WEBVTT 00:00:18.480 --> 00:00:20.839 Good morning. This meeting, the public utility commission of 00:00:20.839 --> 00:00:22.710 Texas will come to order to consider matters have been 00:00:22.710 --> 00:00:24.640 duly posted with the Secretary of State of Texas for 00:00:24.640 --> 00:00:28.329 29 September 2022. For the record, my name is Peter 00:00:28.329 --> 00:00:30.690 Lake with me today are Will McAdams Lori Cobos Jimmy 00:00:30.690 --> 00:00:34.520 Glotfelty and Kathleen Jackson. Uh, we've got a good 00:00:34.520 --> 00:00:37.189 amount to cover today, but before we get to our formal 00:00:37.200 --> 00:00:41.850 agenda, do want to recognize the impact hurricane Ian 00:00:41.850 --> 00:00:45.719 is having on florida right now. Uh, one of the hardest 00:00:45.719 --> 00:00:49.640 hitting hurricanes I think in in recent history. I 00:00:49.640 --> 00:00:51.579 know Texans are familiar with the devastation that 00:00:51.579 --> 00:00:55.939 can be wreaked in events like that. Obviously thoughts 00:00:55.939 --> 00:00:58.359 and prayers to those impacted hope everyone gets through 00:00:58.359 --> 00:01:01.840 it safely. Uh, I do want to recognize the multiple 00:01:01.840 --> 00:01:06.879 Texas utilities who have already sent lineman and cruise 00:01:06.890 --> 00:01:12.620 to pre stage in florida to be ready to help put lines 00:01:12.620 --> 00:01:16.930 back up in place as soon as the areas are clear, we're 00:01:16.939 --> 00:01:19.870 happy to help our neighbors. Uh, that's what Texans 00:01:19.870 --> 00:01:24.510 and americans do. Uh, and we, we uh, are in similar 00:01:24.510 --> 00:01:27.269 situations, sometimes two, sometimes when hurricanes 00:01:27.269 --> 00:01:30.640 hit our shores, we ask our neighbors for help too. 00:01:30.650 --> 00:01:34.109 So happy to help out florida uh, and wish the best 00:01:34.109 --> 00:01:37.269 to the crews who are on the ground there uh, from texas 00:01:37.269 --> 00:01:39.180 from florida, All the other states that are helping 00:01:39.180 --> 00:01:39.579 out 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:46.540 a couple agenda notes. We do have uh, this is a special 00:01:46.540 --> 00:01:49.069 meeting for commission rules and projects so we will 00:01:49.069 --> 00:01:52.439 not have public comment today and we will not be taking 00:01:52.439 --> 00:01:56.200 up item number one. Before we get to the formal programming 00:01:56.209 --> 00:02:00.099 Our executive Director has an update. Mr Thank you 00:02:00.099 --> 00:02:02.659 Mr Chairman and Commissioners. Good morning. Um you 00:02:02.659 --> 00:02:05.689 covered what I was gonna say first about the mutual 00:02:05.689 --> 00:02:07.969 assistance programs and and all the personnel that 00:02:07.980 --> 00:02:10.960 left here and went to florida and our thanks secondly 00:02:10.960 --> 00:02:14.150 thanks to our staff all over the agency to prepare 00:02:14.150 --> 00:02:16.770 for this meeting, to get these proposals on this 00:02:16.770 --> 00:02:21.189 agenda, took a herculean effort by staff all over this 00:02:21.189 --> 00:02:24.150 agency, just not in those particular subject matter 00:02:24.159 --> 00:02:27.289 divisions. And so I want to thank all staff for their 00:02:27.289 --> 00:02:29.849 efforts to get get this agenda prepared today and and 00:02:29.849 --> 00:02:33.490 all those proposals ready for your review and consideration 00:02:33.740 --> 00:02:36.659 And finally I want to recognize Shawn Hazard on our 00:02:36.659 --> 00:02:41.780 staff. So um you know, a few years ago I was able 00:02:41.780 --> 00:02:44.900 to convince our previous executive Director that it 00:02:44.900 --> 00:02:47.199 would be a good idea for this agency to start a tuition 00:02:47.199 --> 00:02:51.030 reimbursement program to help folks get their undergraduate 00:02:51.039 --> 00:02:55.009 and graduate degrees. Sean took us up on that and has 00:02:55.020 --> 00:02:57.840 come just an inch away from completing his degree at 00:02:57.840 --> 00:03:02.259 W. G. U. And I think it's a it's a testament to 00:03:02.259 --> 00:03:05.939 to him and to his dedication to continually improving 00:03:05.939 --> 00:03:09.969 himself and I think his uh shows what an agency can 00:03:09.979 --> 00:03:12.169 can really do when it helps out in its employees that 00:03:12.169 --> 00:03:14.680 are looking to improve, improve themselves And so I 00:03:14.680 --> 00:03:18.210 want to congratulate Sean on finishing his degree 00:03:26.500 --> 00:03:27.240 speech. 00:03:31.099 --> 00:03:33.560 Alright that will, thank you. Mr Gleason, that'll bring 00:03:33.560 --> 00:03:38.000 us to our consent agenda. Mr Journeay could you please walk 00:03:38.000 --> 00:03:41.189 us through that? Good morning Commissioners by individual 00:03:41.189 --> 00:03:43.789 ballot the following items were placed on your consent 00:03:43.789 --> 00:03:46.129 agenda. 2, 3, 4 and 9. 00:03:47.740 --> 00:03:49.939 Is there a motion to approve the items just described by Mr 00:03:49.939 --> 00:03:55.740 Journeay. Moved. Second. all in favor say aye, aye 00:03:56.129 --> 00:03:57.849 none opposed, motion passes 00:03:59.389 --> 00:04:03.580 uh brings us to our next item please. (item:5:52709) Mr Journeay next 00:04:03.580 --> 00:04:08.199 item is item five, docket 52709. It's compliance 00:04:08.199 --> 00:04:12.659 filing for docket 52321 which was ERCOTs debt 00:04:12.669 --> 00:04:16.129 obligation under subchapter M. ERCOT filed its first 00:04:16.129 --> 00:04:19.980 Annual True up under that sub chapter for its debt 00:04:19.980 --> 00:04:23.680 obligation order. All right, I'm recused from both 00:04:23.680 --> 00:04:28.550 this item and item six, So I will turn this over to 00:04:28.560 --> 00:04:32.350 commissioner McAdams. Great, thank you. Mr Chairman 00:04:32.360 --> 00:04:37.819 Um uh so as a part of agenda item number five, compliance 00:04:37.819 --> 00:04:40.860 filing for docket number 52321 application 00:04:40.860 --> 00:04:44.899 for ERCOT um for a debt obligation order, pursuant 00:04:44.899 --> 00:04:47.620 to chapter 39 Sub chapter M, of the public utility 00:04:47.620 --> 00:04:51.220 regulatory act. I believe there are two issues to take 00:04:51.220 --> 00:04:55.720 up here. Um First uh does ERCOTs first, quarterly True 00:04:55.720 --> 00:04:59.100 up filing, comply with PURA and does the dead obligation 00:04:59.100 --> 00:05:03.689 order, and second uh should we delegate authority to 00:05:03.689 --> 00:05:06.889 docket management for the for future compliance items 00:05:06.899 --> 00:05:11.439 like this ones. Um I welcome any thoughts. I certainly 00:05:11.439 --> 00:05:17.910 have some I think yes. Okay great. There's a degree 00:05:17.910 --> 00:05:21.819 of certainty to these filings, a regular cadence that 00:05:21.829 --> 00:05:24.319 this will be experience. So I think this is, is a prime 00:05:24.319 --> 00:05:28.759 target for delegation but yes, yes, I I you know these 00:05:28.759 --> 00:05:31.410 things are are ones that are best handled at the, at 00:05:31.410 --> 00:05:33.750 the staff level because they are going to be continuous 00:05:33.750 --> 00:05:37.180 over there for many, many years. So um I agree with 00:05:37.180 --> 00:05:40.300 you and I appreciate your leadership on this issue 00:05:40.310 --> 00:05:44.509 Thank you for that. Um So at this time I'll entertain 00:05:44.509 --> 00:05:47.740 a motion to find that ERCOT first quarterly true up 00:05:49.500 --> 00:05:52.589 Uh I'm sorry. Um 00:05:54.170 --> 00:05:57.589 Okay find that ERCOTs first annual true up filing 00:05:57.589 --> 00:06:00.529 is sufficient and complete uh and in compliance with 00:06:00.529 --> 00:06:03.040 PURA and the relevant provisions of the debt obligation 00:06:03.040 --> 00:06:06.720 order uh approve ERCOT proposed, revised of all charges 00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:09.670 as filed effective starting with the November 2022 00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:13.860 building period and delegate authority to docket 00:06:13.860 --> 00:06:16.279 management to address compliance dockets like this 00:06:16.279 --> 00:06:19.889 one. Uh additionally direct O. P. D. M. To draft an 00:06:19.889 --> 00:06:23.639 order accordingly, I'd entertain that motion so moved 00:06:23.649 --> 00:06:27.399 go have a second, all those in favor say aye, I all 00:06:27.399 --> 00:06:35.569 those opposed motion passes. (item:6:52710) Um Next up uh agenda item 00:06:35.579 --> 00:06:40.569 number six, docket number 52710 Mr Journeay uh 00:06:40.579 --> 00:06:43.920 walk us through that uh 52710, it's compliance 00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:48.680 filing for docket 52322 which is uh ERCOT 00:06:48.800 --> 00:06:52.709 debt obligation under sub chapter N, uh they filed 00:06:52.709 --> 00:06:57.120 their first quarterly Troop. Okay uh members similar 00:06:57.120 --> 00:06:59.930 to the previous docket there are two issues here. Uh 00:06:59.939 --> 00:07:04.310 First is ERCOT first, quarterly true up filing comply 00:07:04.310 --> 00:07:07.490 with PURA and the debt obligation order. And second 00:07:07.490 --> 00:07:09.769 should we delegate authority to docket management for 00:07:09.769 --> 00:07:14.350 future compliance items like this one. Um and I agree 00:07:14.360 --> 00:07:17.910 um any other discussion members? Yeah, I think it's 00:07:17.910 --> 00:07:22.329 clear it's yes and yes. Okay, great. Um at this time 00:07:22.329 --> 00:07:25.100 I'll understand a motion finding that ERCOT its first 00:07:25.100 --> 00:07:27.560 quarterly Tru up filing is sufficient. Complete. And 00:07:27.560 --> 00:07:30.029 in compliance with PURA and the relevant provisions 00:07:30.029 --> 00:07:33.120 of the debt obligation order, I'd also approve ERCOT 00:07:33.129 --> 00:07:36.269 proposed daily uplift charges has filed effective starting 00:07:36.279 --> 00:07:40.029 with the november 2022 building period, delegate authority 00:07:40.029 --> 00:07:42.490 to docket management to address compliance dockets 00:07:42.490 --> 00:07:45.120 like this one and direct O P D. M to draft an 00:07:45.120 --> 00:07:47.620 order accordingly at this time I'd entertain that motion 00:07:49.069 --> 00:07:53.019 all those in favor say aye, I all those opposed motion 00:07:53.019 --> 00:07:53.680 passes. 00:07:55.240 --> 00:07:58.129 Okay. Mr Chairman, I will yield back to you sir. 00:08:07.889 --> 00:08:11.870 All right, thank you, efficient work. Uh Next time 00:08:11.870 --> 00:08:14.850 please, Mr Journeay. (item:7:46304) Next item's, item seven, project 00:08:14.850 --> 00:08:19.259 46304. It's oversight proceeding regarding ERCOT 00:08:19.259 --> 00:08:23.949 matters arising out of docket 45624 which was an application 00:08:23.949 --> 00:08:27.899 the city of Garland to ammend CCN that would connect 00:08:27.899 --> 00:08:31.879 in with the Southern cross proposed DC tie. 00:08:33.529 --> 00:08:36.919 ERCOT filed, its 11 status update in which it stated 00:08:36.919 --> 00:08:40.649 that with the exception attracted to an implementation 00:08:40.649 --> 00:08:43.700 of several system charges, it considers its work on 00:08:43.710 --> 00:08:48.929 commissions directives to be complete. We posted this 00:08:48.940 --> 00:08:53.690 at the request of our fearless leader of the across 00:08:53.690 --> 00:08:55.740 Texas dc type project. 00:08:57.519 --> 00:09:01.340 Mhm. Is that me? I'm trying to lead it into 00:09:03.379 --> 00:09:07.370 a suspect. We have some comments from the diet very 00:09:07.379 --> 00:09:11.620 very short. But listen this um I want to say thank 00:09:11.620 --> 00:09:14.950 you to the staff of ERCOT and staff and staff of 00:09:14.950 --> 00:09:18.970 the commission and to the industry um as we've seen 00:09:18.980 --> 00:09:23.259 I think almost a year ago, um Mr Chairman, you, I brought 00:09:23.259 --> 00:09:25.590 this up and you said take the lead and run and get 00:09:25.590 --> 00:09:28.259 this thing done, get regulatory certainty here. Um 00:09:28.259 --> 00:09:30.799 I think that's what we've done. Uh, it's been a docket 00:09:30.799 --> 00:09:36.149 that's been out there for um Since 2017 regulatory 00:09:36.149 --> 00:09:38.879 certainty when it comes to large financial projects 00:09:38.889 --> 00:09:42.830 is really important. So, um, you know, I think the 00:09:42.840 --> 00:09:46.169 the good thing, the things that have happened on this 00:09:46.179 --> 00:09:49.379 first and foremost is that fork has waived jurisdiction 00:09:49.379 --> 00:09:53.179 on DC ties yet again. So this is our responsibility 00:09:53.320 --> 00:09:58.059 Uh, this is what we price, how we want this to work 00:09:58.070 --> 00:10:03.169 Um if this line becomes reality second that um in this 00:10:03.179 --> 00:10:07.039 in the directives that, that the puc gave ERCOT, 00:10:07.049 --> 00:10:10.080 Um there were a lot of things about reliability of 00:10:10.080 --> 00:10:12.549 the system, how a DC line might affect reliability 00:10:12.549 --> 00:10:17.870 of the system. ERCOT has 100% authority to close down 00:10:17.870 --> 00:10:20.830 this tie, just like they do every other tie if there's 00:10:20.830 --> 00:10:24.649 an emergency on their ERCOT system, so we should expect 00:10:24.659 --> 00:10:28.289 them to protect our system first. That's just the way 00:10:28.299 --> 00:10:30.350 it's gonna happen and that's the way it happens with 00:10:30.350 --> 00:10:34.179 the, with the existing ties. Um there is only one directive 00:10:34.179 --> 00:10:37.320 that is not complete um that's number two. Um that's 00:10:37.320 --> 00:10:42.330 because it requires uh the the other side of the interconnection 00:10:42.480 --> 00:10:45.519 um to have an operating agreement with ERCOT, that's 00:10:45.529 --> 00:10:47.659 a very normal course of business when you figure out 00:10:47.659 --> 00:10:50.809 where the other side is. Um Now let me just say very 00:10:50.809 --> 00:10:57.139 quickly um obviously I in my past life I had been a 00:10:57.139 --> 00:11:00.039 developer of DC transmission lines. These are, they're 00:11:00.039 --> 00:11:03.919 hard, they're unique, they're, they're kind of uh um 00:11:03.929 --> 00:11:06.600 square pegs in the round hole of regulation and that's 00:11:06.600 --> 00:11:10.120 why I have pushed this because our actions today do 00:11:10.120 --> 00:11:13.850 not create certainty, create a certain environment 00:11:13.850 --> 00:11:17.000 for this to happen. They helped that the financial 00:11:17.000 --> 00:11:21.720 markets, um the capacity purchasers on the line, uh 00:11:21.730 --> 00:11:24.440 those who want resources across this line, they are 00:11:24.440 --> 00:11:27.850 the ones who make this happen, We are just finishing 00:11:27.850 --> 00:11:29.809 a regulatory proceeding and getting out of the way 00:11:29.820 --> 00:11:35.740 So um but each and every month um cost money and when 00:11:35.740 --> 00:11:38.759 you don't have a guaranteed rate of return at some 00:11:38.759 --> 00:11:42.139 point in time, in my experience, mine was nine years 00:11:42.149 --> 00:11:47.169 uh that capital ran out and um that's why I push, I 00:11:47.169 --> 00:11:50.509 think these have value and um we'll just see, we'll 00:11:50.509 --> 00:11:55.190 see how this proceeds going forward. Um I do have a 00:11:55.190 --> 00:11:59.360 motion but I'm happy to uh to discuss any any issues 00:11:59.360 --> 00:12:03.330 here, but I would highlight that this is the large 00:12:03.340 --> 00:12:07.389 this would be will be the largest of the multiple interconnects 00:12:07.389 --> 00:12:09.429 We've already we already have multiple interconnects 00:12:09.429 --> 00:12:12.909 to other grids. This would be the largest yet another 00:12:12.909 --> 00:12:16.909 one. Uh but in addition to existing interconnect to 00:12:16.919 --> 00:12:20.919 outside grids uh and on based on the description you 00:12:20.919 --> 00:12:23.929 laid out, is it fair to say that we at this at 00:12:23.929 --> 00:12:26.309 this point we the regulators have completed everything 00:12:26.309 --> 00:12:29.059 we can at this point in the process and are handing 00:12:29.059 --> 00:12:33.659 the baton to the private sector to run with it as far 00:12:33.659 --> 00:12:37.059 as they can. Ok, that's I mean that's an important 00:12:37.059 --> 00:12:40.379 part and that's an important part of how Texas approaches 00:12:40.379 --> 00:12:43.789 regulation. We want to do the take care of business 00:12:43.789 --> 00:12:46.960 that needs to be done for reliability and for our consumers 00:12:46.970 --> 00:12:50.230 and then hand it to the private market to to take it 00:12:50.230 --> 00:12:50.820 from there. 00:12:52.570 --> 00:12:57.039 Any other questions, comments or Mr Chairman uh Commissioner 00:12:57.039 --> 00:13:00.429 Glotfelty No, I appreciate your comments and I would 00:13:00.429 --> 00:13:05.289 echo the theme of them. Um in 2015, the legislature 00:13:05.289 --> 00:13:09.679 required uh that the puc do due diligence on the scope 00:13:09.690 --> 00:13:14.269 scale magnitude of impact of Southern cross and the 00:13:14.269 --> 00:13:18.919 puc did that in concert with ERCOT. ERCOT spent a number 00:13:18.919 --> 00:13:23.879 of years uh blazing a trail that others may follow 00:13:23.879 --> 00:13:27.190 Southern Cross potentially. Uh but ultimately, what 00:13:27.190 --> 00:13:30.230 will result is another tool in the toolbox for Texas 00:13:30.230 --> 00:13:34.080 to introduce competitive forces to keep energy prices 00:13:34.090 --> 00:13:37.299 lower than they otherwise would be. And that's an important 00:13:37.299 --> 00:13:40.730 aspect for Texas consumers. Texas ratepayers, Texas 00:13:40.730 --> 00:13:45.600 businesses who depend on the cost of that energy for 00:13:45.600 --> 00:13:50.440 their economic livelihood. And so, um I hope that Southern 00:13:50.440 --> 00:13:55.070 Cross succeeds, I hope that we will be able to experience 00:13:55.070 --> 00:13:58.850 a system benefit by virtue of this new interconnection 00:13:58.850 --> 00:14:03.840 I appreciate ferc uh utilizing jurisdictional restraint 00:14:03.850 --> 00:14:09.830 in terms of pressing uh potential uh claims and um 00:14:09.840 --> 00:14:13.610 I look forward to being able to see how the counter 00:14:13.610 --> 00:14:18.299 party relationship develops um for this project so 00:14:18.299 --> 00:14:22.570 that we know um on both sides of the border, who we're 00:14:22.570 --> 00:14:25.980 dealing with and uh and what we can experience for 00:14:25.980 --> 00:14:28.149 years to come. Well put, 00:14:30.039 --> 00:14:32.279 I don't think I have any much more to add on on 00:14:32.279 --> 00:14:34.879 the topic. I mean obviously this line has been being 00:14:34.879 --> 00:14:38.419 looked at for a number of years now that I can recall 00:14:38.419 --> 00:14:41.240 in, but I know a lot of due diligence has gone into 00:14:41.250 --> 00:14:44.899 the project by way of getting to Ferc disclaimer of 00:14:44.899 --> 00:14:47.429 jurisdiction the Commission has done its due diligence 00:14:47.429 --> 00:14:51.419 with the ccN order and the revised order that imposed 00:14:51.429 --> 00:14:54.250 the numerous directives that ERCOT has been steadfastly 00:14:54.250 --> 00:14:57.620 working on over the last several years um ultimately 00:14:57.620 --> 00:15:00.990 now by the procedural actions that I think Commissioner 00:15:00.990 --> 00:15:04.490 Glotfelty will recommend we will step back and let 00:15:04.500 --> 00:15:09.190 the private developers um work on bringing this project 00:15:09.190 --> 00:15:12.820 to fruition and continue to monitor in terms of who 00:15:12.820 --> 00:15:17.379 our neighbor will be and um the following step of Southern 00:15:17.379 --> 00:15:19.700 Cross executing a standard mark participant form with 00:15:19.700 --> 00:15:23.429 ERCOT at the time that um, you know, at the right time 00:15:23.480 --> 00:15:27.320 when it's the whole issue is ripe and um, you know 00:15:27.320 --> 00:15:31.029 ultimately will have the chairman noted one of the 00:15:31.029 --> 00:15:34.399 bigger ties the biggest high into the air ERCOT region 00:15:34.409 --> 00:15:37.740 that we've had thus far and we'll have a model in a 00:15:37.740 --> 00:15:41.070 framework that we can utilize in the future, potentially 00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:45.899 as we evaluate other ties that we may um find her in 00:15:45.899 --> 00:15:48.629 the public interest. Thank you. 00:15:50.730 --> 00:15:52.909 Well, I'd just like to thank you for your leadership 00:15:52.909 --> 00:15:56.820 and your hard work over the last year. Uh, there was 00:15:56.820 --> 00:16:00.419 a challenge presented and then um in the public's best 00:16:00.419 --> 00:16:03.169 interest and Texas backs interest, there were a number 00:16:03.169 --> 00:16:05.169 of conditions that had been put in place to make sure 00:16:05.169 --> 00:16:08.460 that that was preserved and you know, so important 00:16:08.460 --> 00:16:11.379 going forward that we, you know, operate the grid as 00:16:11.379 --> 00:16:13.879 a system and that we have, as you mentioned, all the 00:16:13.879 --> 00:16:17.370 tools in the toolbox to um to be able to, you know 00:16:17.370 --> 00:16:21.500 provide the best reliable service for Texans. So thank 00:16:21.500 --> 00:16:25.600 you for your hard work. Well put. How about that motion. I 00:16:25.610 --> 00:16:28.429 would I'm gonna read this so bear with me this isn't 00:16:28.429 --> 00:16:34.000 my forte reading that is um math quite frankly but 00:16:34.009 --> 00:16:37.389 I move that we multi state transmission lines, he's 00:16:37.389 --> 00:16:42.769 got he's your guy um I move that we instruct docket 00:16:42.769 --> 00:16:45.019 management issue in order finding that the commission 00:16:45.019 --> 00:16:48.129 agrees with ERCOT solutions to our directives and closing 00:16:48.129 --> 00:16:50.080 out this project. The order should also open a new 00:16:50.080 --> 00:16:53.110 project and require ERCOT to provide updates regarding 00:16:53.110 --> 00:16:55.250 the proposed interconnection and inform the commission 00:16:55.250 --> 00:16:58.480 of developments as needed in the new project. Also 00:16:58.480 --> 00:17:00.980 ERCOT should be required to notify the commission in 00:17:00.980 --> 00:17:04.480 the project when a coordination agreement is executed 00:17:04.480 --> 00:17:07.450 and when southern Cross has executed ERCOT market participant 00:17:07.460 --> 00:17:09.930 agreement Since the commission's order granting the 00:17:09.930 --> 00:17:13.029 CCN amendment for garland requires that both of those 00:17:13.029 --> 00:17:16.380 events occur before the rusk to Panola transmission 00:17:16.380 --> 00:17:19.529 line can be energized. Got a motion is there a second 00:17:20.349 --> 00:17:25.720 second motion second all in favor say aye, aye. None 00:17:25.720 --> 00:17:28.680 opposed motion passes. Thank you for your work. Commissioner 00:17:28.680 --> 00:17:31.519 Glotfelty ERCOT staff commission staff 00:17:33.869 --> 00:17:36.720 big big milestone in a big big project 00:17:38.569 --> 00:17:42.250 I think that brings us to number eight don't have anything 00:17:42.250 --> 00:17:47.809 there. What's next on our agenda. Mr Journeay. (item:10:53385) Number 10 it's 00:17:47.809 --> 00:17:52.109 project 53385 it's a project to submit emergency operation 00:17:52.109 --> 00:17:55.400 plans and related documents under commission rule 25 00:17:55.400 --> 00:18:00.170 53. Commission staff's filed a memo and a recommended 00:18:00.170 --> 00:18:02.930 weather emergency preparedness report to be submitted 00:18:02.930 --> 00:18:06.730 to the legislature. Thank you sir. I know I certainly 00:18:06.730 --> 00:18:09.329 feel this fulfills our statutory obligation but also 00:18:09.329 --> 00:18:12.819 want to thank Teresa Harris and the team for struggling 00:18:12.829 --> 00:18:16.819 struggling through that. That was an uphill uphill 00:18:16.819 --> 00:18:19.980 battle uh in many ways but I appreciate the hard work 00:18:19.980 --> 00:18:22.130 I'm glad they got it over the finish line thoughts 00:18:22.130 --> 00:18:25.579 comments. No, I I support the report. I think it's 00:18:25.579 --> 00:18:29.130 well done um has been a struggle and and staff accomplished 00:18:29.130 --> 00:18:31.640 their their mission really appreciate appreciate the 00:18:31.640 --> 00:18:39.940 work. Sure. So I would move to adopt the report chairman 00:18:39.950 --> 00:18:46.279 if I may provide an update. Um it came to staff's attention 00:18:46.289 --> 00:18:53.480 um earlier this week that some of the data in the underlying 00:18:53.480 --> 00:18:59.410 a central report that is attached um was incomplete 00:18:59.809 --> 00:19:04.210 and we would ask that you delegate to staff the authority 00:19:04.220 --> 00:19:08.140 to update the report as necessary to incorporate the 00:19:08.140 --> 00:19:12.980 missing data. Yeah, I would move to adopt the report 00:19:12.990 --> 00:19:16.940 and delegates staff authority to make the changes necessary 00:19:16.940 --> 00:19:19.900 to incorporate the latest available data. Thank you 00:19:19.900 --> 00:19:24.180 sir. I've got a motion. 2nd 2nd. Alright 00:19:24.180 --> 00:19:27.670 Motion a second. All in favor say aye unopposed. Motion 00:19:27.670 --> 00:19:32.549 passes. Thank you again team next item please. The 00:19:32.559 --> 00:19:36.559 (item:11:53401) Next item is item 11, Project 53401 Electric weather 00:19:36.559 --> 00:19:39.839 preparedness Standards Phase two. Commission staff's 00:19:39.839 --> 00:19:45.240 filed a memo in a proposal for publication. Uh mr McAdams 00:19:45.240 --> 00:19:49.710 has filed a memo Commissioner, I think you've all seen 00:19:49.710 --> 00:19:52.180 your memo but could you lay that out for us, you guys 00:19:52.190 --> 00:19:57.529 appreciate it. Um Members I filed my memo to demonstrate 00:19:57.539 --> 00:20:01.529 that uh I believe the staff proposed rule may create 00:20:01.539 --> 00:20:06.299 unintended consequences in the way that has framed 00:20:06.309 --> 00:20:12.490 uh 16 TAC sub sections 25.55 Subsection C. Subsection 00:20:12.490 --> 00:20:16.859 one and subsection B. Um and this is the weatherization 00:20:16.859 --> 00:20:20.819 for generation facilities, but depending on our discussion 00:20:20.819 --> 00:20:23.779 and consideration, it could affect the standards incorporated 00:20:23.779 --> 00:20:26.680 for both transmission facilities and generation and 00:20:26.680 --> 00:20:30.430 that's what you see in the memo. Um First in terms 00:20:30.430 --> 00:20:33.769 of the unintended consequence, uh by creating a construct 00:20:33.779 --> 00:20:36.309 that a generation resource will either comply with 00:20:36.309 --> 00:20:38.650 the minimum ambient temperature at which they have 00:20:38.650 --> 00:20:43.329 sustained operations or the 95th percentile minimum 00:20:43.329 --> 00:20:46.890 72 hour average temperature reported by the ERCOT weather 00:20:46.890 --> 00:20:50.220 study for a weather zone in which the facility is located 00:20:50.230 --> 00:20:53.250 By adopting the stance, we would set up circumstances 00:20:53.259 --> 00:20:56.380 where a generator may be subject to penalty that deploys 00:20:56.380 --> 00:20:59.880 highly rated technology within their facilities that 00:20:59.880 --> 00:21:03.089 are rated to sustain operations at a lower temperature 00:21:03.099 --> 00:21:06.500 Um while a neighboring facility within the same weather 00:21:06.500 --> 00:21:14.509 zone uh would be uh that installs technology that is 00:21:14.509 --> 00:21:17.549 rated to a warmer temperature for sustained operations 00:21:17.549 --> 00:21:20.990 would be inspected and held to a less stringent standard 00:21:21.000 --> 00:21:26.500 within the same weather zone. So there's uh a different 00:21:26.500 --> 00:21:30.450 standard for facilities in the same weather zone by 00:21:30.450 --> 00:21:35.259 virtue of how high high a degree of technology they 00:21:35.259 --> 00:21:39.569 have installed. To me this is a, it could set up a 00:21:39.569 --> 00:21:43.109 perverse incentive uh for generators to install technology 00:21:43.109 --> 00:21:45.410 that is not designed to cope with the coldest possible 00:21:45.410 --> 00:21:48.390 temperatures, especially in our northern climates of 00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:53.039 the state. Um our policy, I believe overarching should 00:21:53.039 --> 00:21:56.549 treat generators the same insofar as the temperature 00:21:56.549 --> 00:21:59.710 we expect them to experience by weather zone. Again 00:21:59.710 --> 00:22:02.160 if we believe in north texas, we're going to experience 00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:04.910 certain weather conditions and everyone should be held 00:22:04.920 --> 00:22:07.849 on that regional wide held accountable on that regional 00:22:07.849 --> 00:22:13.279 wide standard. Um and second, uh as indicated by my 00:22:13.279 --> 00:22:15.670 memo at the last hope and at the last open meeting 00:22:15.670 --> 00:22:18.099 I believe windshield should be specifically accounted 00:22:18.099 --> 00:22:20.609 for in the mitigation efforts to be undertaken by a 00:22:20.609 --> 00:22:24.380 generator as it applies to the weather zone. Metal 00:22:24.380 --> 00:22:27.319 does not react well to rapid changes in temperature 00:22:27.329 --> 00:22:30.950 and it does affect the way machines perform, nerc clearly 00:22:30.950 --> 00:22:34.490 believes this um and believe so, since they have taken 00:22:34.490 --> 00:22:37.470 pains to highlight this point after both the 2011 winter 00:22:37.470 --> 00:22:41.890 event and winter storm Uri of this last year, I believe 00:22:41.890 --> 00:22:44.339 we should impose a standard that reflects weather conditions 00:22:44.339 --> 00:22:46.900 we believe our generators will likely face within their 00:22:46.900 --> 00:22:49.039 areas of the state of texas where their facilities 00:22:49.039 --> 00:22:51.769 lie, which means windshield should be acknowledged 00:22:51.769 --> 00:22:55.750 as a mitigation standard within our rule. Um I'm happy 00:22:55.750 --> 00:22:58.410 to take feedback and and welcome any discussion on 00:22:58.410 --> 00:23:01.619 this. Well, thank you for taking the lead on this and 00:23:01.640 --> 00:23:05.630 um after going through all of the combinations and 00:23:05.630 --> 00:23:08.869 permutations over the last couple of weeks, I think 00:23:08.869 --> 00:23:11.539 I largely agree with the two concepts you laid out 00:23:11.549 --> 00:23:16.769 but I'm sure we have thoughts and comments from multiple 00:23:16.769 --> 00:23:20.299 corners. Sure. And thank you Commissioner McAdams for 00:23:20.299 --> 00:23:22.599 taking the lead on this issue. I know we had a conversation 00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:24.980 about it last open meeting and need to get a little 00:23:24.980 --> 00:23:27.890 bit more information. I know ERCOT um, you know, I 00:23:27.890 --> 00:23:30.609 appreciate, you know what, he's stepping forward and 00:23:30.609 --> 00:23:33.559 providing some more data that um, you know, led to 00:23:33.559 --> 00:23:36.190 this discussion and, and you know, ultimately I think 00:23:36.190 --> 00:23:40.180 your position on the, your language um, with respect 00:23:40.180 --> 00:23:45.170 to ensuring that we have region wide zonal based preparation 00:23:45.170 --> 00:23:47.339 standards that are consistent for all the generators 00:23:47.339 --> 00:23:51.000 I think that's important. Um, and also the data that 00:23:51.009 --> 00:23:53.640 we received from them on the impacts of wind chill 00:23:53.650 --> 00:23:57.230 and where the role is and how the Windchill would impact 00:23:57.230 --> 00:24:01.349 that Clearly ferc and neRC have identified, it is very 00:24:01.349 --> 00:24:05.839 significant factor after 2011 and 21 ultimately I think 00:24:05.839 --> 00:24:08.049 the generators will have to comply with windshield 00:24:08.460 --> 00:24:13.380 um, as Nerc will, nerc and ferc will ultimately approve 00:24:13.390 --> 00:24:17.890 the Windchill based or the weatherization um, standards 00:24:17.890 --> 00:24:19.869 that have wind chill in and by the end of the year 00:24:19.880 --> 00:24:23.799 and so the question then becomes, I know that calpine 00:24:23.809 --> 00:24:30.180 filed a uh, sort of a filing that last night and this 00:24:30.180 --> 00:24:34.400 morning and I hear what you're saying. I would just 00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:38.900 like to try to understand um, a little bit more about 00:24:38.910 --> 00:24:42.710 what I think that what they suggested was having a 00:24:42.720 --> 00:24:50.670 duration MPH Windchill or 20mph wind speed associated 00:24:50.670 --> 00:24:53.569 with the temperature. And I'm just trying to understand 00:24:53.579 --> 00:24:59.500 that a little bit more. Yeah, so, um, and and calpine 00:24:59.500 --> 00:25:02.529 may be able to speak more to this, but um, as I 00:25:02.529 --> 00:25:05.289 understand it, if the application of the standard across 00:25:05.289 --> 00:25:09.779 the weather zone again, the that region wide application 00:25:10.190 --> 00:25:13.539 um, that's the nuance that they speak to, that they 00:25:13.539 --> 00:25:16.910 seek to clarify um, for the purposes of facilities 00:25:16.920 --> 00:25:19.000 and, and I don't want to open up to a show and 00:25:19.000 --> 00:25:22.930 tell mr chairman. But I believe if, if that is our 00:25:22.930 --> 00:25:25.259 position and we affirm through our comment that we 00:25:25.259 --> 00:25:29.279 are applying this standard by a weather zone, we have 00:25:29.289 --> 00:25:34.269 have satisfied their, their concern about specific 00:25:34.279 --> 00:25:39.640 mitigation efforts being required. Um, I mean procedurally 00:25:39.640 --> 00:25:45.809 before we get into the mechanics of the, of the weatherization 00:25:46.910 --> 00:25:49.960 do want to say, I give very little credence to anything 00:25:49.960 --> 00:25:53.539 filed an hour before an open meeting. Just procedurally 00:25:53.549 --> 00:25:56.250 that's that's not enough time. Especially when you 00:25:56.250 --> 00:26:00.049 make comments very clear comments from the diocese 00:26:00.049 --> 00:26:03.380 and we had a, we had a discussion then that was two 00:26:03.380 --> 00:26:07.710 weeks ago. Um, so there was, there was plenty of time 00:26:07.720 --> 00:26:11.079 for for these issues to be brought up. That being said 00:26:11.089 --> 00:26:14.970 Happy to hear thoughts on it. Um, I think the, the 00:26:14.970 --> 00:26:17.839 bottom line in my mind is we need these generators 00:26:17.839 --> 00:26:22.799 prepared to face the conditions in the part of the 00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:26.799 state that they're going to be asked to provide to 00:26:26.799 --> 00:26:30.130 operate in. Uh, and it needs, there needs to be some 00:26:30.130 --> 00:26:32.730 ground truth thing. The valley has different weather 00:26:32.730 --> 00:26:36.069 than the panhandle. Um, and so, I mean, that's just 00:26:36.079 --> 00:26:39.529 that's the guiding principle I'm working from. We don't 00:26:39.529 --> 00:26:43.160 want to have a requirement. So onerous that you've 00:26:43.160 --> 00:26:50.029 got to build a, uh, uh, sports arena over your generator 00:26:50.039 --> 00:26:52.480 We don't, we're not asking anybody to do that. Uh, 00:26:52.490 --> 00:26:56.180 but we do need to reflect, through our standards, need 00:26:56.180 --> 00:26:58.599 to reflect the operating conditions under which these 00:26:58.599 --> 00:27:01.829 assets are going to be asked to provide power. Again 00:27:01.829 --> 00:27:04.759 the bottom line is keeping these generators running 00:27:04.759 --> 00:27:07.440 to keep people's lights on. And you know, I agree. 00:27:07.440 --> 00:27:09.529 I mean, that that's the overarching policy framework 00:27:09.539 --> 00:27:12.160 There's certainly some nuances in there. Happy to have 00:27:12.160 --> 00:27:14.380 that discussion. But just from a procedural point of 00:27:14.380 --> 00:27:16.670 view, wanted to lay that out and I certainly respect 00:27:16.670 --> 00:27:19.289 that and, and that's kind of why, you know, the late 00:27:19.299 --> 00:27:21.380 filing, that's why I'm sort of grappling with, you 00:27:21.380 --> 00:27:23.390 know what it actually means. I understand what you 00:27:23.390 --> 00:27:26.440 say. Commissioner McAdams But overall, um, on the, 00:27:26.450 --> 00:27:30.079 on your bigger point, chairman, I wholeheartedly agree 00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:32.440 with what you're saying. Matter of fact, I think some 00:27:32.440 --> 00:27:35.660 of the data that we received from ERCOT indicated that 00:27:35.670 --> 00:27:39.200 65% of the generation fleet can already comply with 00:27:39.200 --> 00:27:44.960 the windshield factor 95, plus windchill. 65%. And 00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:50.029 so the remains of around 65, the remainder um, would 00:27:50.029 --> 00:27:53.480 need various additional measures that could potentially 00:27:53.480 --> 00:27:56.539 range from, you know, small to a little bit bigger 00:27:56.549 --> 00:28:00.940 kind of mitigation efforts. So I think that, that was 00:28:00.940 --> 00:28:03.559 also helpful to understand that the majority of our 00:28:03.559 --> 00:28:09.059 generation fleet is already there. And um, so I mean 00:28:09.059 --> 00:28:12.470 I'll turn it over to any of my colleagues here who 00:28:12.470 --> 00:28:15.200 would like to provide any comments. But I think generally 00:28:15.200 --> 00:28:19.269 speaking, I, I'm on the same page as you McAdams policy 00:28:19.279 --> 00:28:24.750 we do happen to have an engineer here. Well, um, I'll 00:28:24.750 --> 00:28:27.869 weigh on this, you know, this. Um, I mean, to me, it's 00:28:27.869 --> 00:28:29.970 about the data and the science and of course you, you 00:28:29.970 --> 00:28:32.359 mentioned that we did have an opportunity to sit down 00:28:32.359 --> 00:28:36.849 with ERCOT and they did share some data and information 00:28:36.859 --> 00:28:40.660 regarding what that compliance would look like, uh 00:28:40.670 --> 00:28:44.500 as compared to what some act, the, actually the, uh 00:28:44.509 --> 00:28:47.759 the actual temperature event that occurred during, 00:28:47.769 --> 00:28:52.740 um, uh, winter storm Uri and you know, kind of laying 00:28:52.740 --> 00:28:56.970 that out, being able to, um, go in and look at a 00:28:56.970 --> 00:29:01.859 standard that provided and, and, and accommodated windshield 00:29:01.869 --> 00:29:04.920 really gave us, I think, um, better confidence versus 00:29:04.920 --> 00:29:08.819 the actual data that, uh, that those temperatures and 00:29:08.819 --> 00:29:12.690 those, uh, that weatherization would provide better 00:29:12.690 --> 00:29:17.619 mitigation for uh, the actual event that occurred um 00:29:17.630 --> 00:29:22.019 during winter storm Uri. Um, the number of entities 00:29:22.029 --> 00:29:28.220 and again, this is with 85% of the actual units 00:29:28.220 --> 00:29:32.720 reporting. So with 85% of the, of the vote in of those 00:29:32.730 --> 00:29:36.400 with the previous standard that was proposed for the 00:29:36.400 --> 00:29:40.549 ambient temperature. Um, 88% of those facilities would 00:29:40.549 --> 00:29:43.619 be, you know, would not be required to do anything 00:29:43.619 --> 00:29:49.299 Additionally, 12% would um, with the ambient temperature 00:29:49.910 --> 00:29:54.279 uh, at the 95 or the 95 percentile with the 72 hour 00:29:54.279 --> 00:29:57.970 windchill factor, uh, that factor that um, that number 00:29:57.970 --> 00:30:02.839 was actually 63%. So 37% would be required to do something 00:30:02.849 --> 00:30:05.490 So of course, what we, we don't know the unknown and 00:30:05.490 --> 00:30:08.039 what were, you know, we, we obviously don't want to 00:30:08.039 --> 00:30:09.869 have happened, which is, you know, what the chairman 00:30:09.869 --> 00:30:13.559 mentioned is, you know, what is the magnitude of those 00:30:13.569 --> 00:30:16.859 particular investments? So I think it's kind of, it's 00:30:16.859 --> 00:30:20.759 incumbent on us to, you know, take a look at the data 00:30:20.769 --> 00:30:24.170 um, to be able to accommodate wind, the windshield 00:30:24.170 --> 00:30:29.589 factor, I think a lot of what entities You do and do 00:30:29.589 --> 00:30:32.150 well in Texas as they use good professional judgment 00:30:32.160 --> 00:30:34.609 And so if they have a standard, if we, if we apply 00:30:34.609 --> 00:30:40.009 the standard of the 95% um, with the windchill factor 00:30:40.019 --> 00:30:42.730 um, they're able to actually, as I understand it go 00:30:42.730 --> 00:30:47.500 out and access the data from market, utilize the information 00:30:47.500 --> 00:30:50.119 that is behind these numbers. Break those wind speeds 00:30:50.119 --> 00:30:54.940 out, break those temperatures out and and basically 00:30:54.940 --> 00:30:57.579 be able to design their facilities that will reasonably 00:30:57.579 --> 00:31:01.490 meet these standards. So um in my mind is driven by 00:31:01.490 --> 00:31:07.329 data. I do also support uh removing um the requirement 00:31:07.339 --> 00:31:12.190 that would have facilities continue to operate um and 00:31:12.190 --> 00:31:14.200 continue to meet standards that they had previously 00:31:14.200 --> 00:31:18.220 demonstrated. Um I think if you have the 72 windshield 00:31:18.220 --> 00:31:22.890 factor temperature at the 95%ile, um minimum averages 00:31:22.900 --> 00:31:26.599 as we're talking about is being proposed, I believe 00:31:26.599 --> 00:31:29.950 that is sufficient. I also think that, you know, again 00:31:29.950 --> 00:31:34.640 from a standard standpoint, um dividing, defining the 00:31:34.640 --> 00:31:38.710 standards based on data and science as opposed to what 00:31:38.710 --> 00:31:41.630 has previously been demonstrated in terms of performance 00:31:41.640 --> 00:31:46.170 actually is a sounder way of looking at it. So I base 00:31:46.180 --> 00:31:49.470 I would basically support the two items in your memo 00:31:49.470 --> 00:31:52.109 that you suggested, which was basically to to strike 00:31:52.109 --> 00:31:56.910 the requirement of facilities um Continue to operate 00:31:56.910 --> 00:32:00.039 when they had demonstrated previously um at that particular 00:32:00.039 --> 00:32:05.599 ambient temperature and then also um the 90 establishing 00:32:05.599 --> 00:32:10.099 the 95%ile average 72 hour windshield temperature that's 00:32:10.099 --> 00:32:14.039 reported um in our coats historical weather study. 00:32:16.759 --> 00:32:21.099 Um I agree with the memo. Um I do want to say 00:32:21.099 --> 00:32:24.289 that I think this is kind of an interesting topic. 00:32:24.299 --> 00:32:28.859 Um you can get wind chill. Um you can hit a wind 00:32:28.859 --> 00:32:32.619 chill of say 10 degrees negative 10 degrees by having 00:32:32.619 --> 00:32:35.119 a zero degree temperature and a two degree and a two 00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:38.069 mile per hour wind or 10 degrees and a 30 mile per 00:32:38.069 --> 00:32:41.430 hour wind. That does make it a little bit challenging 00:32:41.440 --> 00:32:43.559 But I believe it's a challenge that the industry can 00:32:43.559 --> 00:32:46.009 resolve and believe that they're gonna have to resolve 00:32:46.019 --> 00:32:49.339 this because if we don't do it in this rule, I believe 00:32:49.339 --> 00:32:51.519 that is going to do it in their rule. It was in 00:32:51.529 --> 00:32:54.490 their report that said that wind chill is an important 00:32:54.490 --> 00:32:58.589 factor to consider. So when, when Nerc um, makes 00:32:58.599 --> 00:33:01.980 a weatherization rule, revises their weatherization 00:33:01.980 --> 00:33:04.960 rule, it is going to be in there. So we're maybe, we're 00:33:04.960 --> 00:33:08.859 giving them a head start on this and um, you know, 00:33:08.859 --> 00:33:14.079 that's, that's a benefit. Um, the one thing that I 00:33:14.089 --> 00:33:19.269 have to say on weatherization rules is that, um, we 00:33:19.269 --> 00:33:21.109 are doing the right thing here. We're doing as the 00:33:21.109 --> 00:33:23.519 Legislature directed, I think we are making our system 00:33:23.529 --> 00:33:28.380 a lot more reliable here. I do not, I won't mention 00:33:28.380 --> 00:33:31.400 the fuel component of it. That's not our bailiwick 00:33:31.400 --> 00:33:35.549 But the thing where I still have a little bit of heartburn 00:33:35.559 --> 00:33:40.549 is when we have um, extreme temperatures and regions 00:33:40.549 --> 00:33:43.930 that don't expect it. So when we have the Rio grande 00:33:43.930 --> 00:33:49.230 valley going to zero degrees, that's not their ambient 00:33:49.240 --> 00:33:52.910 uh, temp operating temperature, that's not what they're 00:33:52.910 --> 00:33:55.250 used to, but as we're getting more and more extreme 00:33:55.250 --> 00:33:58.880 events. Um, however, we want to characterize those 00:33:58.890 --> 00:34:02.460 those I think are continuing wants to continue to watch 00:34:02.470 --> 00:34:06.089 And if we need to revise this based upon things like 00:34:06.089 --> 00:34:09.630 that in the future, we ought to be ready and willing 00:34:09.630 --> 00:34:13.219 to open up the rule and do that. Sorry. Mr Isn't that 00:34:13.230 --> 00:34:16.340 the beauty of the construct that 90% of average because 00:34:16.340 --> 00:34:19.440 that will continue? It's a self correcting mechanism 00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:20.539 Yes, very good point. 00:34:22.139 --> 00:34:25.039 I don't disagree that, that that's correct. So, I think 00:34:25.050 --> 00:34:30.570 two thoughts, an important point that over time, by 00:34:30.579 --> 00:34:35.440 adopting the statistical point in the in the distribution 00:34:35.440 --> 00:34:39.420 That will be self correcting based on as recent events 00:34:39.909 --> 00:34:44.590 But in addition, I think, and yes, you can get to negative 00:34:44.599 --> 00:34:48.670 five temperature, like low temperature and little wind 00:34:48.670 --> 00:34:51.449 or higher temperature and a lot of wind. But I think 00:34:51.449 --> 00:34:54.170 the Commissioner Jackson's point for each of these 00:34:54.170 --> 00:34:57.400 weather zones, that data, nobody will have to guess 00:34:57.409 --> 00:35:00.380 they can go to and get that and it's gonna be, here's 00:35:00.380 --> 00:35:03.510 your temperature, here's your windchill or your your 00:35:03.510 --> 00:35:07.119 wind speed factor. So it's, it's not gonna be a guessing 00:35:07.119 --> 00:35:11.599 game that leaves the industry kind of uh flailing in 00:35:11.599 --> 00:35:16.170 the wind if you will and uh sure, it's the 95th percentile 00:35:16.179 --> 00:35:20.309 But I have full confidence that this will help us meet 00:35:20.320 --> 00:35:23.539 even more extreme events because unlike in the past 00:35:23.539 --> 00:35:27.079 when there was nothing you were going from, you were 00:35:27.079 --> 00:35:31.510 the folks were trying to get from 0 to 100 It's a 00:35:31.510 --> 00:35:34.230 lot easier when you see a problem coming to get from 00:35:34.230 --> 00:35:39.340 95 to 99th, and so I have full confidence even when 00:35:39.340 --> 00:35:44.590 we do have events That are beyond the 95th%,ile, our 00:35:44.590 --> 00:35:48.820 generators will be able to adapt to them. Um, and you 00:35:48.820 --> 00:35:52.320 mentioned the fuel, that's another big factor that 00:35:52.329 --> 00:35:54.579 plays into it and it's not part of this proceeding 00:35:54.579 --> 00:35:58.679 but there's been great progress both at tURk and in 00:35:58.690 --> 00:36:02.420 direct coordination with the Railroad Commission, our 00:36:02.429 --> 00:36:05.519 critical infrastructure supply map. So it's not any 00:36:05.519 --> 00:36:07.559 single piece of the puzzle. That's also this problem 00:36:07.559 --> 00:36:12.179 It's all of it. Um, and in combination, I have, I have 00:36:12.179 --> 00:36:14.829 full faith that we'll be able to keep the lights on 00:36:14.829 --> 00:36:18.900 in extreme cold weather events. The other thing I wanted 00:36:18.900 --> 00:36:20.949 to point out and I think the staff did a great job 00:36:20.949 --> 00:36:23.239 on this in Barksdale and I spent a lot of time talking 00:36:23.239 --> 00:36:28.409 about kind of the spirit of, of what I think was intended 00:36:28.409 --> 00:36:31.699 here was around compliance. So there's been a lot of 00:36:31.699 --> 00:36:36.289 talk about enforcement, but in terms of the effort 00:36:36.289 --> 00:36:38.539 and we talked about this at the last open meeting, 00:36:38.550 --> 00:36:43.019 um, that facilities and needed to be put in place ahead 00:36:43.019 --> 00:36:45.199 of the event that the inspection would occur during 00:36:45.199 --> 00:36:48.699 the course of, of the cold weather months and, and 00:36:48.710 --> 00:36:52.170 also during the hot weather times of the year, uh, 00:36:52.179 --> 00:36:55.829 that there was a whole process in place that would 00:36:55.840 --> 00:36:59.610 promote root cause analysis by the generator and then 00:36:59.610 --> 00:37:03.090 also there was, you know, uh if you will kind of three 00:37:03.090 --> 00:37:06.610 strikes and a more formal root cause analysis that 00:37:06.610 --> 00:37:09.369 was um you know, part of the process. So it's very 00:37:09.369 --> 00:37:14.239 much targeted towards compliance and providing I think 00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:17.230 a resource that hopefully I think the staff will be 00:37:17.230 --> 00:37:20.820 able to provide as we kind of take this on uh to 00:37:20.820 --> 00:37:24.900 able to be able to share best practices to be um 00:37:24.909 --> 00:37:29.489 to be an asset to be somebody who can um again work 00:37:29.489 --> 00:37:33.670 with the regulated community again to promote long 00:37:33.670 --> 00:37:36.769 term compliance with these with these standards. So 00:37:36.780 --> 00:37:40.409 I think it's two fold, it's not just setting the right 00:37:40.420 --> 00:37:42.789 standard to the best of your ability, but it's also 00:37:42.789 --> 00:37:45.610 putting in place those mechanisms that will help you 00:37:45.610 --> 00:37:48.150 to be in compliance and I think you've done a fantastic 00:37:48.150 --> 00:37:50.210 job on that. I would like to add something to that 00:37:50.219 --> 00:37:53.480 but I think you highlighted best practices and we had 00:37:53.480 --> 00:37:56.510 a conversation about this after the phase one weatherization 00:37:56.519 --> 00:38:00.260 process was completed um at the ERCOT level that was 00:38:00.260 --> 00:38:03.920 for ERCOT to work with the contractor inspector. And 00:38:03.920 --> 00:38:06.260 I guess in the future it will be contractors and internal 00:38:06.260 --> 00:38:11.219 staff but to really um do a post um you know, post 00:38:11.219 --> 00:38:15.539 winner review and to develop best practices um that 00:38:15.550 --> 00:38:18.619 they, you know, so that they have, you know, some kind 00:38:18.619 --> 00:38:22.869 of document um that they can share with the generators 00:38:22.869 --> 00:38:26.769 and the transmission um companies to be able to reference 00:38:26.769 --> 00:38:30.590 what worked, what didn't work. Um Just sort of a post 00:38:30.590 --> 00:38:32.969 review every winter and and that you can update as 00:38:32.969 --> 00:38:37.440 best practice is a living document that will help guide 00:38:37.449 --> 00:38:41.119 the community going forward. So that's become one of 00:38:41.119 --> 00:38:44.900 the guiding principles of all the actions that we've 00:38:44.909 --> 00:38:50.179 taken over the last year and a half has been to establish 00:38:50.190 --> 00:38:56.409 a central monitoring system uh within ERCOT to manage 00:38:56.420 --> 00:39:01.400 and and to ensure accountability for good faith, reasonable 00:39:01.409 --> 00:39:04.769 efforts to ensure that your facilities that you hold 00:39:04.769 --> 00:39:08.260 out are going to be on system when you're contracted 00:39:08.260 --> 00:39:13.610 for or uh have an interest in participating um that 00:39:13.619 --> 00:39:16.559 you are performing the maintenance that you are establishing 00:39:16.570 --> 00:39:19.239 or moving forward on a reasonable effort to come into 00:39:19.239 --> 00:39:24.400 compliance uh so that the state sees that you are doing 00:39:24.400 --> 00:39:28.510 what you need to do um in order to to remain available 00:39:28.510 --> 00:39:31.159 at times of scarcity on the system. And that goes into 00:39:31.159 --> 00:39:34.719 the N. D. R. P. O. C. Policy. That ERCOT has considered 00:39:34.719 --> 00:39:37.869 the maintenance outage schedule. Er um It is it is 00:39:37.869 --> 00:39:41.559 all a system of transparency and accountability for 00:39:41.559 --> 00:39:45.469 market participants uh for which they didn't have. 00:39:45.480 --> 00:39:51.489 That that system before Uri and now they do and and 00:39:51.489 --> 00:39:54.820 we're all adjusting to a new environment. Yeah and 00:39:54.820 --> 00:39:57.590 it's making a big difference as we saw last summer 00:39:57.599 --> 00:40:01.420 last winter this summer it's all, all of the, all of 00:40:01.420 --> 00:40:03.090 the above. We'll put 00:40:04.920 --> 00:40:09.320 Alright chairman, I apologize I have a question and 00:40:09.320 --> 00:40:14.429 then a point of clarification. Uh First thanks for 00:40:14.429 --> 00:40:16.309 the discussion and we understand the direction that 00:40:16.309 --> 00:40:19.300 you're setting and we'll be sure to implement it um 00:40:19.309 --> 00:40:22.099 in accordance with your direction. Second, in order 00:40:22.099 --> 00:40:26.630 to clarify your direction, your memo addresses the 00:40:26.639 --> 00:40:30.530 winter standards and I want to make sure that the commission 00:40:30.530 --> 00:40:34.760 is leaving in place the ambient temperature standard 00:40:34.760 --> 00:40:38.099 the greater of the ambient temperature standard or 00:40:38.110 --> 00:40:41.400 the maximum temperature which the resources operated 00:40:41.400 --> 00:40:45.460 during the summer. So in in in my view, I think this 00:40:45.460 --> 00:40:49.289 is more of a pressing issue for the for the winter 00:40:49.289 --> 00:40:52.440 conditions, for the cold weather conditions because 00:40:52.449 --> 00:40:56.420 that gives you that that rating experience. Again, 00:40:56.429 --> 00:40:59.679 everybody operate Texas is still a summer peaking sis 00:41:00.150 --> 00:41:03.800 and I don't know if you want to call Woody up on 00:41:03.800 --> 00:41:05.920 that from a planning perspective, but I believe you 00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:09.280 could still leave in the ambiance standard for summer 00:41:09.280 --> 00:41:13.920 conditions. Um the problem is not nearly as acute 00:41:17.630 --> 00:41:19.940 Yeah, that works for me but good point of clarification 00:41:20.829 --> 00:41:23.269 but that language will capture the increasingly hot 00:41:23.269 --> 00:41:24.480 weather that we're experiencing. 00:41:28.699 --> 00:41:32.059 All right. The other point of clarification that I 00:41:32.059 --> 00:41:37.920 have is um I was asked um by ERCOT legal staff to 00:41:37.929 --> 00:41:43.659 make sure that it was clear that in subsection C three 00:41:43.670 --> 00:41:48.530 and subsection F three, which address the filing of 00:41:48.539 --> 00:41:53.969 declarations of preparedness that a filing of a declaration 00:41:53.969 --> 00:41:57.730 of preparedness under this rule would supersede ERCOT 00:41:57.739 --> 00:42:02.750 current protocol language uh in protocol section 3.21 00:42:02.760 --> 00:42:06.679 for anybody who's paying attention. Um and so that 00:42:06.679 --> 00:42:10.539 when an entity files their declaration under the rule 00:42:10.539 --> 00:42:13.400 that it feels like Y'all are about to adopt, they do 00:42:13.400 --> 00:42:17.860 not have to file concurrently. Another declaration 00:42:17.869 --> 00:42:22.130 under 3.21. This is simply an administrative bureaucratic 00:42:22.130 --> 00:42:25.550 thing because ERCOT is in the process of writing an 00:42:25.550 --> 00:42:29.070 NPRR to revise that section of the protocols, but it 00:42:29.070 --> 00:42:32.800 won't be adopted by the board or before you for consideration 00:42:32.809 --> 00:42:36.150 until after this rule should go into effect. That makes 00:42:36.150 --> 00:42:39.969 sense to me. No reason to repeat duplicate effort. 00:42:40.510 --> 00:42:48.099 Thank you very much. Yes. Um Alright. Um I think we're 00:42:48.099 --> 00:42:50.989 at the point to look for a motion to approve the proposal 00:42:50.989 --> 00:42:54.940 for adoption as amended by commissioner. McAdams memo 00:42:55.309 --> 00:42:58.480 And I would so move Mr. Chairman with the clarification 00:42:58.489 --> 00:43:03.000 of consistent with the conversation between staff and 00:43:03.000 --> 00:43:05.550 the commission as a part of this proceeding. Alright 00:43:05.550 --> 00:43:09.530 we've got a motion 2nd 2nd. A motion and a second. 00:43:09.530 --> 00:43:12.579 All in favor say, aye, aye. None opposed motion passes 00:43:12.579 --> 00:43:17.050 barksdale smelts. Thank you gentlemen very much. And 00:43:17.059 --> 00:43:19.539 all, all the staff have been working on this, y'all 00:43:19.539 --> 00:43:23.559 to thread. A very difficult needle, nicely done. 00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:31.590 And your kid. I presume we know we know who does the 00:43:31.590 --> 00:43:32.699 work in the smeltz household. 00:43:35.340 --> 00:43:40.960 All right, next item please. Um I'm not sure we have 00:43:40.960 --> 00:43:45.280 any other items. Alright, well, number 12, I've got 00:43:47.480 --> 00:43:50.739 discussion and possible action on 00:43:52.329 --> 00:43:55.769 uh state and federal legislation etcetera, etcetera 00:43:55.780 --> 00:43:59.079 (item:12:Discussion regarding implementation of legislation) Uh recently I received a letter from Dad lavar who 00:43:59.079 --> 00:44:04.150 chairs the public Utah Public Service commission uh 00:44:04.159 --> 00:44:08.559 on behalf of the body of state regulators for the Western 00:44:08.559 --> 00:44:13.510 energy imbalance market and in his role um in that 00:44:14.670 --> 00:44:18.800 group. And we the puc were invited to designate one 00:44:18.800 --> 00:44:20.909 of our commissioners as representative to the body 00:44:20.909 --> 00:44:23.369 of state regulators for Western energy imbalance market 00:44:24.099 --> 00:44:29.460 Given uh El paso Electric's agreement to join that 00:44:29.460 --> 00:44:33.429 market, which obviously falls under El paso is our 00:44:33.429 --> 00:44:37.030 jurisdiction. Uh So happy to open up for discussion 00:44:37.030 --> 00:44:39.059 but I would submit Commissioner Glotfelty would be 00:44:39.059 --> 00:44:44.099 perfect for that role. Um No, he looking for one more 00:44:44.099 --> 00:44:48.409 thing to do in addition to writing memos lengthy memos 00:44:52.309 --> 00:44:52.769 Right. 00:44:57.309 --> 00:45:01.010 Uh So happy to hear thoughts or otherwise entertain 00:45:01.019 --> 00:45:05.110 a motion to designate. I happily make that motion. 00:45:05.110 --> 00:45:07.829 But absolutely, I think I have my hands full with myself 00:45:08.940 --> 00:45:10.949 I don't know. This is a great opportunity just to talk 00:45:10.949 --> 00:45:12.019 about jimmy. 00:45:15.110 --> 00:45:17.389 All right, so what do we have a motion to designate 00:45:17.389 --> 00:45:19.920 jimmy Glotfelty as a PUC Representative body of state 00:45:19.920 --> 00:45:23.789 regulators for the Western balance energy market. All 00:45:23.789 --> 00:45:27.769 in favor, say aye, aye. Not opposed motion passes, 00:45:27.780 --> 00:45:29.699 Congratulations. Mr Glotfelty 00:45:31.510 --> 00:45:38.449 Uh item 13 I don't have anything. So at this point 00:45:38.449 --> 00:45:42.239 we will be moving into closed session. So, having convened 00:45:42.239 --> 00:45:44.349 in a duly noticed open meeting commission will now 00:45:44.349 --> 00:45:48.230 at 10 24 AM on september 29th 2020. To hold the closed 00:45:48.230 --> 00:45:50.489 session, pursuant to chapter 551 texas, government 00:45:50.489 --> 00:45:58.389 code, section 551.71 at 1.74 and 5 to 1.76. We'll be 00:45:58.389 --> 00:45:59.219 back in a bit. 00:46:01.760 --> 00:46:02.090 Mhm. 00:46:16.289 --> 00:46:17.389 All right. 00:46:19.000 --> 00:46:22.179 Closed session is hereby concluded at 10 31 am on september 00:46:22.179 --> 00:46:25.010 29th 2022. The commission will now resume its public 00:46:25.010 --> 00:46:29.659 meeting after meeting in closed session. Having uh 00:46:29.670 --> 00:46:33.730 relevant discussions. Will ask for a motion to authorize 00:46:33.730 --> 00:46:36.739 our lawyers to petition the U. S. Supreme Court for 00:46:36.739 --> 00:46:39.440 review of the Fifth Circuit's decision in next era 00:46:39.440 --> 00:46:44.909 of the puc case number 20-50160. Do we have such a 00:46:44.909 --> 00:46:45.449 motion? 00:46:47.380 --> 00:46:50.719 Motion second all in favor say, aye, aye. None opposed 00:46:50.719 --> 00:46:55.210 motion passes. Thank you all very much. At this point 00:46:55.210 --> 00:46:57.079 we have no further business before the commission. 00:46:57.079 --> 00:46:58.809 So this meeting of the Public Utility Commission of 00:46:58.820 --> 00:47:01.369 Texas is hereby adjourned. Thank you