the full stakeholder process

00:24:20.637 --> 00:24:23.123
and/or Board recommendation at ERCOT.

00:24:24.040 --> 00:24:26.470
So, I wanna have a say in that.

00:24:26.470 --> 00:24:28.980
I think the rest of the
Commission does as well.

00:24:28.980 --> 00:24:33.033
So the condition is, until we adopt it,

00:24:34.340 --> 00:24:38.180
once adopted, then yes, they
may not be passed through.

00:24:38.180 --> 00:24:41.670
But it's to give certainty to
the consumers in the market,

00:24:41.670 --> 00:24:45.030
that we will have a
proceeding of some type.

00:24:45.030 --> 00:24:46.703
And proceeding is a loaded word.

00:24:47.810 --> 00:24:51.193
A meeting at least to talk
about and set the conditions

00:24:51.193 --> 00:24:54.130
of the ancillary service and ratify it.

00:24:54.130 --> 00:24:56.020
and then it can be passed through.

00:24:56.020 --> 00:24:58.570
So that they know that
we will have a process here.

00:24:59.500 --> 00:25:01.490
Does that make sense, Mr. Smelser?

00:25:01.490 --> 00:25:02.620
<v ->It does make sense.</v>

00:25:02.620 --> 00:25:05.850
I was trying to decide if we
needed additional language

00:25:05.850 --> 00:25:07.810
to allow you guys to discretion,

00:25:07.810 --> 00:25:09.720
to determine on a case by case basis,

00:25:09.720 --> 00:25:11.690
whether or not these
ancillary service costs

00:25:11.690 --> 00:25:13.250
would be passed through for new costs,

00:25:13.250 --> 00:25:15.880
because I think the language
as it stands with the edit

00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:17.980
would be, I don't have
it right in front of me,

00:25:17.980 --> 00:25:20.750
but something like, the prices may vary

00:25:20.750 --> 00:25:23.410
in response to regulatory changes.

00:25:23.410 --> 00:25:24.320
And then the next sentence would be,

00:25:24.320 --> 00:25:27.290
but not for existing ancillary services.

00:25:27.290 --> 00:25:31.150
And so I think that that would
allow them to vary the price,

00:25:31.150 --> 00:25:33.280
or you basically change contracts

00:25:33.280 --> 00:25:36.104
based on new ancillary services.

00:25:36.104 --> 00:25:38.470
And so I was wondering if
we wanted to put in language,

00:25:38.470 --> 00:25:39.970
something that staff could think about

00:25:39.970 --> 00:25:42.793
that said the Commission
will determine whether or not.

00:25:43.780 --> 00:25:45.390
You know what I mean,
that you guys will determine

00:25:45.390 --> 00:25:47.064
at the time of a new ancillary service.

00:25:47.064 --> 00:25:47.897
<v ->I do.</v>

00:25:47.897 --> 00:25:49.576
I know you're trying to
over-lawyer it, but okay.

00:25:49.576 --> 00:25:52.409
(audience laughs)

00:25:54.260 --> 00:25:55.980
<v ->I just wanna make sure
that you still have the discretion</v>

00:25:55.980 --> 00:25:59.780
that you think you want later,
if that's what you want that.

00:25:59.780 --> 00:26:04.780
<v ->I think perhaps we
want to specify the date</v>

00:26:05.230 --> 00:26:07.230
the existing refers to.

00:26:07.230 --> 00:26:10.620
So if we put in
language, something like,

00:26:10.620 --> 00:26:12.270
existing ancillary services

00:26:12.270 --> 00:26:14.980
as of the contract enrollment date.

00:26:14.980 --> 00:26:19.980
Because as the rule persists
over the next few years,

00:26:20.570 --> 00:26:23.450
different ancillary
services will be "existing."

00:26:23.450 --> 00:26:27.730
<v ->So, in my understanding
of the way this all works out,</v>

00:26:27.730 --> 00:26:30.450
on the other side is, once
this rule goes into effect,

00:26:30.450 --> 00:26:33.130
once we've adopted
it, it has the force of law.

00:26:33.130 --> 00:26:35.930
So everything predating this

00:26:35.930 --> 00:26:38.340
is an existing ancillary service,

00:26:38.340 --> 00:26:41.060
unless we have adopted
something in the future.

00:26:41.060 --> 00:26:42.520
And that's why I'm
trying to create something

00:26:42.520 --> 00:26:45.550
that gives us flexibility
to re-look at these things

00:26:45.550 --> 00:26:47.970
on a case by case basis moving forward.

00:26:47.970 --> 00:26:50.100
So I don't know if we
need the date in there.

00:26:50.100 --> 00:26:52.630
<v ->Well, I that might kill
two birds with one stone,</v>

00:26:52.630 --> 00:26:55.360
in that even if you
do a two year contract,

00:26:55.360 --> 00:26:56.513
fixed contract now,

00:26:57.420 --> 00:27:00.503
in 24 months, in month 23,

00:27:01.431 --> 00:27:03.340
a new ancillary service comes out,

00:27:03.340 --> 00:27:08.340
that's for that month under
her framework would not be...

00:27:09.210 --> 00:27:12.910
That would not be considered
an existing ancillary service.

00:27:12.910 --> 00:27:14.820
And so for that one month,

00:27:14.820 --> 00:27:17.360
those charges could be passed through.

00:27:17.360 --> 00:27:19.350
But as soon as that 24 month rolls out,

00:27:19.350 --> 00:27:20.830
correct me if I'm wrong, Connie,

00:27:20.830 --> 00:27:23.630
as soon as you get to month
24, and it's a new contract,

00:27:24.530 --> 00:27:28.140
now that is part of the
existing ancillary service.

00:27:28.140 --> 00:27:29.327
<v ->Yeah, I understand.</v>

00:27:29.327 --> 00:27:30.960
And also the other approach

00:27:30.960 --> 00:27:33.160
is to leave this Commission flexibility

00:27:33.160 --> 00:27:35.450
to where we can try to move,

00:27:35.450 --> 00:27:38.200
depending on how large
these ancillary services are,

00:27:38.200 --> 00:27:42.750
to adopt a plan that we
can promulgated to retailers

00:27:42.750 --> 00:27:45.560
that allows them to start
passing through some costs.

00:27:45.560 --> 00:27:47.550
Otherwise you kill
the entire retail market.

00:27:47.550 --> 00:27:49.033
And that is not my intention.

00:27:49.880 --> 00:27:50.930
<v ->I think that that was my point.</v>

00:27:50.930 --> 00:27:52.830
That if you wanna preserve the ability

00:27:53.731 --> 00:27:54.564
to make decisions on
a case by case basis,

00:27:54.564 --> 00:27:55.870
I think you need one
more sentence in there.

00:27:55.870 --> 00:27:57.730
And I don't wanna
just draft it off the cuff.

00:27:57.730 --> 00:28:00.690
But I think that the way that
I interpret yours would be,

00:28:00.690 --> 00:28:02.350
you can't change based on existing,

00:28:02.350 --> 00:28:03.910
but if there's a new
ancillary service reps,

00:28:03.910 --> 00:28:05.737
can change the contract based on that,

00:28:05.737 --> 00:28:08.200
because that would
be a regulatory change.

00:28:08.200 --> 00:28:10.640
And so if we want to allow
the Commission discretion

00:28:10.640 --> 00:28:13.880
to determine when it
implements a regulatory change,

00:28:13.880 --> 00:28:16.180
whether or not that
can be passed through,

00:28:16.180 --> 00:28:19.913
I think staff can caucus a
solution for you to do that.

00:28:20.950 --> 00:28:22.590
<v ->We have to strike
a balance though,</v>

00:28:22.590 --> 00:28:26.510
because it's the whole
idea of going forward

00:28:26.510 --> 00:28:29.120
that we're taking regulatory action

00:28:29.120 --> 00:28:31.410
and all the new reliability
service and products

00:28:31.410 --> 00:28:32.900
that we'll have in the future.

00:28:32.900 --> 00:28:35.281
And we've got to strike
a balance between

00:28:35.281 --> 00:28:37.750
providing all that
transparency and visibility

00:28:37.750 --> 00:28:40.070
to the retail market so
they can plan going forward

00:28:40.070 --> 00:28:41.010
and hedge going forward.

00:28:41.010 --> 00:28:42.700
That that is their business model;

00:28:42.700 --> 00:28:45.543
is to plan for the future and hedge.

00:28:47.080 --> 00:28:49.610
And we wanna give them transparency,

00:28:49.610 --> 00:28:50.860
not only through the reliability

00:28:50.860 --> 00:28:51.900
and ancillary service products

00:28:51.900 --> 00:28:54.700
that we'll be putting
to market for the future,

00:28:54.700 --> 00:28:56.440
but also through ERCOT approval

00:28:56.440 --> 00:28:57.720
of ancillary service charges,

00:28:57.720 --> 00:29:00.940
minimum ancillary service
charges every year in December.

00:29:00.940 --> 00:29:03.650
We wanna give as much
transparency as we possibly can,

00:29:03.650 --> 00:29:04.870
but we have to thread the needle

00:29:04.870 --> 00:29:07.550
in that we don't want
these fixed rate products

00:29:07.550 --> 00:29:10.670
to be continuously
changed in the future,

00:29:10.670 --> 00:29:13.940
to the point where we have volatility,

00:29:13.940 --> 00:29:18.270
and it turns into long-range
variable products.

00:29:18.270 --> 00:29:21.340
So, does your language
that you have proposed

00:29:21.340 --> 00:29:23.790
strike that balance in your mind,

00:29:23.790 --> 00:29:25.130
or that Connie has proposed?

00:29:25.130 --> 00:29:26.950
<v ->Well, also remember
the ancillary services</v>

00:29:26.950 --> 00:29:30.913
are a small, small portion of
the total energy reps provide.

00:29:33.017 --> 00:29:38.017
<v ->But I would assert that
in other markets that...</v>

00:29:38.100 --> 00:29:39.340
And the direction that we're going,

00:29:39.340 --> 00:29:41.120
they could exponentially increase

00:29:41.120 --> 00:29:42.757
in terms of the overall price of power

00:29:42.757 --> 00:29:44.620
that consumers experience.

00:29:44.620 --> 00:29:46.780
And as we try to manage
through that variable

00:29:46.780 --> 00:29:49.690
versus dispatchable and comport with SB3

00:29:49.690 --> 00:29:53.343
and section 18, that it's a big deal.

00:29:54.380 --> 00:29:57.800
So I get what you're saying.

00:29:57.800 --> 00:29:58.633
I wanna make sure

00:29:58.633 --> 00:30:00.650
the Commissioners
are flying the plane here.

00:30:00.650 --> 00:30:05.170
And I still assert that one word change

00:30:06.610 --> 00:30:09.060
contingent on the adoption of this rule

00:30:09.060 --> 00:30:11.173
allows us maximum flexibility.

00:30:13.128 --> 00:30:18.128
<v ->Chairman, might I suggest
that you table this momentarily</v>

00:30:19.860 --> 00:30:21.990
with a thought of
bringing it back after lunch,

00:30:21.990 --> 00:30:26.010
to give some thought here
to crafting some language

00:30:26.010 --> 00:30:29.480
to better fine-tune this process.

00:30:29.480 --> 00:30:30.720
<v ->That works for me.</v>

00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:32.090
<v ->And it may be that the
one where it's enough,</v>

00:30:32.090 --> 00:30:35.080
it's just like thinking about
it in a nonpublic forum

00:30:35.080 --> 00:30:37.930
for a second would be helpful
to make sure, I'm thinking.

00:30:40.662 --> 00:30:42.103
<v ->Well, I got an
over-lawyer idea too</v>

00:30:42.103 --> 00:30:44.303
that I don't wanna put
out in public without

00:30:45.946 --> 00:30:48.980
first talking to someone
that knows what this is.

00:30:48.980 --> 00:30:50.450
<v ->But I think we understand
where you're going.</v>

00:30:50.450 --> 00:30:53.570
So we can bring back
either a staff ratification

00:30:53.570 --> 00:30:54.870
of what you just said, if you'd like,

00:30:54.870 --> 00:30:56.670
or if we think that
there might be a tweak

00:30:56.670 --> 00:30:58.180
that gets you where you wanna go better,

00:30:58.180 --> 00:30:59.470
we can try and think that through.

00:30:59.470 --> 00:31:03.210
<v ->And importantly, agree
with the word and in principle.</v>

00:31:03.210 --> 00:31:05.640
I'm just trying to make
sure we close the back door

00:31:06.683 --> 00:31:08.223
as the second part of it.

00:31:10.083 --> 00:31:15.083
All right, we'll table item
22 until after our lunch break.

00:31:15.140 --> 00:31:17.833
Next up will be item 25.

00:31:20.100 --> 00:31:21.190
Mr. Smelser.

00:31:21.190 --> 00:31:22.760
<v ->Commissioners, it's
instrumental in helping us</v>

00:31:22.760 --> 00:31:24.610
get through customer
protection real quickly

00:31:24.610 --> 00:31:26.780
was a lot of weekend work
done by Mariah Benson,

00:31:26.780 --> 00:31:29.680
who will also be presenting
the power outage alert to you.

00:31:31.668 --> 00:31:33.563
<v ->Item 25, is project 52287,</v>

00:31:34.740 --> 00:31:36.840
power outage alert criteria.

00:31:36.840 --> 00:31:38.290
Commission staff's filed a memo

00:31:38.290 --> 00:31:40.083
with a proposal for publication.

00:31:42.930 --> 00:31:43.930
<v ->Good morning, Commissioners.</v>

00:31:43.930 --> 00:31:44.900
I'm Mariah Vinson.

00:31:44.900 --> 00:31:47.430
This is McKinsey Muniez
with Commission staff.

00:31:47.430 --> 00:31:51.870
So this rule implement
section one of SB three.

00:31:51.870 --> 00:31:53.450
And it was specifically directed

00:31:53.450 --> 00:31:55.373
to the department of public safety,

00:31:57.896 --> 00:31:59.710
with conjunction of the
public utility Commission

00:31:59.710 --> 00:32:01.140
and other Commissions to work together

00:32:01.140 --> 00:32:04.053
to come up with a power
outage alert system.

00:32:04.890 --> 00:32:08.123
Our specific directive was
to come up with the criteria.

00:32:09.720 --> 00:32:10.553
Yes.

00:32:11.670 --> 00:32:14.630
Our specific direction was
to come up with the criteria

00:32:14.630 --> 00:32:18.140
for issuing the alert and
the content of the alert.

00:32:18.140 --> 00:32:20.570
And then DPS will have the potential

00:32:20.570 --> 00:32:23.250
to issue an Amber style alert

00:32:23.250 --> 00:32:26.169
when we recommend issuance of it.

00:32:26.169 --> 00:32:29.593
Through this, the SB three required

00:32:29.593 --> 00:32:31.240
that the power alert system

00:32:31.240 --> 00:32:34.700
be able to be issued
system-wide or regionally.

00:32:34.700 --> 00:32:38.530
We have allowed that to
happen through either ERCOT

00:32:38.530 --> 00:32:39.870
or the other regions,

00:32:39.870 --> 00:32:42.763
or throughout the
entire state, if necessary.

00:32:44.040 --> 00:32:45.680
Through ERCOT, there is the potential

00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:46.890
that the alert be issued

00:32:46.890 --> 00:32:50.870
up to 48 hours in advance or real-time.

00:32:50.870 --> 00:32:53.740
And ultimately this rule
creates a notification trigger

00:32:53.740 --> 00:32:57.560
for ERCOT or the
transmission service providers

00:32:57.560 --> 00:33:00.270
who are TO's outside of ERCOT

00:33:00.270 --> 00:33:03.452
who receive instructions
from the reliability coordinator,

00:33:03.452 --> 00:33:05.860
who then need to alert us

00:33:05.860 --> 00:33:07.900
when they receive those instructions.

00:33:07.900 --> 00:33:09.650
After we receive those instructions,

00:33:09.650 --> 00:33:12.963
then we have the power to
recommend issuance of the alert.

00:33:15.231 --> 00:33:18.090
If you guys have any questions,
we're happy to answer them.

00:33:18.090 --> 00:33:22.260
<v ->Another major, major
improvement to grid operations</v>

00:33:22.260 --> 00:33:25.760
and public safety as a
result of recent legislation.

00:33:25.760 --> 00:33:28.810
Questions, comments,
or a motion to approve

00:33:28.810 --> 00:33:30.930
the proposal for publication?

00:33:30.930 --> 00:33:31.763
<v ->So moved.</v>

00:33:31.763 --> 00:33:32.596
<v ->Second.</v>

00:33:32.596 --> 00:33:33.885
<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

00:33:33.885 --> 00:33:34.860
<v ->Aye.</v>

00:33:34.860 --> 00:33:36.950
<v ->None-opposed, motion passes.</v>

00:33:36.950 --> 00:33:37.950
Thank you ladies.

00:33:37.950 --> 00:33:39.810
And appreciate all
of the hard work on it.

00:33:39.810 --> 00:33:41.910
That's been a lot of
weekends around here.

00:33:44.250 --> 00:33:46.883
That will move us back
to the top of our agenda.

00:33:49.570 --> 00:33:53.410
We'll get as much done as
we can in the next 22 minutes.

00:33:56.074 --> 00:33:56.907
All right.

00:34:04.050 --> 00:34:05.453
Item seven, I believe.

00:34:06.625 --> 00:34:07.458
All right, Mr. Jenae.

00:34:10.380 --> 00:34:12.800
<v ->Item seven, stock at 51023.</v>

00:34:12.800 --> 00:34:14.970
It's the application that
the city of San Antonio

00:34:14.970 --> 00:34:17.720
for a CC and amendment
or a transmission line

00:34:17.720 --> 00:34:19.133
in Berwick County.

00:34:22.200 --> 00:34:25.493
A proposal for decision was filed on.

00:34:31.830 --> 00:34:34.200
Previously the
Commission had considered,

00:34:34.200 --> 00:34:35.670
we sent this back.

00:34:35.670 --> 00:34:38.370
I believe we were
concerted at the October

00:34:38.370 --> 00:34:40.090
and November open meetings.

00:34:40.090 --> 00:34:41.700
Send it back for additional information.

00:34:41.700 --> 00:34:43.640
That information has been provided.

00:34:43.640 --> 00:34:48.640
So I believe the PFDs in
front of you for final action.

00:34:50.300 --> 00:34:51.740
<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

00:34:51.740 --> 00:34:55.692
As of y'all are well
aware decisions like this

00:34:55.692 --> 00:34:59.290
are serious and substantial,
and are not taken lightly here.

00:34:59.290 --> 00:35:03.030
That's why we had so
much public comment over

00:35:03.030 --> 00:35:08.030
and much public input
over multiple months.

00:35:08.290 --> 00:35:10.023
At the end of the day,

00:35:10.940 --> 00:35:11.773
I think,

00:35:13.215 --> 00:35:17.450
the bottom line is the
shortest and cheapest

00:35:17.450 --> 00:35:20.343
using the most existing
right away is z two.

00:35:21.200 --> 00:35:25.010
And in an imperfect world

00:35:25.010 --> 00:35:27.220
where none of these choices are easy.

00:35:27.220 --> 00:35:31.763
I would say Z two the least bad option.

00:35:33.430 --> 00:35:36.950
Open to thoughts, comments, questions.

00:35:36.950 --> 00:35:38.730
<v ->Mr. Chairman,
I'm sorry to interrupt,</v>

00:35:38.730 --> 00:35:40.227
but I've failed to mention

00:35:42.500 --> 00:35:45.980
that Commissioner McAdams
has a memo on this matter,

00:35:45.980 --> 00:35:48.370
and that I also have a
memo with proposed changes

00:35:48.370 --> 00:35:49.203
to the PFD.

00:35:50.416 --> 00:35:51.566
<v ->Commissioner McAdams.</v>

00:35:53.000 --> 00:35:54.483
<v ->No, I appreciate it, sir.</v>

00:36:00.010 --> 00:36:03.310
The way I feel about this item

00:36:03.310 --> 00:36:06.770
is I believe as you assert Mr. Chairman,

00:36:06.770 --> 00:36:10.593
that the route Z two is
the most appropriate route.

00:36:11.926 --> 00:36:15.040
I believe that in terms
of the cost benefit

00:36:15.040 --> 00:36:18.494
incurred the number
of dwellings impacted

00:36:18.494 --> 00:36:23.320
the overall aspects
brought to bear in the case

00:36:23.320 --> 00:36:27.210
that Z two is just appropriate.

00:36:27.210 --> 00:36:30.860
I also believe that the
SOA ALJs were incorrect

00:36:30.860 --> 00:36:33.800
in their analysis of community values

00:36:33.800 --> 00:36:35.810
with respect to the
impact to residences.

00:36:35.810 --> 00:36:37.360
And I wanted to highlight that.

00:36:38.270 --> 00:36:39.800
In my view, bisecting property,

00:36:39.800 --> 00:36:42.560
and particularly bisecting
undeveloped property

00:36:42.560 --> 00:36:47.310
has nothing to do with an
impact to residences analysis.

00:36:47.310 --> 00:36:51.540
And was therefore improperly
considered by the ALJs

00:36:51.540 --> 00:36:53.630
in terms of stated community values.

00:36:53.630 --> 00:36:55.150
The overriding consideration here

00:36:55.150 --> 00:36:58.436
of the impact of residences
is not in the proceeding,

00:36:58.436 --> 00:37:01.500
is the number of habitable
structures affected.

00:37:01.500 --> 00:37:03.373
I.e. prudent avoidance test.

00:37:04.400 --> 00:37:06.300
Any analysis of impact to residences

00:37:06.300 --> 00:37:07.580
should focus on that factor.

00:37:07.580 --> 00:37:09.500
And I believe we're governed by that.

00:37:10.376 --> 00:37:11.540
That not cutting through neighborhoods

00:37:11.540 --> 00:37:13.970
and not bisecting undeveloped property

00:37:13.970 --> 00:37:16.140
are still valid considerations

00:37:16.140 --> 00:37:18.210
in terms of aesthetics
and environmental integrity.

00:37:18.210 --> 00:37:20.631
However, they should not be a part

00:37:20.631 --> 00:37:23.223
of the impact of residences analysis.

00:37:24.120 --> 00:37:29.120
If the Commission, as we, at
least two of us have supported,

00:37:29.330 --> 00:37:32.240
select route Z2, we should clarify

00:37:32.240 --> 00:37:35.530
that although route Z2 has
more habitable structures

00:37:35.530 --> 00:37:37.779
within 300 feet of its center line

00:37:37.779 --> 00:37:40.060
than some other routes,

00:37:40.060 --> 00:37:42.670
I believe it is still
unbalanced the route

00:37:42.670 --> 00:37:44.700
that best addresses
all the factors in PURA

00:37:44.700 --> 00:37:45.973
and the Commission rules.

00:37:47.314 --> 00:37:52.314
And I know you have thoughts
on recreational and park areas.

00:37:52.340 --> 00:37:54.100
So the last time you expressed that,

00:37:54.100 --> 00:37:56.150
I support your views on that.

00:37:56.150 --> 00:38:00.920
So I think the ALJs on
the whole were on point,

00:38:00.920 --> 00:38:02.340
it's just we need to smooth out

00:38:02.340 --> 00:38:04.390
some of the edges to this case.

00:38:04.390 --> 00:38:07.913
So as not to have unintended
consequences on precedent.

00:38:09.110 --> 00:38:11.470
<v ->Well put, and I
not only support</v>

00:38:11.470 --> 00:38:12.460
everything you just said there,

00:38:12.460 --> 00:38:16.090
but like to emphasize one word,
which was undeveloped land.

00:38:16.090 --> 00:38:17.040
<v ->Yes, sir.</v>

00:38:17.040 --> 00:38:20.160
<v ->And folks trying to pretend
like sending a power line</v>

00:38:20.160 --> 00:38:24.050
through undeveloped
future investment property

00:38:24.050 --> 00:38:26.160
is the same as going through
a middle of the neighborhood

00:38:26.160 --> 00:38:28.850
is not something I think
this Commission agrees with.

00:38:28.850 --> 00:38:33.850
That's a mis-characterization
in a dramatic fashion.

00:38:35.039 --> 00:38:37.822
And as you said,

00:38:37.822 --> 00:38:40.830
my previously stated
thoughts on recreational areas

00:38:42.158 --> 00:38:45.830
are that if they're gonna
be recreational for the public,

00:38:45.830 --> 00:38:46.750
they better be public.

00:38:46.750 --> 00:38:50.160
It's not a private... &lt;v
-&gt;Open to the public.</v>

00:38:50.160 --> 00:38:51.034
<v ->Open to the public.</v>

00:38:51.034 --> 00:38:55.150
It's not a private retreat.

00:38:55.150 --> 00:38:56.000
That doesn't count.

00:38:56.000 --> 00:38:57.560
Private hunting club
has gotta be public.

00:38:57.560 --> 00:39:00.360
It's public, it's gotta
be open to the public.

00:39:00.360 --> 00:39:01.470
Thoughts, comments?

00:39:01.470 --> 00:39:04.400
<v ->Yeah, I appreciate the
work that has gone into this.</v>

00:39:04.400 --> 00:39:09.000
I am in agreement that
Z two is the best route.

00:39:09.000 --> 00:39:11.910
Transmission lines are
never, ever easy to site,

00:39:11.910 --> 00:39:13.400
we know that.

00:39:13.400 --> 00:39:17.860
They impact somebody
all the time, fairly or unfairly.

00:39:17.860 --> 00:39:20.530
But they're the fabric of
how we provide electricity

00:39:20.530 --> 00:39:21.570
across our neighborhoods.

00:39:21.570 --> 00:39:24.330
And this area is
growing very dramatically.

00:39:24.330 --> 00:39:26.874
I grew up in San Antonio,
and watching this area grow,

00:39:26.874 --> 00:39:30.853
we never thought it
would grow this fast.

00:39:31.700 --> 00:39:33.200
I think Z two is the right route

00:39:33.200 --> 00:39:35.810
because it does parallel a
lot of existing right of way.

00:39:35.810 --> 00:39:40.300
I'm worried about on the
undeveloped property component.

00:39:40.300 --> 00:39:43.360
There are numerous threatened
and endangered species

00:39:43.360 --> 00:39:44.987
in the area.

00:39:44.987 --> 00:39:46.227
And I feel that if we cited in some area

00:39:46.227 --> 00:39:47.176
that it might affect them,

00:39:47.176 --> 00:39:50.470
we might get bogged down
and litigation that might solve,

00:39:50.470 --> 00:39:52.620
which might create
an even bigger problem

00:39:52.620 --> 00:39:54.230
that would solve a reliability problem.

00:39:54.230 --> 00:39:55.660
And I don't think
that's good for the area.

00:39:55.660 --> 00:39:57.550
So I think we need to
do which expeditious

00:39:57.550 --> 00:39:59.750
and ride parallel existing rights of way

00:40:00.620 --> 00:40:03.473
and get the city on with
doing this for their consumers.

00:40:04.750 --> 00:40:06.256
<v ->All right, I agree
with everything</v>

00:40:06.256 --> 00:40:08.630
that all of y'all had just said.

00:40:08.630 --> 00:40:11.270
I think this transmission line is needed

00:40:11.270 --> 00:40:13.770
for liability in the San Antonio area.

00:40:13.770 --> 00:40:17.320
We must balance
consumer costs and reliability.

00:40:17.320 --> 00:40:20.580
And I think route Z two
strikes that appropriate balance.

00:40:20.580 --> 00:40:22.590
I agree that the SOLJ's earned

00:40:22.590 --> 00:40:24.120
and their analysis of
the community values

00:40:24.120 --> 00:40:25.190
and recreational parks,

00:40:25.190 --> 00:40:28.050
and agree with your additional emphasis

00:40:28.050 --> 00:40:31.070
on the recreational
parks having to be public

00:40:31.070 --> 00:40:33.440
and community values and with respect

00:40:33.440 --> 00:40:34.790
to undeveloped land versus land,

00:40:34.790 --> 00:40:37.130
where actually people live on the land.

00:40:37.130 --> 00:40:42.130
So I would move to adopt
the PFD with the changes

00:40:43.590 --> 00:40:46.513
that Commissioner McAdams
has laid out in his memo.

00:40:48.308 --> 00:40:49.150
<v ->I'm sorry to interrupt again.</v>

00:40:49.150 --> 00:40:52.220
I've made a mistake awhile
ago because some of these items

00:40:52.220 --> 00:40:53.790
have the wrong number on them.

00:40:54.698 --> 00:40:56.237
(indistinct)

00:40:56.237 --> 00:40:57.380
<v ->Don't worry, that's
why I didn't allude to it.</v>

00:40:57.380 --> 00:40:58.310
Don't worry.

00:40:58.310 --> 00:41:00.010
<v ->But I do have a
memo in this one.</v>

00:41:00.010 --> 00:41:01.510
<v ->I got a memo on another one.</v>

00:41:03.640 --> 00:41:05.510
<v ->Pretty sure I read
all your memos.</v>

00:41:05.510 --> 00:41:06.343
<v ->Me too.</v>

00:41:08.090 --> 00:41:10.165
<v ->All right, I think we have a...</v>

00:41:10.165 --> 00:41:12.620
<v ->This is what happens
when you're first talking</v>

00:41:12.620 --> 00:41:13.807
to these people.

00:41:13.807 --> 00:41:15.593
You get volunteered for these things.

00:41:15.593 --> 00:41:18.810
But I'll appreciate Steven
keeping me on point.

00:41:18.810 --> 00:41:21.227
(indistinct)

00:41:24.027 --> 00:41:26.320
<v ->We have a motion
from Commissioner Cobos</v>

00:41:26.320 --> 00:41:29.200
to adopt the proposal for
decision approving route Z two,

00:41:29.200 --> 00:41:32.380
as modified by Commission
council, I believe.

00:41:32.380 --> 00:41:35.980
Council's December 15th
memo with the modifications.

00:41:35.980 --> 00:41:38.085
I'm trying to get it right.

00:41:38.085 --> 00:41:43.085
To reflect both the
concept that's for spaces

00:41:43.140 --> 00:41:45.650
to be considered recreational
areas for routing purposes,

00:41:45.650 --> 00:41:47.960
they need to be open to the public.

00:41:47.960 --> 00:41:51.190
And that the impact to
residents should focus

00:41:51.190 --> 00:41:53.500
on habitable structures
rather than bisecting property.

00:41:53.500 --> 00:41:54.830
Did I get it right, Commissioner Cobos?

00:41:54.830 --> 00:41:56.278
<v ->Yes, you did, thank you.</v>

00:41:56.278 --> 00:41:57.244
<v ->Is there a second?</v>

00:41:57.244 --> 00:41:58.077
<v ->Second.</v>

00:41:58.077 --> 00:41:59.480
<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

00:41:59.480 --> 00:42:00.560
<v ->Aye.</v>

00:42:00.560 --> 00:42:01.453
<v ->None opposed.</v>

00:42:03.128 --> 00:42:04.211
<v ->Sorry, nay.</v>

00:42:06.082 --> 00:42:07.006
<v ->Unanimous.</v>

00:42:07.006 --> 00:42:10.734
<v ->Unanimous, none-opposed,
the motion passes.</v>

00:42:10.734 --> 00:42:12.200
Thank you all for all the work on this.

00:42:12.200 --> 00:42:14.220
Thank you, Mr. Cobos

00:42:15.593 --> 00:42:16.973
for putting that together for us.

00:42:18.343 --> 00:42:22.163
Next up is item number nine, I believe.

00:42:24.460 --> 00:42:27.700
Before you lay that out, I
will also extend our thanks

00:42:27.700 --> 00:42:29.104
to the city.

00:42:29.104 --> 00:42:32.000
This Commission has asked
above and beyond amount.

00:42:32.000 --> 00:42:34.930
We have expanded, I
think, due to early leadership

00:42:34.930 --> 00:42:36.640
from Commissioner McAdams,

00:42:36.640 --> 00:42:38.770
asked for increased
amount of information

00:42:38.770 --> 00:42:43.770
and validation of a routing
load drove justification,

00:42:44.210 --> 00:42:46.440
which is new for this Commission,

00:42:46.440 --> 00:42:51.440
a new measure of depth of analysis.

00:42:51.500 --> 00:42:52.550
So thank you for that,

00:42:52.550 --> 00:42:54.810
and thank you for the
city for providing that

00:42:54.810 --> 00:42:57.560
and going through the various steps.

00:42:57.560 --> 00:42:58.400
Appreciate that.

00:42:58.400 --> 00:42:59.233
<v ->Thanks, Sir.</v>

00:43:00.210 --> 00:43:02.480
<v ->All right, next item, please.</v>

00:43:02.480 --> 00:43:05.440
<v ->Item nine is docket 52081.</v>

00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:07.440
Is the application that El Paso electric

00:43:07.440 --> 00:43:08.833
to adjust its ECRF.

00:43:10.073 --> 00:43:13.090
A proposal for decision
was issued in November.

00:43:13.090 --> 00:43:15.041
Exceptions replies were filed.

00:43:15.041 --> 00:43:18.483
ALJ filed a memo
recommending no changes.

00:43:19.600 --> 00:43:22.843
Commissioner McAdams
has a memo in this item.

00:43:23.930 --> 00:43:24.805
<v Peter>Are you sure?</v>

00:43:24.805 --> 00:43:25.638
<v ->I did.</v>

00:43:25.638 --> 00:43:26.572
<v ->Yes, sir.</v>

00:43:26.572 --> 00:43:28.280
That's the one that
is numbered correctly.

00:43:28.280 --> 00:43:29.899
<v ->Make sure McAdams.</v>

00:43:29.899 --> 00:43:31.223
<v ->Thank you, Mr. Chairman.</v>

00:43:32.110 --> 00:43:34.150
And I'll just recap
what was in the memo.

00:43:34.150 --> 00:43:35.700
But originally in this application,

00:43:35.700 --> 00:43:38.070
El Paso asked for good cause exception

00:43:38.070 --> 00:43:41.866
to combine its cotton gin
and cogeneration rate classes

00:43:41.866 --> 00:43:43.660
throughout the proceeding.

00:43:43.660 --> 00:43:46.380
And in the proposal for decision,

00:43:46.380 --> 00:43:50.050
it appears that the issue
was largely dropped.

00:43:50.050 --> 00:43:50.883
Now,

00:43:51.790 --> 00:43:54.311
however, the proposed
tariff rider schedule

00:43:54.311 --> 00:43:57.030
still shows a combination
of the cotton gin

00:43:57.030 --> 00:43:59.050
and co-generation raid classes.

00:43:59.050 --> 00:44:01.573
So consistent with the request for,

00:44:01.573 --> 00:44:06.573
I would propose that consistent
with these two documents,

00:44:08.570 --> 00:44:10.940
we grant the request
for good cause exception

00:44:11.897 --> 00:44:14.083
on the two rate classes.

00:44:15.220 --> 00:44:16.518
<v ->Agreed,</v>

00:44:16.518 --> 00:44:17.768
and good catch.

00:44:20.280 --> 00:44:22.770
<v ->No, I appreciate
the staff's help on that.</v>

00:44:22.770 --> 00:44:27.080
<v ->Any other thoughts,
comments on this item,</v>

00:44:27.080 --> 00:44:30.580
or perhaps a motion to
adopt the proposal for decision

00:44:30.580 --> 00:44:32.870
as by Commissioner McAdams memo?

00:44:32.870 --> 00:44:33.810
<v ->I move.</v>

00:44:33.810 --> 00:44:35.020
<v ->Second.</v>

00:44:35.020 --> 00:44:36.080
<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

00:44:36.080 --> 00:44:37.390
<v ->Aye.</v>

00:44:37.390 --> 00:44:39.533
<v ->None-opposed,
the motion passes.</v>

00:44:41.978 --> 00:44:45.370
I believe that brings us to item 16,

00:44:47.120 --> 00:44:49.023
docket number 52485.

00:44:52.028 --> 00:44:53.780
<v ->Item 16 is docket 52485.</v>

00:44:53.780 --> 00:44:56.810
It's application SPS to amend at CCN

00:44:56.810 --> 00:44:59.080
to convert the Harrington
generation station

00:44:59.080 --> 00:45:01.040
from coal to natural gas.

00:45:01.040 --> 00:45:03.670
A draft preliminary order
was filed on December 10th.

00:45:03.670 --> 00:45:07.330
Commissioner Cobos
has a memo on his own.

00:45:08.430 --> 00:45:09.330
<v ->I know she does.</v>

00:45:10.499 --> 00:45:13.450
<v ->I didn't get her out
of winter, I apologize.</v>

00:45:13.450 --> 00:45:14.570
<v ->Okay.</v>

00:45:14.570 --> 00:45:15.710
Yes.

00:45:15.710 --> 00:45:16.966
All right.

00:45:16.966 --> 00:45:18.420
Thanks staff for developing
a drop liberatory order

00:45:18.420 --> 00:45:20.490
that covers an extensive list of issues

00:45:20.490 --> 00:45:23.090
that must be addressed in this case.

00:45:23.090 --> 00:45:24.960
This is a case of first impression.

00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:27.640
SPS, a company up in the Amarillo area

00:45:27.640 --> 00:45:32.640
is looking to convert three
coal steam turbine units

00:45:33.260 --> 00:45:36.200
from coal to gas,

00:45:36.200 --> 00:45:38.760
and also build a new gas pipeline

00:45:38.760 --> 00:45:41.350
that extends about 20 to 22 miles

00:45:41.350 --> 00:45:44.123
to supply gas to this converted plant.

00:45:45.240 --> 00:45:48.861
There are substantial
costs involved in this project

00:45:48.861 --> 00:45:50.580
up to 75 million,

00:45:50.580 --> 00:45:54.410
which about more than two
thirds of majority of the costs

00:45:54.410 --> 00:45:56.730
are costs for the new
natural gas pipeline.

00:45:56.730 --> 00:46:00.373
And the issues that I've
inserted into the preliminary order

00:46:00.373 --> 00:46:02.220
that I've recommended to be inserted

00:46:02.220 --> 00:46:05.500
into the preliminary order
are just additional issues

00:46:05.500 --> 00:46:07.440
that I think must be addressed,

00:46:07.440 --> 00:46:11.050
to ensure that the company
evaluated all alternatives

00:46:12.710 --> 00:46:13.720
to supplying gas.

00:46:13.720 --> 00:46:17.270
And that is, you know, because
of the cost of this project,

00:46:17.270 --> 00:46:21.790
whether they evaluated
building new generation facilities

00:46:21.790 --> 00:46:24.500
that the coal plants
were built in about 1976.

00:46:24.500 --> 00:46:27.040
So that's 45 years of facilities

00:46:27.040 --> 00:46:28.950
that they're converting to gas.

00:46:28.950 --> 00:46:31.260
So ensuring they've at least reviewed

00:46:31.260 --> 00:46:35.233
and the construction of
new generation facilities,

00:46:35.233 --> 00:46:36.840
instead of converting the plant,

00:46:36.840 --> 00:46:40.140
given the costs that are
associated with this project.

00:46:40.140 --> 00:46:44.060
And then also that they have evaluated

00:46:44.060 --> 00:46:46.030
entering into fuel supply,

00:46:46.030 --> 00:46:48.120
and from fuel supply arrangements

00:46:48.120 --> 00:46:50.830
or from fuel transportation contracts,

00:46:50.830 --> 00:46:53.890
instead of building a new gas pipeline

00:46:53.890 --> 00:46:56.920
that does have substantial
costs associated with.

00:46:56.920 --> 00:46:59.870
So in general, again, just
ensuring that the company

00:46:59.870 --> 00:47:02.398
has looked at all alternatives

00:47:02.398 --> 00:47:06.270
that is part of their due diligence

00:47:06.270 --> 00:47:08.050
as they propose this project forward.

00:47:08.050 --> 00:47:11.324
So the three items,

00:47:11.324 --> 00:47:13.210
additional issues
that I've inserted there

00:47:13.210 --> 00:47:15.840
are driven with that goal in mind.

00:47:15.840 --> 00:47:18.910
The other item that's not
captured in my preliminary order

00:47:18.910 --> 00:47:21.330
that I want to just set forth

00:47:21.330 --> 00:47:23.240
where we will be setting precedent

00:47:23.240 --> 00:47:26.240
on our ruling on this
case going forward,

00:47:26.240 --> 00:47:30.640
is that the company
did all of the land owners

00:47:30.640 --> 00:47:33.390
that are located within
500 feet of the center line

00:47:33.390 --> 00:47:34.940
of the gas pipeline.

00:47:34.940 --> 00:47:36.660
Other utilities that may come in

00:47:36.660 --> 00:47:38.713
with this similar concept,

00:47:40.023 --> 00:47:41.100
depending on how our ruling goes,

00:47:41.100 --> 00:47:44.100
should know that we expect landowners

00:47:44.100 --> 00:47:47.430
that are within close
proximity within 500 feet

00:47:47.430 --> 00:47:49.653
of a new gas pipeline to be noticed.

00:47:51.061 --> 00:47:52.960
And that those notices be reflected

00:47:52.960 --> 00:47:54.260
in the evidentiary record.

00:47:55.410 --> 00:47:56.243
<v ->Well put.</v>

00:47:57.770 --> 00:47:59.953
I not only agree with
everything in your memo,

00:48:01.300 --> 00:48:03.120
and agreed to include those,

00:48:03.120 --> 00:48:05.010
but wanna highlight the
fact that the questions

00:48:05.010 --> 00:48:08.963
you're asking are synced up,

00:48:10.245 --> 00:48:14.710
I suspect very deliberately
with the market design

00:48:14.710 --> 00:48:16.850
and the concept we'll
consider late this afternoon

00:48:16.850 --> 00:48:20.810
of a new firm fuel product.

00:48:20.810 --> 00:48:23.760
So which makes what you're
saying here even more important.

00:48:24.680 --> 00:48:25.660
<v ->Absolutely.</v>

00:48:25.660 --> 00:48:30.530
So SPS also experienced
issues during the storm.

00:48:30.530 --> 00:48:33.733
They are located in SPP.

00:48:35.420 --> 00:48:38.040
And so they also are trying to,

00:48:38.040 --> 00:48:39.380
I believe through this project,

00:48:39.380 --> 00:48:40.480
trying to address some of the issues

00:48:40.480 --> 00:48:42.040
that they've experienced
during the storm.

00:48:42.040 --> 00:48:43.410
And that is important.

00:48:43.410 --> 00:48:45.560
But as a matter of due diligence

00:48:45.560 --> 00:48:49.840
in our role of ensuring
that all costs and benefits

00:48:49.840 --> 00:48:52.876
are analyzed for Texas rate payers,

00:48:52.876 --> 00:48:54.920
this preliminary order sets out

00:48:54.920 --> 00:48:57.760
a very thorough list of
issues with additional issues

00:48:57.760 --> 00:48:58.610
that must be addressed

00:48:58.610 --> 00:49:01.280
in the evidentiary record of the case.

00:49:01.280 --> 00:49:02.113
<v ->Absolutely.</v>

00:49:03.130 --> 00:49:06.052
<v ->I would just say that in
these areas around Texas</v>

00:49:06.052 --> 00:49:11.052
that are not in competition,
extra scrutiny is important.

00:49:13.270 --> 00:49:16.150
And that I agree with the memo,

00:49:16.150 --> 00:49:20.310
and I agree that we need to...

00:49:20.310 --> 00:49:22.712
You know, that the
hearing, I think there will be

00:49:22.712 --> 00:49:25.570
a lot of good discussion, a
lot of discovery and so forth

00:49:25.570 --> 00:49:28.040
to actually get to the
answers that are necessary

00:49:28.040 --> 00:49:29.430
to see if this is in
the public interest,

00:49:29.430 --> 00:49:32.530
but I support the memo.

00:49:32.530 --> 00:49:34.520
<v ->As do I, sir.</v>

00:49:34.520 --> 00:49:35.353
<v ->Excellent.</v>

00:49:35.353 --> 00:49:38.010
Is there a motion to
approve the preliminary order

00:49:38.010 --> 00:49:40.050
as amended by Commissioner Cobos memo?

00:49:40.050 --> 00:49:40.890
<v ->So moved.</v>

00:49:40.890 --> 00:49:42.293
<v ->Is there a second?</v>

00:49:42.293 --> 00:49:43.126
<v ->Second.</v>

00:49:43.126 --> 00:49:43.959
<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

00:49:43.959 --> 00:49:44.792
<v ->Aye.</v>

00:49:44.792 --> 00:49:45.833
<v ->None-opposed,
the motion passes.</v>

00:49:46.920 --> 00:49:47.893
Six minutes.

00:49:49.860 --> 00:49:52.260
Item 17.

00:49:52.260 --> 00:49:55.523
<v ->Item 17 is docket 52487.</v>

00:49:55.523 --> 00:49:57.450
Is the application of
energy to amend their CCN

00:49:57.450 --> 00:50:01.040
for the advanced power
station in Orange County.

00:50:01.040 --> 00:50:03.240
We have a revised
draft preliminary order

00:50:03.240 --> 00:50:05.213
that was filed yesterday.

00:50:10.440 --> 00:50:11.440
<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

00:50:11.440 --> 00:50:16.203
Any questions, Comments, concerns?

00:50:17.600 --> 00:50:19.523
<v ->Greater scrutiny
is good, I assume.</v>

00:50:20.430 --> 00:50:21.860
<v ->Greater scrutiny is good.</v>

00:50:21.860 --> 00:50:22.693
Yeah.

00:50:22.693 --> 00:50:25.160
In these are areas
that are not competitive,

00:50:25.160 --> 00:50:26.480
I think greater scrutiny is good.

00:50:26.480 --> 00:50:28.480
I think there was this discussion about,

00:50:30.463 --> 00:50:31.296
is,

00:50:35.051 --> 00:50:38.940
preparing a plant for
different fuel types,

00:50:38.940 --> 00:50:42.020
when we don't know how
far out they are in advance

00:50:42.020 --> 00:50:44.290
prudent expenditure today,

00:50:44.290 --> 00:50:45.780
it may be something in the future.

00:50:45.780 --> 00:50:47.300
I don't know.

00:50:47.300 --> 00:50:50.140
But obviously I think
if there are huge costs

00:50:50.140 --> 00:50:55.140
of modifying facilities for
natural gas and hydrogen,

00:50:56.153 --> 00:50:59.730
the case ought to at least
have some discussion

00:50:59.730 --> 00:51:02.910
and some analytical support behind that,

00:51:02.910 --> 00:51:05.470
to make sure that there
is something in there

00:51:05.470 --> 00:51:09.402
for our consumers early
in the process, if that.

00:51:09.402 --> 00:51:12.670
What I don't want is
customer pay for a capability

00:51:12.670 --> 00:51:14.573
that doesn't get here for 25 years.

00:51:15.730 --> 00:51:17.468
That would not seem fair.

00:51:17.468 --> 00:51:19.623
<v ->You don't wanna build
a world for Blu-ray Disc.</v>

00:51:20.990 --> 00:51:22.892
And if I can build on that.

00:51:22.892 --> 00:51:26.300
As part of that, I wanna make sure that

00:51:26.300 --> 00:51:29.260
in the case of additional
new fuel like hydrogen,

00:51:29.260 --> 00:51:31.420
make sure that the amount of energy

00:51:31.420 --> 00:51:34.120
that goes into making
the hydrogen is offset

00:51:34.120 --> 00:51:37.155
by the amount of energy
we get out of the hydrogen.

00:51:37.155 --> 00:51:39.705
There's a lot of science
going into that right now.

00:51:40.540 --> 00:51:42.800
And hopefully that's the case.

00:51:42.800 --> 00:51:46.359
But there's other side of the same coin.

00:51:46.359 --> 00:51:49.666
We don't wanna build for
Blu-ray before we know...

00:51:49.666 --> 00:51:50.499
<v ->Yeah.</v>

00:51:50.499 --> 00:51:54.950
There was one other thing
that I had brought up internally,

00:51:54.950 --> 00:51:57.490
and that is my fear about,

00:51:57.490 --> 00:52:02.130
and it is addressed
in the questions to ALJ

00:52:02.130 --> 00:52:03.140
through this proceeding.

00:52:03.140 --> 00:52:07.810
But this is built, I
think if I recall correctly,

00:52:07.810 --> 00:52:09.530
it's built on an existing site.

00:52:09.530 --> 00:52:14.020
But very close to the coast,

00:52:14.020 --> 00:52:18.230
very vulnerable to hurricanes
and other weather events.

00:52:18.230 --> 00:52:20.430
And as I said, there
is a provision in there

00:52:21.530 --> 00:52:22.740
for them to look at that.

00:52:22.740 --> 00:52:24.340
But I just wanna make sure that,

00:52:25.299 --> 00:52:27.843
what these weather
events are getting stronger.

00:52:28.700 --> 00:52:30.610
And if we have
facilities down the coast,

00:52:30.610 --> 00:52:33.430
we gotta make sure that
they're gonna withstand

00:52:33.430 --> 00:52:36.040
not only winds and rains, but floods,

00:52:36.040 --> 00:52:39.855
and that looks at elevated substations

00:52:39.855 --> 00:52:42.466
and other facilities like that.

00:52:42.466 --> 00:52:43.866
So I'm glad that's in there.

00:52:45.270 --> 00:52:47.030
<v ->Great comments
Commissioner Glotfelty.</v>

00:52:47.030 --> 00:52:48.640
I agree with your sentiments.

00:52:48.640 --> 00:52:53.070
I think energy use
located in Southeast Texas

00:52:53.070 --> 00:52:58.070
has proactively looked at
a generation facility project

00:52:58.670 --> 00:53:03.040
that is really a case of
first impression in Texas.

00:53:03.040 --> 00:53:05.540
Hydrogen facilities are I think,

00:53:05.540 --> 00:53:07.830
a response to ESG pressures.

00:53:07.830 --> 00:53:10.000
Environmental, social,
governments pressures out there

00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:13.260
that investors are really
focused on ensuring

00:53:13.260 --> 00:53:16.970
that their investment monies
are going to clean energy.

00:53:16.970 --> 00:53:18.640
And so I think in response

00:53:18.640 --> 00:53:22.110
to these ESG governance
requirements and federal action,

00:53:22.110 --> 00:53:25.730
the company is looking to
proactively address those issues.

00:53:25.730 --> 00:53:28.100
But I think you mentioned
a good point in that,

00:53:28.100 --> 00:53:30.140
let's make sure that the circumstances

00:53:30.140 --> 00:53:33.960
that the company has
filed the application under

00:53:33.960 --> 00:53:38.960
will hold up for the duration
of this expensive plant.

00:53:39.040 --> 00:53:41.420
And that ultimately the benefits

00:53:41.420 --> 00:53:45.130
to the Southeast Texas rate
payers overcome the costs.

00:53:45.130 --> 00:53:47.470
And so I commend
staff for putting together

00:53:47.470 --> 00:53:49.810
a draft preliminary order
that has an extensive list

00:53:49.810 --> 00:53:52.070
of issues that must be addressed

00:53:52.070 --> 00:53:54.080
in the evidentiary record in the case.

00:53:54.080 --> 00:53:54.913
<v ->Well put.</v>

00:53:55.770 --> 00:53:58.240
<v ->I would like to say one
other thing, and that is,</v>

00:53:58.240 --> 00:54:03.090
the one thing that does
trouble me about this is the fact

00:54:03.090 --> 00:54:04.317
that there was an RFP process,

00:54:04.317 --> 00:54:06.160
and there was only one resource

00:54:06.160 --> 00:54:10.450
that responded to the
resource to the RFP,

00:54:10.450 --> 00:54:12.130
and that was this one.

00:54:12.130 --> 00:54:13.880
That doesn't show me
any competitive nature

00:54:13.880 --> 00:54:16.820
of the wholesale market in my show.

00:54:16.820 --> 00:54:19.849
I think that will be addressed
in the hearings itself,

00:54:19.849 --> 00:54:21.706
but I wanted to bring that up.

00:54:21.706 --> 00:54:23.333
<v ->Well put.</v>

00:54:25.090 --> 00:54:26.090
We like competition.

00:54:27.290 --> 00:54:28.123
All right.

00:54:28.123 --> 00:54:31.850
Is there a motion to approve
the preliminary order?

00:54:31.850 --> 00:54:32.960
<v ->So moved.</v>

00:54:32.960 --> 00:54:33.793
<v ->Second.</v>

00:54:33.793 --> 00:54:35.131
<v ->All in favor, say aye.</v>

00:54:35.131 --> 00:54:35.964
<v ->Aye.</v>

00:54:35.964 --> 00:54:37.600
<v ->Motion passes.</v>

00:54:37.600 --> 00:54:41.163
That seems like a good
stopping point at 9:29.

00:54:42.050 --> 00:54:45.523
At this point,
we... Sorry, 10:29.

00:54:46.370 --> 00:54:50.680
At this point, we will begin
the public comment portion

00:54:50.680 --> 00:54:53.640
of our programming today.

00:54:53.640 --> 00:54:56.060
Mr. Janae, I believe we have a list

00:54:56.060 --> 00:54:58.950
of folks signed up to speak.

00:54:58.950 --> 00:55:00.713
<v ->Yes, sir, we're
getting it right now.</v>

00:55:10.576 --> 00:55:14.023
It looks like we have
23 people signed up, sir.

00:55:15.330 --> 00:55:16.163
<v ->How many?</v>

00:55:16.163 --> 00:55:16.996
<v ->23.</v>

00:55:18.460 --> 00:55:19.970
<v ->All right, sir.</v>

00:55:19.970 --> 00:55:24.210
We will open up for public comment now.

00:55:24.210 --> 00:55:25.363
As a reminder,

00:55:27.190 --> 00:55:30.660
to our guests, this is for
general comments only,

00:55:30.660 --> 00:55:34.450
not for a specific agenda item.

00:55:34.450 --> 00:55:37.420
Speakers will be limited
to two minutes each.

00:55:37.420 --> 00:55:40.000
We will ask speakers to say their names

00:55:40.000 --> 00:55:42.900
and who they're with
into the microphone.

00:55:42.900 --> 00:55:46.020
And please take note of the timer.

00:55:46.020 --> 00:55:48.770
Mr. Janae, could you please call up

00:55:48.770 --> 00:55:51.170
the first person on our list?

00:55:51.170 --> 00:55:52.930
<v ->Sir, I'm gonna call
up the first three people</v>

00:55:52.930 --> 00:55:54.420
and ask them to come up,

00:55:54.420 --> 00:55:56.430
and then we'll try and
keep people up here going.

00:55:56.430 --> 00:56:00.510
So first, Mr. Craig Naser,
Ms. Stephanie Thomas,

00:56:00.510 --> 00:56:03.023
and Mr. Kenneth Flipping,
would you come up.

00:56:03.940 --> 00:56:06.190
And we'll start with
Mr. Naser with comments.

00:56:08.840 --> 00:56:10.920
Please state your name
for the court reporter

00:56:10.920 --> 00:56:12.220
when you sit down, please.

00:56:17.870 --> 00:56:18.703
<v ->Hello.</v>

00:56:18.703 --> 00:56:20.750
My name is Dr. Craig Naser.

00:56:20.750 --> 00:56:23.690
I am the conservation
chair of the Lonestar Chapter

00:56:23.690 --> 00:56:24.773
of the Sierra Club.

00:56:25.740 --> 00:56:30.000
The grid you see in front of
you is covered with icicles.

00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:32.790
Each icicle contains
the names of 10 people

00:56:32.790 --> 00:56:36.180
out of over 3,500 that
have signed a petition

00:56:36.180 --> 00:56:38.610
to ask you to weatherize the Texas grid

00:56:38.610 --> 00:56:41.980
in a way that protects and
benefits the people of Texas,

00:56:41.980 --> 00:56:44.030
rather than just protecting the profits

00:56:44.030 --> 00:56:46.370
of energy corporations.

00:56:46.370 --> 00:56:48.450
I've had some time to think about this.

00:56:48.450 --> 00:56:49.760
I had four and a half days

00:56:49.760 --> 00:56:53.100
to sit in the dark without
energy, without drinkable water,

00:56:53.100 --> 00:56:57.010
in a cold house during a
once in a century pandemic,

00:56:57.010 --> 00:56:58.350
and with no internet

00:56:58.350 --> 00:57:02.090
wondering what my
future might look like.

00:57:02.090 --> 00:57:06.780
11 feet were amputated
at local hospitals.

00:57:06.780 --> 00:57:09.400
Over 700 people died.

00:57:09.400 --> 00:57:12.490
Due to frozen pipes, people
had to move out of their homes

00:57:12.490 --> 00:57:14.310
for weeks or months.

00:57:14.310 --> 00:57:15.803
Here's what I thought about.

00:57:17.979 --> 00:57:21.330
Climate change is real
and is happening now.

00:57:21.330 --> 00:57:23.850
This is science, so it is true

00:57:23.850 --> 00:57:26.320
whether you choose to believe it or not.

00:57:26.320 --> 00:57:29.680
This will cause not just
average temperature to increase,

00:57:29.680 --> 00:57:32.290
but extremes to increase
in both directions.

00:57:32.290 --> 00:57:35.790
In other words, storms
like Uri will happen again

00:57:35.790 --> 00:57:37.700
and get worse.

00:57:37.700 --> 00:57:40.550
It's obvious, we must
weatherize the grid,

00:57:40.550 --> 00:57:44.240
as well as increase
our energy efficiency.

00:57:44.240 --> 00:57:47.330
To achieve this, will
we have power politics

00:57:47.330 --> 00:57:49.530
or free enterprise?

00:57:49.530 --> 00:57:52.860
Energy companies must
provide a reliable service,

00:57:52.860 --> 00:57:55.350
yet allow competition in the market.

00:57:55.350 --> 00:57:59.960
If you require the people
to directly bear the costs

00:57:59.960 --> 00:58:01.910
of insuring reliability,

00:58:01.910 --> 00:58:06.090
then the cost of reliability
will not be competitive.

00:58:06.090 --> 00:58:10.660
If you require energy companies
to ensure their reliability

00:58:10.660 --> 00:58:13.280
as the rest of the US does,

00:58:13.280 --> 00:58:17.790
reliability costs becomes competitive.

00:58:17.790 --> 00:58:20.533
That's free enterprise.

00:58:21.370 --> 00:58:23.070
You also need to provide programs

00:58:23.070 --> 00:58:25.660
to help people become
more energy efficient,

00:58:25.660 --> 00:58:29.210
not just homeowners, but
builders and landlords as well.

00:58:29.210 --> 00:58:32.680
This of course will not be
popular with energy producers

00:58:32.680 --> 00:58:35.430
as a decreases energy consumption,

00:58:35.430 --> 00:58:38.180
but it benefits everyone in the long run

00:58:38.180 --> 00:58:41.320
as it mitigates for climate change.

00:58:41.320 --> 00:58:43.370
So we're back to climate change.

00:58:43.370 --> 00:58:46.910
We must continue to reduce
our reliance on fossil fuels,

00:58:46.910 --> 00:58:50.080
which caused a severity
of Uri in the first place.

00:58:50.080 --> 00:58:51.610
Contrary to what we have heard,

00:58:51.610 --> 00:58:54.130
renewable energy to not crash the grid.

00:58:54.130 --> 00:58:55.890
Not require weatherization

00:58:55.890 --> 00:58:59.600
coupled with poor energy
efficiency, crashed the grid.

00:58:59.600 --> 00:59:02.333
Please fix the problem.

00:59:03.350 --> 00:59:04.183
Thank you.

00:59:05.402 --> 00:59:06.630
<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

00:59:06.630 --> 00:59:07.647
Who do we have next, Mr. Janae?

00:59:07.647 --> 00:59:10.550
<v ->Our next is Ms.
Stephanie Thomas,</v>

00:59:10.550 --> 00:59:13.010
and I would just a
comment to all speakers.

00:59:13.010 --> 00:59:14.980
We have a clock up
here with your time on it.

00:59:14.980 --> 00:59:19.043
Would you please try and
wrap up when your time expires.

00:59:21.400 --> 00:59:25.190
And I'd call up, I'm sorry,
Miss Vanessa McDougall,

00:59:25.190 --> 00:59:26.393
to come up.

00:59:32.360 --> 00:59:33.660
<v ->Good morning Commission.</v>

00:59:34.730 --> 00:59:38.280
My name is Dr. Stephanie Thomas.

00:59:38.280 --> 00:59:40.560
I work with a nonprofit
called Public Citizen,

00:59:40.560 --> 00:59:43.770
but I'm here today
also on behalf of myself.

00:59:43.770 --> 00:59:46.110
Because like our previous speaker,

00:59:46.110 --> 00:59:50.120
I spent several days without power,

00:59:50.120 --> 00:59:53.713
cold, huddling in my home.

00:59:54.630 --> 00:59:59.000
Only to find two days later
as I walked into my apartment,

00:59:59.000 --> 01:00:03.123
a waterfall in my
bedroom as a pipe burst.

01:00:04.770 --> 01:00:08.470
Which ended up, I needed to relocate

01:00:08.470 --> 01:00:10.590
because of the winter storm.

01:00:10.590 --> 01:00:14.140
It caused a lot of stress in
my life, and I'm angry today.

01:00:14.140 --> 01:00:17.778
I feel like as a Texan,
I have paid enough,

01:00:17.778 --> 01:00:19.533
I have paid enough.

01:00:20.500 --> 01:00:23.040
Others have paid with their lives.

01:00:23.040 --> 01:00:27.260
So this is a really important
thing that you have to do.

01:00:27.260 --> 01:00:29.320
You have to fix the grid.

01:00:29.320 --> 01:00:31.880
You have to make homes
more energy efficient

01:00:32.780 --> 01:00:36.043
because that would have saved
lives during the winter storm.

01:00:37.790 --> 01:00:41.720
We need public input in our processes.

01:00:41.720 --> 01:00:44.050
You need to hear the voice of Texans.

01:00:44.050 --> 01:00:47.110
And we need to find
solutions that don't just work

01:00:47.979 --> 01:00:49.770
to pad the bottom lines of corporations,

01:00:49.770 --> 01:00:54.024
but save the lives of your neighbors,

01:00:54.024 --> 01:00:55.810
of your fellow Texans.

01:00:55.810 --> 01:00:57.050
Thank you.

01:00:57.050 --> 01:00:58.000
<v ->Thank you, ma'am.</v>

01:01:00.833 --> 01:01:03.500
<v ->I would call up
now a Daniel Silva,</v>

01:01:03.500 --> 01:01:06.373
and next to speak is
Mr. Kenneth Flipping.

01:01:08.070 --> 01:01:09.610
<v ->Hello, my name
is Kenneth Flipping,</v>

01:01:09.610 --> 01:01:13.730
and I am glad to speak to you
all today as a Texas resident

01:01:13.730 --> 01:01:18.513
that also lost power and also
had a waterfall in my home.

01:01:19.530 --> 01:01:21.313
And just wanna say a few things.

01:01:22.856 --> 01:01:27.490
A lot of what happened
is trying to fix the grid

01:01:27.490 --> 01:01:29.960
on the side of the supply.

01:01:29.960 --> 01:01:32.410
But really just like anything else,

01:01:32.410 --> 01:01:35.160
the demand and supply
are equally important.

01:01:35.160 --> 01:01:37.810
And the demand side is basically

01:01:37.810 --> 01:01:40.340
where the public of the
public utility Commission is.

01:01:40.340 --> 01:01:41.380
That's where we live.

01:01:41.380 --> 01:01:43.900
That's where people died,
that's where people suffered.

01:01:43.900 --> 01:01:47.600
And what we see is
that in fixing the grid

01:01:47.600 --> 01:01:49.620
and what the legislature put out,

01:01:49.620 --> 01:01:51.370
they said, we do need to weatherize,

01:01:51.370 --> 01:01:53.410
we do need to work on that side.

01:01:53.410 --> 01:01:56.510
But what they did not do was order y'all

01:01:56.510 --> 01:01:58.570
to work on the demand side.

01:01:58.570 --> 01:02:01.330
In other words, energy
efficiency of our homes.

01:02:01.330 --> 01:02:04.320
Texas was the first to have
an energy efficiency standard.

01:02:04.320 --> 01:02:07.050
Now we're 26th of 26 states

01:02:07.050 --> 01:02:09.070
that have an energy efficiency standard.

01:02:09.070 --> 01:02:11.820
If we had taken the recommendations

01:02:11.820 --> 01:02:14.610
that were adopted by
other groups, nonprofits.

01:02:14.610 --> 01:02:16.010
One of the groups that I represent

01:02:16.010 --> 01:02:17.530
is the US Green Building Council.

01:02:17.530 --> 01:02:19.500
We've been recommending for years

01:02:19.500 --> 01:02:21.600
to raise the energy efficiency standards

01:02:21.600 --> 01:02:24.200
that the utilities have
to have for homes.

01:02:24.200 --> 01:02:26.900
If we'd done that 10, 12 years ago,

01:02:26.900 --> 01:02:30.570
we had basically weatherized
2 million homes a year,

01:02:30.570 --> 01:02:34.820
we could have reduced all
of that demand by about half

01:02:34.820 --> 01:02:36.900
that took our grid down.

01:02:36.900 --> 01:02:39.930
And yet again, did
we see the legislature

01:02:39.930 --> 01:02:41.110
tell y'all to do that?

01:02:41.110 --> 01:02:41.943
No.

01:02:41.943 --> 01:02:45.120
And the biggest reason why is
because we know the utilities,

01:02:45.120 --> 01:02:46.610
even though we had the legislation,

01:02:46.610 --> 01:02:49.590
we had everybody testifying in support,

01:02:49.590 --> 01:02:52.610
the ones who's testified
against it were the utilities.

01:02:52.610 --> 01:02:56.270
And they basically know
that that excess energy,

01:02:56.270 --> 01:02:59.060
that wasted energy is excess profit

01:02:59.060 --> 01:03:02.870
and excess money in their pockets.

01:03:02.870 --> 01:03:05.420
That not only hurts us as consumers,

01:03:05.420 --> 01:03:07.300
but it ended up costing our lives.

01:03:07.300 --> 01:03:10.460
And so I'd ask you
to focus on the public.

01:03:10.460 --> 01:03:11.293
Thank you.

01:03:13.290 --> 01:03:15.580
<v ->Next I will call
up Adrian Shelby,</v>

01:03:15.580 --> 01:03:19.187
and next to speak is Vanessa McDougall.

01:03:20.671 --> 01:03:22.359
<v ->She left.</v>

01:03:22.359 --> 01:03:23.238
<v ->She left.</v>

01:03:23.238 --> 01:03:24.071
Okay, the next to
speak is Daniellas Silva.

01:03:28.000 --> 01:03:29.292
<v ->Good morning.</v>

01:03:29.292 --> 01:03:32.040
My name is Daniela Silva,
and I'm here on behalf of myself

01:03:32.040 --> 01:03:34.200
and in support of the Sierra Club.

01:03:34.200 --> 01:03:36.300
I volunteer with an organization called

01:03:36.300 --> 01:03:38.240
Community Resilience Stressed.

01:03:38.240 --> 01:03:40.370
And when the first storm first hit,

01:03:40.370 --> 01:03:44.980
we organized to get
unhoused people into hotels,

01:03:44.980 --> 01:03:46.540
get them food and water,

01:03:46.540 --> 01:03:49.190
and get them mental health services.

01:03:49.190 --> 01:03:51.780
When there was no governmental support,

01:03:51.780 --> 01:03:55.180
we eventually had to
extend our organizing

01:03:55.180 --> 01:03:59.210
to the city at large; getting
food and water to people,

01:03:59.210 --> 01:04:01.927
transportation, rescuing
them from places

01:04:01.927 --> 01:04:04.320
where they had no power and no water,

01:04:04.320 --> 01:04:07.660
getting diapers, baby formula, dog food,

01:04:07.660 --> 01:04:09.330
to everyone who needed it.

01:04:09.330 --> 01:04:12.090
And about a weekend, when
we finally had the bandwidth

01:04:12.090 --> 01:04:14.250
to start doing wellness calls,

01:04:14.250 --> 01:04:17.910
we reached out to some homes
where there are elderly people,

01:04:17.910 --> 01:04:20.950
and to realize that they had perished.

01:04:20.950 --> 01:04:25.170
And these deaths were
completely preventable,

01:04:25.170 --> 01:04:28.760
if the recommendations
to weatherize the grid

01:04:28.760 --> 01:04:30.990
had been taken into account.

01:04:30.990 --> 01:04:35.200
And also if we have more of a focus

01:04:35.200 --> 01:04:39.260
on making more energy
efficient homes and buildings.

01:04:39.260 --> 01:04:42.440
The most vulnerable will
continue to be hit the hardest

01:04:42.440 --> 01:04:44.720
with more climate related disasters

01:04:44.720 --> 01:04:47.310
that will happen more
and more in the future.

01:04:47.310 --> 01:04:50.320
In the next storm, the wealthy
will be ready with generators

01:04:50.320 --> 01:04:54.660
while the rest of us will
literally be left out in the cold.

01:04:54.660 --> 01:04:55.950
So I'm asking you to hold off

01:04:55.950 --> 01:04:58.510
on making any final decisions today

01:04:58.510 --> 01:05:00.870
until more public input can be heard,

01:05:00.870 --> 01:05:03.180
and that the recommendations
by the Sierra Club

01:05:03.180 --> 01:05:05.090
be taken into consideration.

01:05:05.090 --> 01:05:07.184
Thank you.

01:05:07.184 --> 01:05:08.330
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:05:08.330 --> 01:05:12.530
<v ->Next up, I'll call
up Marlene Plua.</v>

01:05:12.530 --> 01:05:15.553
I'm sorry that I butchered
you your name, I'm sure.

01:05:15.553 --> 01:05:17.693
And next to speak is Adrian Shelby.

01:05:19.981 --> 01:05:20.820
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:05:20.820 --> 01:05:21.653
Hello?

01:05:21.653 --> 01:05:22.999
We're good?

01:05:22.999 --> 01:05:23.832
Yes.

01:05:23.832 --> 01:05:26.980
Thank you, Adrian Shelley
here with public citizen.

01:05:26.980 --> 01:05:29.770
Appreciate the
opportunity to speak today.

01:05:29.770 --> 01:05:31.750
Appreciate all of
you for taking the time

01:05:31.750 --> 01:05:32.980
to listen to us today.

01:05:32.980 --> 01:05:36.150
And also appreciate all of our
friends who have come today

01:05:36.150 --> 01:05:37.070
to deliver comments.

01:05:37.070 --> 01:05:40.050
And the thousands of people
who have shown support

01:05:40.050 --> 01:05:41.200
by signing the petition,

01:05:41.200 --> 01:05:43.590
and the tens to hundreds of thousands,

01:05:43.590 --> 01:05:46.800
even millions of people beyond
that who have been impacted

01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:48.980
by what's gone on in the last year,

01:05:48.980 --> 01:05:52.700
and who will be impacted
by you. All's decision-making.

01:05:52.700 --> 01:05:56.510
I wanna honor their
sacrifice to be here today,

01:05:56.510 --> 01:06:00.870
and the sacrifices of people
who could not be here today,

01:06:00.870 --> 01:06:03.800
and just ask you to
be equal to that, right?

01:06:03.800 --> 01:06:06.200
This is an unusual circumstance

01:06:06.200 --> 01:06:08.200
that we have all of these folks here,

01:06:08.200 --> 01:06:12.250
delivering these comments,
telling you how decision-making

01:06:12.250 --> 01:06:15.230
at this entity affected
their lives and their families

01:06:15.230 --> 01:06:16.300
and and their wellbeing,

01:06:16.300 --> 01:06:18.700
and continue to impact
them into the future.

01:06:18.700 --> 01:06:22.490
And I just wanna ask you to
really do take the time today

01:06:22.490 --> 01:06:25.590
to listen and to be equal to that.

01:06:25.590 --> 01:06:27.010
So what does that actually mean?

01:06:27.010 --> 01:06:28.364
Right?

01:06:28.364 --> 01:06:31.432
You're gonna hear some
good recommendations today.

01:06:31.432 --> 01:06:34.480
There have been some real
substantive recommendations

01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:36.320
that have been submitted
by the Sierra Club and others.

01:06:36.320 --> 01:06:41.320
But just very quickly
investment in energy efficiency

01:06:41.380 --> 01:06:44.870
in demand side strategies,
that's investment in people.

01:06:44.870 --> 01:06:46.274
Right?

01:06:46.274 --> 01:06:48.690
I wanna leave you with
an image here, right?

01:06:48.690 --> 01:06:52.570
Somebody who was in
their home, it was cold,

01:06:52.570 --> 01:06:54.260
the lights weren't on,

01:06:54.260 --> 01:06:55.630
they don't know when
they're gonna get power back,

01:06:55.630 --> 01:06:57.050
they're with their families.

01:06:57.050 --> 01:06:59.620
They're resorting to desperate measures;

01:06:59.620 --> 01:07:02.130
things like burning furniture
in their homes, right?

01:07:02.130 --> 01:07:03.500
We've heard these stories from people.

01:07:03.500 --> 01:07:05.150
We all have, right?

01:07:05.150 --> 01:07:06.527
An investment in that home,

01:07:06.527 --> 01:07:09.098
and the energy efficiency of that home,

01:07:09.098 --> 01:07:11.390
sealing the envelope,
right-sizing the heat pump,

01:07:11.390 --> 01:07:14.650
installation for the attic.

01:07:14.650 --> 01:07:17.430
Imagine just that one
person in that one home,

01:07:17.430 --> 01:07:19.140
the difference in their
lives in those couple of days

01:07:19.140 --> 01:07:20.450
with that investment, right?

01:07:20.450 --> 01:07:22.750
So let's shift the
focus to those people.

01:07:22.750 --> 01:07:24.160
Thank you.

01:07:24.160 --> 01:07:24.993
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:07:26.100 --> 01:07:28.890
<v ->Next I'd call up, Arthur Dale.</v>

01:07:28.890 --> 01:07:32.443
And next to speak
is, I'm sorry. Marlene.

01:07:34.095 --> 01:07:38.012
(speaking in foreign language)

01:09:59.044 --> 01:10:01.570
<v ->Next I will call
up Elion Sweden.</v>

01:10:01.570 --> 01:10:04.103
And next to speak is Mr. Arthur Dale.

01:10:07.770 --> 01:10:09.390
<v ->Hi, I'm Arthur Dale.</v>

01:10:09.390 --> 01:10:11.330
I am here on...

01:10:13.990 --> 01:10:16.040
I'm here on behalf of myself.

01:10:16.040 --> 01:10:18.330
I guess I'm a UT student who lives

01:10:18.330 --> 01:10:20.653
in the Highland Hills area.

01:10:21.604 --> 01:10:26.420
And my family and I
were affected pretty heavily

01:10:26.420 --> 01:10:28.720
by the power outages,

01:10:28.720 --> 01:10:32.320
and then subsequently the water outages.

01:10:32.320 --> 01:10:36.940
We roughed it for two days at our house

01:10:36.940 --> 01:10:39.860
with no power and then no water

01:10:39.860 --> 01:10:43.570
before traveling south of the river

01:10:43.570 --> 01:10:46.380
to my grandparents' house.

01:10:46.380 --> 01:10:51.380
And then they promptly also
lost power and access to water.

01:10:52.960 --> 01:10:57.290
We stayed with our cousins
who lived nearby them,

01:10:57.290 --> 01:11:02.290
and then they also lost
their power and their water.

01:11:02.370 --> 01:11:07.370
And so it was just our
whole extended family kind of

01:11:09.100 --> 01:11:11.966
staying together like
huddled for warmth.

01:11:11.966 --> 01:11:16.966
They eventually got their
power back for part of the,

01:11:17.990 --> 01:11:20.440
I want to say it was
roughly one and a half weeks

01:11:20.440 --> 01:11:22.033
that we were without power.

01:11:23.540 --> 01:11:28.540
And that allowed us to
basically just boil water

01:11:30.380 --> 01:11:33.110
and do a few things,
but then their power,

01:11:33.110 --> 01:11:34.740
once again, cut out.

01:11:34.740 --> 01:11:39.570
And it was just, it was very stressful.

01:11:39.570 --> 01:11:44.570
And with climate change being a reality,

01:11:44.920 --> 01:11:47.316
there are going to be
winter storms like this again,

01:11:47.316 --> 01:11:51.638
and there needs to be
infrastructure in place

01:11:51.638 --> 01:11:56.638
in order to mitigate what is in truth,

01:11:57.380 --> 01:11:59.623
like a climate disaster,

01:12:01.190 --> 01:12:04.130
because it's going to be a reality

01:12:04.130 --> 01:12:07.430
that Texas is going to face
harsher winters moving forward.

01:12:07.430 --> 01:12:09.180
So we need to be prepared for that.

01:12:12.330 --> 01:12:16.313
<v ->Next I would call
up Jonathan Levo.</v>

01:12:16.313 --> 01:12:18.213
And next to the speak is Elion Sweden.

01:12:27.050 --> 01:12:29.420
<v ->My name is Elion Sweden Lopez.</v>

01:12:29.420 --> 01:12:30.980
I am simply a concerned citizen

01:12:30.980 --> 01:12:32.890
who's here to support the Sierra Club.

01:12:32.890 --> 01:12:37.460
I was like many others
impacted by the winter storm.

01:12:37.460 --> 01:12:39.750
I was affected in ways that are obvious.

01:12:39.750 --> 01:12:42.390
I lost power, I lost water.

01:12:42.390 --> 01:12:45.010
These are not unique
experiences, not by a long shot.

01:12:45.010 --> 01:12:47.130
But I was also affected like many others

01:12:47.130 --> 01:12:48.780
in ways that are less obvious,

01:12:48.780 --> 01:12:51.610
and insidious sort of butterfly effects.

01:12:51.610 --> 01:12:52.670
As everyone can see,

01:12:52.670 --> 01:12:54.720
I am disabled and
have issues with mobility.

01:12:54.720 --> 01:12:56.680
I'm an ambulatory wheelchair user.

01:12:56.680 --> 01:12:58.010
I can walk but not well.

01:12:58.010 --> 01:12:59.510
I have poor balance upon standing.

01:12:59.510 --> 01:13:02.660
I grow lightheaded and
faint during the winter storm

01:13:02.660 --> 01:13:03.920
with no power, no water,

01:13:03.920 --> 01:13:05.860
quickly running out of
food that could be prepared

01:13:05.860 --> 01:13:07.760
under these conditions
and unable to drive

01:13:07.760 --> 01:13:09.050
on iced over roads.

01:13:09.050 --> 01:13:12.870
I had no option but to
travel on foot four miles

01:13:12.870 --> 01:13:14.260
to the nearest grocery store.

01:13:14.260 --> 01:13:16.770
I cannot tell you how many times

01:13:16.770 --> 01:13:19.530
I slipped on ice on the way
there, how long it took me,

01:13:19.530 --> 01:13:22.420
how quickly my heart rate rose
to over 200 beats per minute

01:13:22.420 --> 01:13:23.913
from simply walking slowly,

01:13:24.950 --> 01:13:26.710
and how it refused to come back down.

01:13:26.710 --> 01:13:29.600
There are consequences to every action.

01:13:29.600 --> 01:13:32.070
And prioritizing the
profits of corporations

01:13:32.070 --> 01:13:35.010
over the wellbeing of the
public has consequences.

01:13:35.010 --> 01:13:36.870
There are no ways to predict

01:13:36.870 --> 01:13:39.210
what these consequences will be.

01:13:39.210 --> 01:13:42.650
And these consequences will
affect each and every one of us.

01:13:42.650 --> 01:13:43.650
There's no escaping them,

01:13:43.650 --> 01:13:45.220
there's no buying your way out of them.

01:13:45.220 --> 01:13:50.220
And the effects of refusing to
make decisions like divesting

01:13:52.100 --> 01:13:57.100
from unclean energy, refusing
to invest in types of energy

01:13:57.400 --> 01:13:59.713
that are more sustainable,

01:14:01.510 --> 01:14:06.510
these consequences are going to be big,

01:14:07.060 --> 01:14:10.760
like losing power, and small,
like falling on the ground,

01:14:10.760 --> 01:14:11.593
slipping on ice,

01:14:11.593 --> 01:14:14.450
because you had to
walk to the grocery store.

01:14:14.450 --> 01:14:19.450
All this to say because of
the dire, dire consequences

01:14:20.020 --> 01:14:21.320
that we are gonna face.

01:14:21.320 --> 01:14:24.730
The impossibility of predicting
them and preparing for them

01:14:24.730 --> 01:14:28.340
in the ways that we need
to, change must be made.

01:14:28.340 --> 01:14:30.480
We must fix the grid and
we must try to prepare

01:14:30.480 --> 01:14:31.313
as best we can.

01:14:34.912 --> 01:14:38.060
<v ->Next, I would call
up Susan Littman,</v>

01:14:38.060 --> 01:14:41.117
and next to speak as Jonathan Lowell.

01:14:43.600 --> 01:14:44.500
<v ->Jonathan Lowell.</v>

01:14:45.700 --> 01:14:48.470
I'm here as just representing
myself as a citizen

01:14:48.470 --> 01:14:51.120
and supportive Sierra Club.

01:14:51.120 --> 01:14:56.060
And I wanted to echo
most of the sentiments

01:14:56.060 --> 01:14:57.630
that have been brought for us so far

01:14:57.630 --> 01:15:02.590
around demand side
interventions into the grid

01:15:02.590 --> 01:15:04.550
and the efficiency,

01:15:04.550 --> 01:15:08.910
and asking for there
to be more public input

01:15:08.910 --> 01:15:10.060
into this process.

01:15:10.060 --> 01:15:13.380
I think one of the Commissioners
at the beginning of this

01:15:13.380 --> 01:15:15.770
said we had a lot of public input today,

01:15:15.770 --> 01:15:18.843
and I look around and I see that.

01:15:19.707 --> 01:15:22.350
There's a bit of a
strange comment to make.

01:15:22.350 --> 01:15:25.510
I think having a couple of
dozen people from the state

01:15:25.510 --> 01:15:27.340
kind of give a couple of minutes.

01:15:27.340 --> 01:15:29.990
I mean, I know there's
other avenues as well,

01:15:29.990 --> 01:15:34.120
but I feel like if
this feels like a lot,

01:15:34.120 --> 01:15:37.695
then that speaks to a process problem,

01:15:37.695 --> 01:15:42.695
and that we need to have like
a much more expanded ways

01:15:43.250 --> 01:15:47.562
in which the public can
input into this process.

01:15:47.562 --> 01:15:50.523
And that's, I'll yield
the rest of my time.

01:15:51.905 --> 01:15:53.770
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:15:53.770 --> 01:15:56.250
<v ->Next I would call
up Norma Cortez,</v>

01:15:56.250 --> 01:15:59.790
and next to speak is Susan Littman.

01:15:59.790 --> 01:16:02.060
<v ->Hi, my name is Susan Littman.</v>

01:16:02.060 --> 01:16:04.210
I'm an Austin resident.

01:16:04.210 --> 01:16:06.100
I'm a volunteer with Sierra Club

01:16:06.100 --> 01:16:08.370
and a with the Extinction Rebellion,

01:16:08.370 --> 01:16:09.770
which is an international

01:16:09.770 --> 01:16:11.803
climate change activist organization.

01:16:13.480 --> 01:16:17.750
During the storm, my
husband and I got off lightly.

01:16:17.750 --> 01:16:19.230
I think we're on the same grid

01:16:19.230 --> 01:16:22.110
with our power substation or something.

01:16:22.110 --> 01:16:23.960
So our power stayed on.

01:16:23.960 --> 01:16:25.700
All we had to do is go
out and get some water

01:16:25.700 --> 01:16:28.110
from the rain barrels
and boil it for a while.

01:16:28.110 --> 01:16:31.010
But my thoughts were with
the people around the state

01:16:31.010 --> 01:16:35.750
who were living in apartments,
or who were unhoused,

01:16:35.750 --> 01:16:40.160
people whose water broke
in apartments above them

01:16:40.160 --> 01:16:42.450
and flooded their apartments.

01:16:42.450 --> 01:16:44.853
The cascading effects
were just incredible.

01:16:46.070 --> 01:16:48.728
So I did try to go out and help

01:16:48.728 --> 01:16:51.970
and deliver a cube of water
to an apartment building,

01:16:51.970 --> 01:16:53.223
trying to imagine people,

01:16:53.223 --> 01:16:56.100
like mothers with
children with limited water,

01:16:56.100 --> 01:16:58.170
changing their baby's
diapers, things like that

01:16:58.170 --> 01:17:00.563
just weren't awesome to me.

01:17:02.140 --> 01:17:04.300
So I want to ask you,

01:17:04.300 --> 01:17:05.890
in addition to the things
you've heard today

01:17:05.890 --> 01:17:10.890
to seek really big
and broad public input,

01:17:11.050 --> 01:17:13.872
to give out plenty of notice

01:17:13.872 --> 01:17:17.500
and hold public
hearings around the state,

01:17:17.500 --> 01:17:19.713
and have it be in Spanish and English.

01:17:20.784 --> 01:17:23.500
One of the organizations
that I'm aware of

01:17:23.500 --> 01:17:26.429
is the (indistinct)

01:17:26.429 --> 01:17:28.190
of Floresville.

01:17:28.190 --> 01:17:31.033
They had a little
piece of land and some,

01:17:32.834 --> 01:17:33.667
a lot of trailer homes on there.

01:17:33.667 --> 01:17:35.290
The pipes broke, things like that.

01:17:35.290 --> 01:17:39.230
And yet, as quickly as they
got themselves just functional,

01:17:39.230 --> 01:17:41.750
they went out and helped
other people around the state,

01:17:41.750 --> 01:17:44.100
repairing pipes and
doing things like that.

01:17:44.100 --> 01:17:46.560
They helped a trailer park in Austin

01:17:46.560 --> 01:17:51.170
that my church also tried to help.

01:17:51.170 --> 01:17:54.630
People in trailer homes
had very shallow pipes,

01:17:54.630 --> 01:17:56.880
so they had a lot of breakage.

01:17:56.880 --> 01:17:58.740
There were so many ways that people died

01:17:58.740 --> 01:18:01.008
from kind of like knock on effects.

01:18:01.008 --> 01:18:04.490
You can chalk it up to Luminar storm.

01:18:04.490 --> 01:18:07.510
I urge you to have public
hearings so people can do better.

01:18:07.510 --> 01:18:08.343
Thank you.

01:18:09.563 --> 01:18:13.150
<v ->The next time I call
up Susana Carranza,</v>

01:18:13.150 --> 01:18:16.583
and next to speak is Norma Cortez.

01:18:19.240 --> 01:18:20.330
<v ->Good morning.</v>

01:18:20.330 --> 01:18:24.373
I'm Norma Cortez, I am a
resident in Austin, Texas.

01:18:25.750 --> 01:18:29.560
I personally did not
experience loss of electricity,

01:18:29.560 --> 01:18:30.893
but my family did.

01:18:34.290 --> 01:18:39.290
I have a granddaughter who
was impacted by this storm,

01:18:41.180 --> 01:18:43.000
scared to death.

01:18:43.000 --> 01:18:44.550
Didn't know what was happening.

01:18:45.790 --> 01:18:48.140
My son and his partner took care of her,

01:18:48.140 --> 01:18:52.513
but they were 60 hours without power,

01:18:53.690 --> 01:18:58.103
and then followed by
another 30 hours without water.

01:18:59.600 --> 01:19:04.230
We need for you to do
something for the citizens of Texas.

01:19:04.230 --> 01:19:09.230
Don't make a decision today,
make time for public input.

01:19:09.360 --> 01:19:11.070
That's so important.

01:19:11.070 --> 01:19:15.080
But please give notice so
that people can participate

01:19:15.080 --> 01:19:16.490
in these hearings.

01:19:16.490 --> 01:19:17.970
It's essential.

01:19:17.970 --> 01:19:22.970
And we're looking forward
for you to find good solutions,

01:19:23.382 --> 01:19:27.860
energy efficient solutions,
investments in energy,

01:19:27.860 --> 01:19:32.370
Statewide investments in
energy efficient solutions

01:19:32.370 --> 01:19:34.640
that will help the citizens,

01:19:34.640 --> 01:19:37.885
and not necessarily those companies

01:19:37.885 --> 01:19:40.730
that profit by all of this.

01:19:40.730 --> 01:19:43.973
The profits to these companies
have been outrageous.

01:19:44.994 --> 01:19:49.963
There are many of us that
can't afford to get generators.

01:19:51.200 --> 01:19:52.100
We just can't.

01:19:52.100 --> 01:19:54.760
I'm a retired citizen
on a limited income.

01:19:54.760 --> 01:19:56.580
So I'm unable to do that.

01:19:56.580 --> 01:19:59.790
We're asking you to
delay your decision today,

01:19:59.790 --> 01:20:03.630
include more public input
and make better decisions

01:20:03.630 --> 01:20:06.540
on energy efficient investments.

01:20:06.540 --> 01:20:07.373
Thank you.

01:20:08.760 --> 01:20:09.653
<v ->Thank you, ma'am.</v>

01:20:10.490 --> 01:20:12.870
<v ->I would call up
next or Rick Galvan,</v>

01:20:12.870 --> 01:20:15.593
and next to speak is Susanna Carranza.

01:20:17.340 --> 01:20:20.360
<v ->Hi, I'm Dr. Susanna Carranza.</v>

01:20:20.360 --> 01:20:22.180
I'm a chemical engineer.

01:20:22.180 --> 01:20:23.930
I live in Austin, Texas.

01:20:23.930 --> 01:20:27.020
And I'm here today
testifying as an individual.

01:20:27.020 --> 01:20:31.790
I'm here to urge you to focus
the changes on helping Texans

01:20:31.790 --> 01:20:34.280
rather than continuing to
benefit energy companies

01:20:34.280 --> 01:20:38.220
that fail us so badly in February.

01:20:38.220 --> 01:20:42.610
I am one of the lucky few
that only face inconvenience

01:20:42.610 --> 01:20:44.460
rather than hardship.

01:20:44.460 --> 01:20:47.750
But most people around
me weren't so lucky.

01:20:47.750 --> 01:20:51.020
My closest friend was without
power for a whole week,

01:20:51.020 --> 01:20:53.850
and without water for two days.

01:20:53.850 --> 01:20:55.630
I have many friends with kids

01:20:55.630 --> 01:20:57.610
that had to leave their own homes

01:20:57.610 --> 01:20:59.340
and go bunk with other friends

01:20:59.340 --> 01:21:01.050
in the middle of the pandemic,

01:21:01.050 --> 01:21:02.770
because they had small kids

01:21:02.770 --> 01:21:04.750
and they feared for their kids' safety

01:21:04.750 --> 01:21:07.660
under the frigid conditions
and had to make the choice

01:21:07.660 --> 01:21:12.150
between pandemic and freezing to death.

01:21:12.150 --> 01:21:14.732
Grid failures affected
entire apartment complexes,

01:21:14.732 --> 01:21:19.260
and many stayed without power
well after the storm was over.

01:21:19.260 --> 01:21:21.570
Hundreds of people died.

01:21:21.570 --> 01:21:25.850
And it's shameful that
Texas had a warning in 2011

01:21:25.850 --> 01:21:27.700
with a much smaller scale problem.

01:21:27.700 --> 01:21:30.400
And the recommendations of winterization

01:21:30.400 --> 01:21:32.440
was largely ignored.

01:21:32.440 --> 01:21:33.810
While there has been some progress

01:21:33.810 --> 01:21:36.050
in terms of preparing
for the next storm,

01:21:36.050 --> 01:21:39.380
as it stands, the costs
will be pushed largely

01:21:39.380 --> 01:21:40.260
into the public.

01:21:40.260 --> 01:21:42.090
And that's awful.

01:21:42.090 --> 01:21:45.460
The public needs more time to
review and comment on the plan

01:21:45.460 --> 01:21:47.660
which has been posted
only a few days ago.

01:21:47.660 --> 01:21:51.310
And I urge the Commission to
make more ways assessable,

01:21:51.310 --> 01:21:54.050
including remote testifying for folks

01:21:54.050 --> 01:21:55.510
that live far away in Texas.

01:21:55.510 --> 01:21:57.510
Texas is a huge state.

01:21:57.510 --> 01:22:00.670
Texas deserves solutions
that will center on their benefit.

01:22:00.670 --> 01:22:03.650
And we should really be
investing on conservation,

01:22:03.650 --> 01:22:07.630
renewable energy, rooftop
solar, and battery backup,

01:22:07.630 --> 01:22:11.740
so residents can reduce
the impact on the grid

01:22:11.740 --> 01:22:14.417
and also have more reliance.

01:22:14.417 --> 01:22:16.660
Thank you for your time.

01:22:16.660 --> 01:22:17.990
Please let's make sure

01:22:17.990 --> 01:22:19.870
that we don't make any decisions today.

01:22:19.870 --> 01:22:21.590
We need more time to hear.

01:22:21.590 --> 01:22:22.900
Thank you.

01:22:22.900 --> 01:22:24.050
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:22:24.050 --> 01:22:26.890
<v ->Next one, I would
call up J. Rod C.</v>

01:22:26.890 --> 01:22:29.253
and next to speak is Rick Galvan.

01:22:30.588 --> 01:22:31.840
<v ->Thank you so
much, Commissioners.</v>

01:22:31.840 --> 01:22:32.673
My name's Rick Galvan.

01:22:32.673 --> 01:22:34.050
My pronouns are he/him/his.

01:22:34.050 --> 01:22:35.750
I'm a student at UT Austin.

01:22:35.750 --> 01:22:37.450
I'm from San Antonio,
Texas, but I live here in Austin,

01:22:37.450 --> 01:22:39.513
currently on Riverside,
or off Riverside.

01:22:41.691 --> 01:22:45.390
When the winter storm
happened last year,

01:22:45.390 --> 01:22:47.440
I was in San Antonio with my family,

01:22:47.440 --> 01:22:49.730
staying in San Antonio
because of the pandemic.

01:22:49.730 --> 01:22:51.870
I have a chronic
asthmatic, I can not be out.

01:22:51.870 --> 01:22:54.380
You know, I could not just
be running around Austin

01:22:54.380 --> 01:22:55.880
trying to take care of myself,

01:22:56.925 --> 01:22:58.520
when the respiratory disease
that was killing people like me

01:22:58.520 --> 01:23:00.090
all over the place.

01:23:00.090 --> 01:23:03.030
So I stayed home in San
Antonio, and we were frozen in,

01:23:03.030 --> 01:23:06.020
Snowden, had no power for several days,

01:23:06.020 --> 01:23:07.240
and their storm happened.

01:23:07.240 --> 01:23:09.740
When we did have power,
we had to boil our water

01:23:09.740 --> 01:23:11.390
because our water pipes in San Antonio

01:23:11.390 --> 01:23:13.770
were no longer giving clean water.

01:23:13.770 --> 01:23:16.920
And then we had to try to
cook food as quick as we could,

01:23:16.920 --> 01:23:19.735
within five minutes,
eight minute intervals,

01:23:19.735 --> 01:23:20.640
probably ta maximum.

01:23:20.640 --> 01:23:25.180
Now, we're gonna get higher
rates of energy or electricity

01:23:25.180 --> 01:23:27.130
for our power in San Antonio,

01:23:27.130 --> 01:23:29.900
because San Antonio,
the CPS power company

01:23:29.900 --> 01:23:33.390
tried to get power for us
so that we could be okay.

01:23:33.390 --> 01:23:35.750
And now EECOT is
gonna charge us more for it.

01:23:35.750 --> 01:23:36.880
I understand that how it works,

01:23:36.880 --> 01:23:39.230
that I understand is that
the market is meant to do,

01:23:39.230 --> 01:23:42.280
meant to at cost on us,
but I don't think it's fair.

01:23:42.280 --> 01:23:43.600
I don't think it's fair that
people in San Antonio

01:23:43.600 --> 01:23:45.770
and all across, they have
to deal with things like that.

01:23:45.770 --> 01:23:46.890
I don't think it's fair
that power companies

01:23:46.890 --> 01:23:48.710
at other parts of Texas
completely collapsed

01:23:48.710 --> 01:23:50.180
because of these high prices.

01:23:50.180 --> 01:23:51.910
I heard some comments
about that these things

01:23:51.910 --> 01:23:53.160
would be sort of addressed.

01:23:53.160 --> 01:23:54.670
I know that in special sessions

01:23:54.670 --> 01:23:55.830
and during the regular session,

01:23:55.830 --> 01:23:57.150
when my group with Texas rising

01:23:57.150 --> 01:23:59.990
and other groups that were
there and my friends were there,

01:23:59.990 --> 01:24:01.370
organizing, advocating in those halls

01:24:01.370 --> 01:24:02.587
that we heard some solutions,

01:24:02.587 --> 01:24:05.427
but we did not see
anything go far enough.

01:24:05.427 --> 01:24:07.570
I don't think it's a good thing

01:24:07.570 --> 01:24:09.170
that we're gonna be pushing
through this so quickly

01:24:09.170 --> 01:24:10.360
without much public hearing.

01:24:10.360 --> 01:24:12.610
So I hope that y'all open
these things up more,

01:24:12.610 --> 01:24:15.020
open these hearings
up more, put notice out,

01:24:15.020 --> 01:24:17.750
so that more folks like myself,
young people like myself

01:24:17.750 --> 01:24:19.770
in Austin and across
the state can come here,

01:24:19.770 --> 01:24:20.800
or at least testify remotely

01:24:20.800 --> 01:24:22.400
and talk about what
their experiences were.

01:24:22.400 --> 01:24:25.310
And so we can really get
some big solutions here

01:24:25.310 --> 01:24:26.750
because it's just not fair

01:24:26.750 --> 01:24:29.360
that we're gonna pay
higher rates for our power

01:24:29.360 --> 01:24:31.230
after suffering through
all the horrible things.

01:24:31.230 --> 01:24:33.220
And then little will
be done to make sure

01:24:33.220 --> 01:24:34.980
that this will not happen again.

01:24:34.980 --> 01:24:36.150
Thank you so much for your time.

01:24:36.150 --> 01:24:37.423
Please do the right thing.

01:24:38.271 --> 01:24:39.474
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:24:39.474 --> 01:24:40.990
<v ->And the next time
I call up Melanie C,</v>

01:24:40.990 --> 01:24:43.683
and extra speak if J. Rod C.

01:24:45.370 --> 01:24:48.420
<v ->So I came here
because like a lot of people</v>

01:24:48.420 --> 01:24:49.330
we saw suffering.

01:24:49.330 --> 01:24:52.350
And when I see suffering,
I see like powerful people

01:24:52.350 --> 01:24:54.170
not act out on that suffering.

01:24:54.170 --> 01:24:55.030
That pisses me off.

01:24:55.030 --> 01:24:56.798
So I got to do something about it.

01:24:56.798 --> 01:24:57.631
So that's why I'm here.

01:24:57.631 --> 01:24:59.060
I think a big thing is like,

01:24:59.060 --> 01:25:01.940
the public, you know,
insurance needs to be held

01:25:01.940 --> 01:25:03.469
at the forefront of everything.

01:25:03.469 --> 01:25:05.370
And that's something
that I did not see at all.

01:25:05.370 --> 01:25:08.530
I saw nothing about
the lives that were lost.

01:25:08.530 --> 01:25:11.470
I hear a lot about money, I
hear a lot of blah-blah-blah,

01:25:11.470 --> 01:25:13.350
but I don't hear a lot about the lives.

01:25:13.350 --> 01:25:16.790
Over 700 and plus people died in Texas.

01:25:16.790 --> 01:25:18.040
That's just what's recorded.

01:25:18.040 --> 01:25:20.970
And the state will only
acknowledge 150 of them,

01:25:20.970 --> 01:25:21.803
is bullshot.

01:25:21.803 --> 01:25:23.010
I just keep hearing money and money.

01:25:23.010 --> 01:25:24.540
I keep hearing all this talk,

01:25:24.540 --> 01:25:26.350
but I don't hear about
the actual human cost

01:25:26.350 --> 01:25:27.450
of what went down,

01:25:27.450 --> 01:25:31.160
and what's going to go down
at a future climate disasters.

01:25:31.160 --> 01:25:32.010
Right?

01:25:32.010 --> 01:25:33.660
Because this isn't just some accident.

01:25:33.660 --> 01:25:35.250
It's not some natural disaster.

01:25:35.250 --> 01:25:37.300
This is profit over people.

01:25:37.300 --> 01:25:38.280
That's what we're seeing.

01:25:38.280 --> 01:25:41.880
We're seeing these companies,
they're hold at the forefront.

01:25:41.880 --> 01:25:43.780
Not the communities that lost.

01:25:43.780 --> 01:25:45.400
During that winter freeze,

01:25:45.400 --> 01:25:46.930
there were communities
in Austin that were black.

01:25:46.930 --> 01:25:48.960
They were black out for extensive

01:25:48.960 --> 01:25:50.680
for over a week in some places,

01:25:50.680 --> 01:25:52.680
while these big corporations downtown

01:25:52.680 --> 01:25:56.481
were glowed up like Christmas
lights, with nobody in them.

01:25:56.481 --> 01:25:59.610
The city of Austin did very
little to actually help people

01:25:59.610 --> 01:26:01.410
get people that were houseless

01:26:01.410 --> 01:26:02.883
and that were in need in communities

01:26:02.883 --> 01:26:03.870
get the services they needed.

01:26:03.870 --> 01:26:05.850
The people of Austin
had to come together.

01:26:05.850 --> 01:26:08.430
Mutual aid groups, people
like that you see out here,

01:26:08.430 --> 01:26:09.860
not anybody up top.

01:26:09.860 --> 01:26:11.410
No one at top did a dam thing.

01:26:11.410 --> 01:26:12.850
They just set aside away to...

01:26:12.850 --> 01:26:15.630
They set a June 1st
as a day to recognize

01:26:15.630 --> 01:26:17.493
the people of Austin that
stood up to help people

01:26:17.493 --> 01:26:18.620
that were in need.

01:26:18.620 --> 01:26:20.320
I had friends that were
out giving transportation.

01:26:20.320 --> 01:26:22.140
They were putting
their own lives at the risk

01:26:22.140 --> 01:26:23.900
in the middle of pandemic, icy roads,

01:26:23.900 --> 01:26:25.750
to get people where they needed to go.

01:26:25.750 --> 01:26:28.190
Basically the bottom line is
this profit of where people.

01:26:28.190 --> 01:26:30.220
And this system, I don't
care about these numbers,

01:26:30.220 --> 01:26:32.100
these numbers money, it's
not even backed by anything.

01:26:32.100 --> 01:26:33.210
And we all know it.

01:26:33.210 --> 01:26:34.043
We all know it.

01:26:34.043 --> 01:26:35.750
Money's bullshot and what really matters

01:26:35.750 --> 01:26:37.230
is the people's lives, the people.

01:26:37.230 --> 01:26:40.250
And that's not the forefront
of any of y'all's decision,

01:26:40.250 --> 01:26:41.083
it's very clear,

01:26:41.083 --> 01:26:42.470
and that's why I mean, it's disgusting.

01:26:42.470 --> 01:26:44.812
And you know, so I don't really,

01:26:44.812 --> 01:26:45.645
I don't really what ended off with,

01:26:45.645 --> 01:26:47.500
public interest needs
to be held to forefront.

01:26:47.500 --> 01:26:48.380
And y'all aren't doing that.

01:26:48.380 --> 01:26:49.550
Y'all seem to not care at all.

01:26:49.550 --> 01:26:52.113
So human life over profit.

01:26:53.850 --> 01:26:54.910
<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

01:26:54.910 --> 01:26:57.270
<v ->Next up I'll call
Chelsea Tobin,</v>

01:26:57.270 --> 01:26:59.463
and next to speak is Melanie C.

01:27:00.730 --> 01:27:02.010
<v ->Power to the people.</v>

01:27:02.010 --> 01:27:02.843
I love y'all.

01:27:10.428 --> 01:27:13.020
<v ->When I see this room,
I actually feel really sad,</v>

01:27:13.020 --> 01:27:16.880
'cause again, all I heard back
then it was only money talk.

01:27:16.880 --> 01:27:18.580
I didn't hear a thing about people.

01:27:18.580 --> 01:27:21.190
The people that lost their
lives, their loved ones are here,

01:27:21.190 --> 01:27:22.230
they're talking for them.

01:27:22.230 --> 01:27:24.670
And y'all, I see you on your phone,

01:27:24.670 --> 01:27:26.560
I see y'all not really paying attention

01:27:26.560 --> 01:27:28.040
or active listening to these people

01:27:28.040 --> 01:27:29.990
who are pleading for help.

01:27:29.990 --> 01:27:32.300
They're pleading for your help.

01:27:32.300 --> 01:27:33.870
They want you to care.

01:27:33.870 --> 01:27:35.290
They want you to care about them.

01:27:35.290 --> 01:27:36.910
They want you to care
about the people around them.

01:27:36.910 --> 01:27:39.130
They want you to care about their lives.

01:27:39.130 --> 01:27:41.370
They don't care about money.

01:27:41.370 --> 01:27:43.460
They want you to care about
the people who are here.

01:27:43.460 --> 01:27:45.140
Their loved ones.

01:27:45.140 --> 01:27:47.870
They don't have lives,
and y'all didn't care.

01:27:47.870 --> 01:27:49.100
Again, some hundred people die

01:27:49.100 --> 01:27:52.143
and only 200 of them got accounted for.

01:27:53.100 --> 01:27:55.323
What about the homeless people too?

01:27:56.420 --> 01:27:57.253
What about the...

01:27:57.253 --> 01:28:01.630
Like, the people who were
the most affected by this?

01:28:01.630 --> 01:28:02.613
What about them?

01:28:05.870 --> 01:28:07.450
I didn't get anything from y'all.

01:28:07.450 --> 01:28:08.420
Nothing.

01:28:08.420 --> 01:28:11.430
Not a single ounce
of care for the people.

01:28:11.430 --> 01:28:13.453
I only hear about care about money.

01:28:16.130 --> 01:28:17.193
And what is that?

01:28:18.060 --> 01:28:19.280
Just think about yourself.

01:28:19.280 --> 01:28:20.750
Think about what you're
doing to these people.

01:28:20.750 --> 01:28:22.350
Think about the lives you guys

01:28:22.350 --> 01:28:24.000
are putting that risk over money.

01:28:25.010 --> 01:28:26.480
Y'all are losing people's lives.

01:28:26.480 --> 01:28:27.900
How many more lives does it have to lose

01:28:27.900 --> 01:28:30.410
before you all actually care?

01:28:30.410 --> 01:28:34.320
How many more lives
have to die for y'all to care?

01:28:34.320 --> 01:28:38.060
We want y'all to care
about people's lives.

01:28:38.060 --> 01:28:41.743
Y'all are just playing
with them over money.

01:28:43.110 --> 01:28:43.943
Thank you.

01:28:45.977 --> 01:28:46.810
<v ->Thank you, ma'am.</v>

01:28:48.968 --> 01:28:52.452
Next, I would call up Tanya Benevidez,

01:28:52.452 --> 01:28:57.033
and next to speak is Chelsea Tobin.

01:28:58.540 --> 01:29:00.140
<v ->Hello, good morning, everyone.</v>

01:29:01.656 --> 01:29:02.830
Oh, at this point,
it's almost afternoon.

01:29:02.830 --> 01:29:04.490
Good afternoon.

01:29:04.490 --> 01:29:07.000
My name is Chelsea
Tobin, and I'm a staff director

01:29:07.000 --> 01:29:09.450
at Texas Campaign for the Environment.

01:29:09.450 --> 01:29:11.520
I'm also a resident of Austin, Texas.

01:29:11.520 --> 01:29:14.140
And I'm here today
because my community and I

01:29:14.140 --> 01:29:16.956
suffered during winter
storm Uri last year.

01:29:16.956 --> 01:29:20.820
I want to ensure that what
happened last February

01:29:20.820 --> 01:29:22.473
to Texans never happens again.

01:29:23.960 --> 01:29:25.390
I just read your mission statement

01:29:25.390 --> 01:29:28.040
that's hanging out in the
hallway, out by the elevators.

01:29:28.040 --> 01:29:30.170
And the phrase that stuck out to me

01:29:31.040 --> 01:29:34.000
is that the Commission's
philosophy is to be accountable

01:29:34.000 --> 01:29:36.483
to the people of Texas.

01:29:36.483 --> 01:29:38.260
During winter storm Uri,

01:29:38.260 --> 01:29:39.910
what at first was a fun, whoa,

01:29:39.910 --> 01:29:42.830
it's actually snowing in Texas, wild,

01:29:42.830 --> 01:29:45.060
quickly became a
steady sink into horror,

01:29:45.060 --> 01:29:48.740
as I realized the magnitude
of what was really happening.

01:29:48.740 --> 01:29:50.800
People were without heat, water,

01:29:50.800 --> 01:29:53.620
freezing some of them
to death in their homes,

01:29:53.620 --> 01:29:55.670
surrounded by their
families in the dark.

01:29:56.643 --> 01:30:00.060
Because of the need to
conserve my phone battery

01:30:00.060 --> 01:30:02.340
in the case of an even bigger emergency,

01:30:02.340 --> 01:30:04.730
I was hardly able to check
in with friends and family

01:30:04.730 --> 01:30:05.900
and make sure that they were okay

01:30:05.900 --> 01:30:07.550
and to tell them that I was okay.

01:30:08.540 --> 01:30:12.061
Even if I could see if they
needed help, what could I do?

01:30:12.061 --> 01:30:13.880
The roads recovered in ice.

01:30:13.880 --> 01:30:14.713
And even if I could get to them,

01:30:14.713 --> 01:30:16.010
could I really do anything to help?

01:30:16.010 --> 01:30:17.973
We were all in a crisis.

01:30:19.789 --> 01:30:21.420
So I was forced to sit and wait,

01:30:21.420 --> 01:30:23.300
dreading finding out
what was on the other side

01:30:23.300 --> 01:30:25.560
of the multiple days of
freezing temperatures.

01:30:25.560 --> 01:30:28.720
Here we were living
through yet another crisis

01:30:28.720 --> 01:30:29.620
during a pandemic

01:30:29.620 --> 01:30:31.750
where we recently
reached the grizzly figure

01:30:31.750 --> 01:30:34.347
of 800,000 American lives lost,

01:30:34.347 --> 01:30:37.793
a number in loss I feel we
are unable to truly comprehend.

01:30:39.607 --> 01:30:40.880
I don't know about you,

01:30:40.880 --> 01:30:43.360
but the grief of that
feels really heavy to me.

01:30:43.360 --> 01:30:45.680
So in addition to that, I was stuck,

01:30:45.680 --> 01:30:46.880
freezing in my own home,

01:30:46.880 --> 01:30:49.680
hoping that we would survive
all this on the other side.

01:30:50.690 --> 01:30:51.950
If you were accountable to the people,

01:30:51.950 --> 01:30:54.630
as you say you are in your
mission statement, hear us today.

01:30:54.630 --> 01:30:58.790
We are here despite having
work, lives, families, hear us.

01:30:58.790 --> 01:31:01.550
Many of the Texans who share
our demands couldn't be here,

01:31:01.550 --> 01:31:03.600
but we have names
of folks who are with us

01:31:03.600 --> 01:31:06.069
in holding you accountable
to your mission statement

01:31:06.069 --> 01:31:07.793
back here on the power lines.

01:31:08.720 --> 01:31:12.240
Fix the Texas grid with
people-focused solutions.

01:31:12.240 --> 01:31:14.130
You have public in your name.

01:31:14.130 --> 01:31:15.430
Live up to it.

01:31:15.430 --> 01:31:17.720
Include us in the
decision-making and the solutions.

01:31:17.720 --> 01:31:18.553
Thank you.

01:31:19.877 --> 01:31:21.410
<v ->Thank you, ma'am.</v>

01:31:21.410 --> 01:31:24.303
<v ->Next, I would call up
Jacqueline (indistinct )Ilana,</v>

01:31:25.290 --> 01:31:28.317
and next to speak is Tanya Benevidez.

01:31:29.941 --> 01:31:33.858
(speaking in foreign language)

01:33:36.360 --> 01:33:37.409
<v ->Thank you, ma'am.</v>

01:33:37.409 --> 01:33:39.934
<v ->Next I will call
up Janice Todd,</v>

01:33:39.934 --> 01:33:42.034
and next to speak is
Jacqueline Cynthiana.

01:33:47.390 --> 01:33:49.253
The next up Janice Tom.

01:33:52.840 --> 01:33:54.960
<v ->Hi, my name is
Jacqueline Cynthiana,</v>

01:33:54.960 --> 01:33:58.030
and I'm a fourth year
college student at UT Austin.

01:33:58.030 --> 01:34:00.640
I'm here today because my
experience with the winter storm

01:34:00.640 --> 01:34:02.901
was traumatic to say the least.

01:34:02.901 --> 01:34:04.890
I come from a low income family

01:34:04.890 --> 01:34:08.480
and events like this have
the potential of killing us.

01:34:08.480 --> 01:34:10.000
At the start of the winter storm,

01:34:10.000 --> 01:34:11.660
I was in my apartment alone

01:34:11.660 --> 01:34:14.360
with limited resources in Riverside,

01:34:14.360 --> 01:34:17.230
and my family was in
the Rio Grande Valley.

01:34:17.230 --> 01:34:19.430
I wasn't expecting to
have the lights to be off

01:34:19.430 --> 01:34:21.580
for four days in Riverside.

01:34:21.580 --> 01:34:22.920
During the span of three days,

01:34:22.920 --> 01:34:24.500
I stayed at my neighbors next door

01:34:24.500 --> 01:34:26.430
and shared supplies with her.

01:34:26.430 --> 01:34:29.400
I wasn't able to reach out
to my family the first day,

01:34:29.400 --> 01:34:31.340
and I was worried that
my dad wouldn't be able

01:34:31.340 --> 01:34:32.600
to go to dialysis,

01:34:32.600 --> 01:34:35.680
or that my mom would
need her oxygen tank.

01:34:35.680 --> 01:34:38.320
I had power for three
hours on the second day,

01:34:38.320 --> 01:34:41.450
and in that time I reached
out to my friends and my family

01:34:41.450 --> 01:34:43.480
to let them know I'm safe.

01:34:43.480 --> 01:34:45.950
Every night, I cried myself
to sleep from the cold

01:34:45.950 --> 01:34:48.270
and the anxiety I had.

01:34:48.270 --> 01:34:50.800
Wednesday was the last
day I stayed with my neighbor

01:34:50.800 --> 01:34:53.830
because I had to help her
call an ambulance for her.

01:34:53.830 --> 01:34:56.130
My friend living in
Riverside picked me up

01:34:56.130 --> 01:34:57.740
and took me to her place

01:34:57.740 --> 01:35:00.440
which had electricity the entire time.

01:35:00.440 --> 01:35:02.580
I felt privileged knowing I was okay,

01:35:02.580 --> 01:35:05.650
and all I wanted to do
was help everybody else.

01:35:05.650 --> 01:35:08.690
I still cried myself to sleep
for a month after the storm.

01:35:08.690 --> 01:35:12.370
And every time I retold
the story during the summer,

01:35:12.370 --> 01:35:15.900
I got Bell's palsy, not knowing
what could have caused it.

01:35:15.900 --> 01:35:19.180
The emotions I had come
cited with the physical pain.

01:35:19.180 --> 01:35:21.760
And it made it much
more difficult to heal.

01:35:21.760 --> 01:35:23.800
Even preparing to speak to you today,

01:35:23.800 --> 01:35:26.830
I can still feel the same
level of intensity of feelings

01:35:26.830 --> 01:35:29.360
and emotions during the winter storm.

01:35:29.360 --> 01:35:31.100
I've had to seek mental health services

01:35:31.100 --> 01:35:34.250
to pick myself back up
from what had happened.

01:35:34.250 --> 01:35:37.420
I asked that you address
the equity concerns

01:35:37.420 --> 01:35:38.813
of where the power went out,

01:35:38.813 --> 01:35:41.400
that you listened to
community organizations

01:35:41.400 --> 01:35:44.450
and community leaders that
have been working for months

01:35:44.450 --> 01:35:45.590
to empower people,

01:35:45.590 --> 01:35:47.650
and then you expand public comments

01:35:47.650 --> 01:35:51.430
so that more college students
like me can give their piece.

01:35:51.430 --> 01:35:52.630
Thank you for your time.

01:35:53.720 --> 01:35:54.900
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:35:54.900 --> 01:35:56.880
<v ->I would call up next Emma Pat,</v>

01:35:56.880 --> 01:35:59.653
and next to speak is Janice Tom.

01:36:02.240 --> 01:36:03.903
<v ->Hi, it's James Talent.</v>

01:36:05.480 --> 01:36:08.390
So I'm here with Extinction Rebellion.

01:36:08.390 --> 01:36:10.583
It's a really great
activist organization.

01:36:11.470 --> 01:36:13.390
All we want is for
people to tell the truth

01:36:13.390 --> 01:36:14.270
about climate change

01:36:14.270 --> 01:36:18.669
and stop being
involved with fossil fuels.

01:36:18.669 --> 01:36:21.680
I really think that energy
efficiency in homes

01:36:21.680 --> 01:36:26.210
is an easy way that y'all
directly have access to help with.

01:36:26.210 --> 01:36:27.043
And it would be awesome

01:36:27.043 --> 01:36:29.484
just to see a little
more emphasis on that.

01:36:29.484 --> 01:36:33.105
We have a lot of incoming
crisises with heat waves.

01:36:33.105 --> 01:36:36.390
The movement of the polar vortex

01:36:36.390 --> 01:36:37.810
is because of climate change.

01:36:37.810 --> 01:36:39.710
That's why we had this winter storm.

01:36:39.710 --> 01:36:40.810
And it's great to know

01:36:40.810 --> 01:36:43.650
that we're gonna probably
experience more of that.

01:36:43.650 --> 01:36:46.621
So just be good to see
like a little more resilience.

01:36:46.621 --> 01:36:50.020
I don't think most people are
aware of how all that works.

01:36:50.020 --> 01:36:52.710
So just more research in that.

01:36:52.710 --> 01:36:54.410
I'm also here because personally,

01:36:54.410 --> 01:36:56.480
me and 45 other people I know

01:36:56.480 --> 01:36:59.653
were all like directly
affected by that winter storm.

01:37:00.610 --> 01:37:02.460
And the further away
they were from the city,

01:37:02.460 --> 01:37:04.160
the more of the damage they had.

01:37:04.160 --> 01:37:07.530
I had a friend who was
like out in the boonies,

01:37:07.530 --> 01:37:11.770
and she had her bathtub
filled with water from snow

01:37:11.770 --> 01:37:13.720
that she melted and
she sent a picture of it,

01:37:13.720 --> 01:37:16.200
and it looked like a pond.

01:37:16.200 --> 01:37:17.462
And she was like,

01:37:17.462 --> 01:37:19.210
this is the worst bath
bomb I've ever had.

01:37:19.210 --> 01:37:21.420
And that's 'cause it was all snow.

01:37:21.420 --> 01:37:25.150
And basically I saw a lot of
people on my neighborhood,

01:37:25.150 --> 01:37:27.690
on next door, they were
using a social media

01:37:27.690 --> 01:37:29.280
just to get to connect to each other,

01:37:29.280 --> 01:37:30.113
to help each other out.

01:37:30.113 --> 01:37:32.840
A lot of people were
driving each other around

01:37:32.840 --> 01:37:35.653
in dangerous conditions,
also during a pandemic.

01:37:36.830 --> 01:37:38.690
So I just feel like
you're not gonna be able

01:37:38.690 --> 01:37:40.500
to hear these stories
if you're closed off

01:37:40.500 --> 01:37:43.400
in the decision-making or if
you expedite decision-making.

01:37:44.290 --> 01:37:46.230
And there's gonna
be a lot of great input.

01:37:46.230 --> 01:37:47.270
Like I learned about a bunch

01:37:47.270 --> 01:37:49.400
just from hearing all
these stories today

01:37:49.400 --> 01:37:50.860
just from people
like different insights.

01:37:50.860 --> 01:37:52.370
Like my girlfriend has diabetes,

01:37:52.370 --> 01:37:55.040
and she's told me like,
during the winter storm for her,

01:37:55.040 --> 01:37:57.370
she literally like was
worried about dying,

01:37:57.370 --> 01:37:59.540
'cause how are you
supposed to get insulin

01:37:59.540 --> 01:38:01.270
if like everything's closed
off, there's no power?

01:38:01.270 --> 01:38:04.150
Like, fortunately she's
figured out how to save it,

01:38:04.150 --> 01:38:06.740
but like, it's just these considerations

01:38:06.740 --> 01:38:07.573
you can't really hear.

01:38:07.573 --> 01:38:09.010
And another thing is accessibility.

01:38:09.010 --> 01:38:12.610
Like, we did video calls
with transcripts yesterday

01:38:12.610 --> 01:38:14.690
for our hard of hearing members.

01:38:14.690 --> 01:38:16.410
And like, that's not even
something I consider,

01:38:16.410 --> 01:38:17.440
'cause I'm not hard of hearing.

01:38:17.440 --> 01:38:19.650
But like, you know, and
then there's Spanish speakers,

01:38:19.650 --> 01:38:22.160
there's like a lot of accessibility
things we could work on.

01:38:22.160 --> 01:38:23.623
So thank you for your time.

01:38:24.561 --> 01:38:25.930
<v ->Thank you.</v>

01:38:25.930 --> 01:38:28.570
<v ->I would call up
next Shane Johnson,</v>

01:38:28.570 --> 01:38:30.773
and next to speak is Emma Pat.

01:38:37.520 --> 01:38:40.120
<v ->Could I pass these along
to y'all somehow, please.</v>

01:38:41.280 --> 01:38:43.983
<v ->Sure, we'll have Steph
put those in the record.</v>

01:38:45.452 --> 01:38:47.280
Officially in the record.

01:38:47.280 --> 01:38:49.980
<v ->And good afternoon, Chairman
Lake and Commissioners.</v>

01:38:50.840 --> 01:38:53.020
Thank you for having us today.

01:38:53.020 --> 01:38:54.050
My name is Emma Pat,

01:38:54.050 --> 01:38:56.790
and I am a campaign
representative with the Sierra Club,

01:38:56.790 --> 01:38:58.440
where I work to represent the interests

01:38:58.440 --> 01:39:01.280
of thousands of Texans across the state.

01:39:01.280 --> 01:39:04.940
We're here today to deliver
over 3,500 petition signatures

01:39:04.940 --> 01:39:06.700
that we collected as an organization,

01:39:06.700 --> 01:39:09.940
which also include hundreds of
personal messages and stories

01:39:09.940 --> 01:39:12.490
from people across the entire state,

01:39:12.490 --> 01:39:15.300
urging you to listen
to the people of Texas

01:39:15.300 --> 01:39:18.610
and build an energy grid
that works first and foremost

01:39:18.610 --> 01:39:20.093
for our communities.

01:39:21.330 --> 01:39:22.970
Between everything
that's been said today,

01:39:22.970 --> 01:39:25.780
I think our message today is clear;

01:39:25.780 --> 01:39:28.960
first that the fossil fuel
industry left us to die

01:39:28.960 --> 01:39:30.340
during the freeze.

01:39:30.340 --> 01:39:34.090
Gas companies made
$11 billion that week,

01:39:34.090 --> 01:39:38.143
while Texans froze in
their houses, in their homes.

01:39:39.460 --> 01:39:42.100
Secondly, once again,
the reports have shown

01:39:42.100 --> 01:39:45.760
that frozen gas wells,
pipelines and power plants

01:39:45.760 --> 01:39:49.960
were the primary causes
of the electricity shortages.

01:39:49.960 --> 01:39:52.440
Last time this happened in 2011,

01:39:52.440 --> 01:39:54.450
they told us they had it under control,

01:39:54.450 --> 01:39:57.130
not to worry, that it was fixed.

01:39:57.130 --> 01:40:01.100
In February, so many
Texans learned the hard way

01:40:01.100 --> 01:40:03.620
that that was false.

01:40:03.620 --> 01:40:05.320
We need two things.

01:40:05.320 --> 01:40:08.357
First, is we need y'all
to come up with solutions

01:40:08.357 --> 01:40:12.900
for our energy grid that don't
force us to put more money

01:40:12.900 --> 01:40:15.760
as consumers into the
pockets of the same gas

01:40:15.760 --> 01:40:18.920
and coal companies
that failed us in February.

01:40:18.920 --> 01:40:22.010
We shouldn't bail them out
for the mistakes that they made.

01:40:22.010 --> 01:40:25.050
We should create an energy
system that works for everybody.

01:40:25.050 --> 01:40:27.030
And in this case, that
means stepping away

01:40:27.030 --> 01:40:29.010
from the companies that we can't trust

01:40:29.010 --> 01:40:32.820
to meet our bottom
line, which is electricity.

01:40:32.820 --> 01:40:35.490
Secondly, we need
solutions that we can feel,

01:40:35.490 --> 01:40:37.820
that we can recognize in our homes.

01:40:37.820 --> 01:40:41.660
We need solutions where
even if the power grid fails,

01:40:41.660 --> 01:40:44.770
we have insulation in our
homes to keep them warm.

01:40:44.770 --> 01:40:45.850
We have better windows

01:40:45.850 --> 01:40:48.110
to make sure that heat
stays trapped inside.

01:40:48.110 --> 01:40:50.320
And we have renewable
energy on our roofs

01:40:50.320 --> 01:40:53.630
to help add that power to the
grid and keep things running.

01:40:53.630 --> 01:40:56.430
We need solutions
that start with people,

01:40:56.430 --> 01:40:59.530
and we need more public input
in order to make that happen.

01:40:59.530 --> 01:41:01.210
Thank you very much.

01:41:01.210 --> 01:41:02.150
<v ->Thank you, ma'am.</v>

01:41:02.150 --> 01:41:04.620
<v ->I would call up
next, Amber England,</v>

01:41:04.620 --> 01:41:07.423
and next to speak is Shane Johnson.

01:41:08.632 --> 01:41:09.930
<v ->Can y'all hear me?</v>

01:41:09.930 --> 01:41:11.120
All right.

01:41:11.120 --> 01:41:13.150
Thank you for having us.

01:41:13.150 --> 01:41:14.530
Shane Johnson, he/him pronouns.

01:41:14.530 --> 01:41:17.050
I'm an organizer with Sierra Club.

01:41:17.050 --> 01:41:18.073
So like many here before me,

01:41:18.073 --> 01:41:20.070
I wanna talk about public participation

01:41:20.070 --> 01:41:21.910
and energy efficiency.

01:41:21.910 --> 01:41:24.475
Energy efficiency will save lives

01:41:24.475 --> 01:41:27.013
in the next winter
storm that will happen,

01:41:27.924 --> 01:41:31.220
and it'll help lower people's bills.

01:41:31.220 --> 01:41:33.740
In addition, some
policy experts say that

01:41:33.740 --> 01:41:37.300
a moderate energy
efficiency increase to 1%

01:41:37.300 --> 01:41:40.990
could have reduced
blackouts by up to 50%.

01:41:40.990 --> 01:41:41.900
And so that has to be

01:41:41.900 --> 01:41:45.347
one of our foremost leading solutions.

01:41:48.310 --> 01:41:52.281
And a few folks before me
mentioned that energy efficiency

01:41:52.281 --> 01:41:55.630
or the demand side is really
about people and the public.

01:41:55.630 --> 01:42:00.140
And frankly, the public
engagement for this mercury design

01:42:00.140 --> 01:42:02.730
has been shameful and non-existent.

01:42:02.730 --> 01:42:04.900
Invite only workshops
without the public,

01:42:04.900 --> 01:42:08.113
and then four days of
public input is inexcusable.

01:42:09.640 --> 01:42:11.640
If you don't implement energy efficiency

01:42:11.640 --> 01:42:15.260
specifically guided or informed
by people across the state,

01:42:15.260 --> 01:42:16.970
then you have not fixed the grid.

01:42:16.970 --> 01:42:17.803
Period.

01:42:18.680 --> 01:42:20.880
In addition to this, I wanna talk about

01:42:20.880 --> 01:42:22.913
the cost of the proposals before you.

01:42:24.250 --> 01:42:28.850
We have to highlight how
bills are already going to go up

01:42:28.850 --> 01:42:31.063
from securitization if
the legislature pass.

01:42:32.200 --> 01:42:33.730
And we have to understand that,

01:42:33.730 --> 01:42:36.820
these increases, many
people will not be able to afford.

01:42:36.820 --> 01:42:39.750
And on top of this, independent
analysis has estimated

01:42:39.750 --> 01:42:43.160
some of the costs of some of
these proposals in front of you

01:42:43.160 --> 01:42:45.790
ranging from hundreds of
millions to billions of dollars,

01:42:45.790 --> 01:42:48.483
to over $1 billion, $1 billion.

01:42:50.252 --> 01:42:52.140
Those are massive increases

01:42:52.140 --> 01:42:54.240
that we can't afford
to pass on to people.

01:42:55.840 --> 01:42:58.710
So, what we have to do

01:42:58.710 --> 01:43:00.400
is that you cannot
make a decision today.

01:43:00.400 --> 01:43:02.420
You cannot make a
decision on this blueprint

01:43:02.420 --> 01:43:05.460
until after hearing from
the people of Texas.

01:43:05.460 --> 01:43:07.030
And that means things like conducting

01:43:07.030 --> 01:43:09.850
multiple public hearings
across the state,

01:43:09.850 --> 01:43:11.450
and all future workshops should include

01:43:11.450 --> 01:43:14.060
a significant portion
for the public input.

01:43:14.060 --> 01:43:16.690
You need to start being
accountable to the people of Texas.

01:43:16.690 --> 01:43:18.090
Thank you.

01:43:18.090 --> 01:43:19.153
<v ->Thank you, sir.</v>

01:43:21.300 --> 01:43:22.133
Mr. Dre.

01:43:26.864 --> 01:43:31.470
<v ->I thought I'd called
up Mr. Shane Johnson,</v>

01:43:31.470 --> 01:43:33.770
but if I hadn't, I'm probably about now.

01:43:33.770 --> 01:43:36.053
And next to speak then is Amber England.

01:43:39.200 --> 01:43:40.300
<v ->Good morning.</v>

01:43:40.300 --> 01:43:42.780
My name is Amber
England, and I'm an organizer

01:43:42.780 --> 01:43:45.680
with Texas Campaign for the Environment.

01:43:45.680 --> 01:43:48.170
This is my first time
giving public oral comment,

01:43:48.170 --> 01:43:49.870
and I'm shaking in my boots,

01:43:49.870 --> 01:43:52.540
but not as much as when
it got down to 30 degrees

01:43:52.540 --> 01:43:54.200
in my apartment.

01:43:54.200 --> 01:43:56.440
I'm testifying today
because the grid failure

01:43:56.440 --> 01:43:58.770
earlier this year was
a preventable failure

01:43:58.770 --> 01:44:01.270
that killed hundreds of people.

01:44:01.270 --> 01:44:04.400
I was in San Marcus in my
apartment when the storm hit.

01:44:04.400 --> 01:44:06.930
My power and water
went off for four days.

01:44:06.930 --> 01:44:09.900
But even so I feel so lucky.

01:44:09.900 --> 01:44:11.200
During the legislative session,

01:44:11.200 --> 01:44:13.820
I organized constituents
affected by the grid failure

01:44:13.820 --> 01:44:15.980
to speak with
representatives and senators

01:44:15.980 --> 01:44:17.740
to demand our legislature

01:44:17.740 --> 01:44:20.630
to prioritize weatherizing our grid.

01:44:20.630 --> 01:44:24.050
The stories I heard from
constituents were heartbreaking.

01:44:24.050 --> 01:44:26.210
People lost loved ones, pets,

01:44:26.210 --> 01:44:29.360
and suffered from extreme
damages to their homes.

01:44:29.360 --> 01:44:31.730
It was unacceptable, preventable,

01:44:31.730 --> 01:44:34.700
and we cannot be left in the dark again.

01:44:34.700 --> 01:44:37.680
I'm asking the public
utility Commission today

01:44:37.680 --> 01:44:40.650
to ensure that the gas
companies that profited billions

01:44:40.650 --> 01:44:41.900
during the storm,

01:44:41.900 --> 01:44:44.840
aren't allowed to write
the rules for the next storm.

01:44:44.840 --> 01:44:48.060
And I'm asking that you ensure
that we are providing energy

01:44:48.060 --> 01:44:51.970
efficient investments that
benefit you and the planet.

01:44:51.970 --> 01:44:54.540
Renewable energy technologies like solar

01:44:54.540 --> 01:44:57.670
helps generate power when plants fail.

01:44:57.670 --> 01:45:00.720
Wind energy is low
cost and doesn't pollute.

01:45:00.720 --> 01:45:03.330
And the public utility
Commission must prioritize

01:45:03.330 --> 01:45:05.650
renewable resources and the grid fix,

01:45:05.650 --> 01:45:07.930
because it provides reliable energy

01:45:07.930 --> 01:45:10.080
and gives justice to the people.

01:45:10.080 --> 01:45:10.913
Thank you.

01:45:12.161 --> 01:45:13.607
<v ->Thank you ma'am.</v>

01:45:15.230 --> 01:45:16.480
<v ->Mr. Shane Johnson here.</v>

01:45:18.057 --> 01:45:18.920
<v Man>He already spoke.</v>

01:45:18.920 --> 01:45:20.178
<v ->He already left.</v>

01:45:20.178 --> 01:45:21.685
We were at the end of the list, sir.

01:45:21.685 --> 01:45:22.819
<v Shane>I already spoke.</v>

01:45:22.819 --> 01:45:26.410
<v ->Oh, you already
spoke, I'm sorry.</v>

01:45:26.410 --> 01:45:27.243
<v ->All right.</v>

01:45:27.243 --> 01:45:29.170
<v ->We're at the
end of the list, sir.</v>

01:45:29.170 --> 01:45:31.480
<v ->That is the entire list of
people who have signed up</v>

01:45:31.480 --> 01:45:34.681
to speak during the
public comment session,

01:45:34.681 --> 01:45:37.540
part of this session.

01:45:37.540 --> 01:45:40.180
Appreciate all the speakers
and all the visitors today.

01:45:40.180 --> 01:45:43.363
Appreciate your input
into the public discourse.

01:45:44.900 --> 01:45:48.410
At this point, public
comment is now closed.

01:45:48.410 --> 01:45:49.660
And unless there's any other business

01:45:49.660 --> 01:45:51.320
you all wanna take up before our recess,

01:45:51.320 --> 01:45:53.823
I think this is a good time
to go ahead and recess.

01:45:54.800 --> 01:45:55.633
All right.

01:45:55.633 --> 01:45:57.460
This meeting of Public
Utility Commission of Texas

01:45:57.460 --> 01:45:59.493
is now recessed until 12:30 p.m.