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(item:0:Chairman Gleeson calls meeting to order) This meeting of the Public Utility Commission of Texas

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will come to order. To consider matters that have been

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duly posted with the Secretary of State for today,

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February 1, 2024. So before we get into it. 

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I did just wanna say, say just a few things. (item:0:Chairman Gleeson gives appreciation for his new appointment & Commissioner Jackson's leadership) First 

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and foremost, I want to thank the Governor for appointing

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me to this position. It's something I, I take

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a lot of pride in. I've spent almost my entire professional

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career at this agency. And um I'll be honest when,

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when I started here 15 years ago. This was definitely

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not something I saw in my career plan. So, um I want

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to thank Governor Abbott and his team for entrusting

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me with this. I want to thank my colleagues up here. 

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You know we've, we've built really good relationships

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over the last 2 plus years, um almost 3. And

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so I look forward to continuing that. I, I especially

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want to thank Kathleen. Because when Chairman Lake left

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8 months ago, you took on the interim tag. And you

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had a, you had a tough go. I mean, we went through

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an EEA event this Summer. We went through another

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really cold Winter storm, and your steady hand of leadership

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saw us through all of that. And I think everyone, um

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it should be grateful to you for, for what you did

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and how you led this agency. So thank you for that.

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And, and lastly I, I really what I want to project. 

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Is, you know, people have asked me a lot this week 

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over the past two weeks, how I feel? And, and honestly

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the only emotion that really comes to mind is grateful. 

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You know, it's between PUC Staff and ERCOT Staff, and

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folks in this room and folks watching online, industry. 

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The, the work that was done over the last 3 years. 

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Particularly to support me as Executive Director to

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help educate me and inform me on policy issues. Really

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paved the way for, for what you see today. And I'm

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eternally grateful and indebted to everyone, especially

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for the support that's been provided over the last

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couple of years. So thank you for that. I really do

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appreciate it. Okay. 

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(item:0:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on Chairman Gleeson's appointment) Yeah, I'd like to just say. You know, and for all

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those who weren't here during the swearing in. Just, 

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uh welcome. We're proud to have you up here with

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us. We're excited to see you uh move from uh, uh

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representing the entirety of the Staff. To representing

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the entirety of the uh the, all of the people of the

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State. And um, we uh we know you'll do a great job.

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We'll support you in every way. I appreciate that. I,

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I will say it's the, the transition to having to worry

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about 4 people in my office. To uh, you know, from

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240 people has been quite the transition, so. (item:0:Commissioner Jackson's thoughts on Chairman Gleeson's appointment) Well, 

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I'm particularly excited to have you here. I think

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you know the, the, the background that you have. Is

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gonna bring, you know such a, a strength to our agency. 

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I think the fact that you've grown up in the agency. 

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The fact that you, you care. You know, not just

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about the agency, but the for people across the State. 

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And that you're gonna work in a different capacity, 

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but you'll always kind of have that I think in your

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heart. In terms of the, the caring nature that I've, 

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that I've kind of learned to uh appreciate and to experience

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over the time that we've worked together. So I'm very

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excited, I'm super happy that you're here. And um you

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know, anything that uh that we can do moving forward. 

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You know, working together collaboratively. I think

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is, is just um a wonderful opportunity moving forward

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and something that we all want to do. (item:0:Commissioner Cobos' thoughts on Chairman Gleeson's appointment) And Thomas, I'm

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looking forward to working with you as well. I was

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not able to be at your swearing in ceremony. And I, I was

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often far, far West Texas. But um, one thing I want

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to say is that I'm thrilled to have you up here. 

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Because I know what we have is a shared commitment, 

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a shared commitment to this agency. To our industries

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that we regulate and to the State. And I know that

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you're deeply committed um to those uh very important

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areas. Having spent the time you spent here at the

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Commission as the Executive Director. I know that you

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are invested. You have the passion to serve well

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um and lead this Commission. And, and I think that's

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what the tenant and the foundation of, of uh of this

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everybody here. My Commissioners, the our Executive

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Staff, the industry is that we all have a shared commitment. 

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A shared commitment to success and to serve, um the

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State. 

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(item:0:Shelah Cisneros with Commission Counsel recommends recessing meeting) Chairman and Commissioners, I apologize to interrupt. 

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Just to interject a little excitement into this meeting. 

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I'm advised that the Texas Admin website is down. And

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I recommend recessing this meeting until they can have

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the website back up.

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It's the PUC way. Okay. We will recess for some indeterminate

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amount of time until we can begin broadcasting on the

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internet again, to comply with state law. That's right. Can we go ahead and do Executive

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Session then at this time?

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No. I would advise waiting until, until we are back

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on the record and broadcasting to announce that. (item:0:Chairman Gleeson recesses open meeting) Okay. We'll

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stand in recess. 

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Yup. 

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Well done. (item:0:Chairman Gleeson resumes open meeting) Those technical difficulties some folks we're having. 

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We'll resume the meeting at 9:55am. All right. Shelah,

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will you run us through the Consent Agenda for today?

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(item:0.1:Shelah Cisneros lays out Consent Agenda) Yes. Good morning Commissioners. By individual ballot, 

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the following items are placed on your Consent Agenda: 

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Items 1-15. Thank you. (item:0.1:Chairman Gleeson asks for motion to approve items on Consent Agenda) I'd entertain a motion

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to approve the items described. So moved. Second. Have

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a motion and a second. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Motion prevails. 

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So if it's okay with my colleagues, I think we're going

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to take things a little out of order. We have a couple

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housekeeping matters to take care of. So if it's all right

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with everybody. We could break now and go into Closed

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Session. Take care of that, then come out and discuss

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items on the agenda. If that works for everybody? That

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work? Okay. (item:39:Chairman Gleeson pauses Open Meeting, to hold Closed Session) So having convened a duly noticed Open Meeting. 

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The Commission will now at 9:56am on February 21, 

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2024 hold a Closed Session. Pursuant to Chapter 551

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of the Texas Government Code. It will consult with

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its attorneys, pursuant to Section 551.071 of the

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code. Deliberate personnel matters pursuant to Section

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551.074 of the code. And deliberate security matters, 

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pursuant to Section 551.076 of the code. We'll be

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back shortly.

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(item:39:Chairman Gleeson concludes Closed Session, Public Meeting resumed) Okay. The Closed Session is hereby concluded at 10:01am 

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on February 1, 2024. The Commission will resume

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its Public Meeting. The Commission will take the following

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action on items that were discussed in Closed Session. 

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The first will probably be one of the easier things

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we ever have to do up here. (item:39:Chairman Gleeson's motion to approve Connie Corona as PUC Interim Executive Director) I would move that we

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appoint Connie Corona as Interim Executive Director

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of the PUC effective immediately.

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Second. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. Connie, congratulations.

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(clapping)

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(item:39:Chairman Gleeson's motion to send request to Legislative Budget Board concerning salaries) And secondly, I would move that we instruct Staff to

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send a request to the Legislative Budget Board to set

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the Commissioner's salaries for the remainder of fiscal

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year 2024 at $225,000. And for fiscal year 2025 at

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$230,000. And additionally set the Executive Director's

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salary at $245,559 for the remainder of fiscal year

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2024 and $257,858 in fiscal year 2025.

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So moved. Second. Motion and second. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? 

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Motion prevails. All right. So, Connie if you get with

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Hayley and make sure that we get that submitted to the

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LBB as soon as possible. Will do. Perfect. And thank you Commissioners. 

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Thank you.

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All right. So items 1 through 15 were consented.

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(item:16:Shelah Cisneros confirms there are no Public Comments) So Item 16. Sheila, did anyone sign up for Public Comment

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today? No, Chairman. We did not have anyone sign up

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for Public Comment for any of the item, remainder of the items. 

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Perfect. I don't have anything on Item 17 or 18. (item:19:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 21072) So moving to

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Item 19. That's Project 21072, goal for natural gas generating

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capacity. Staff filed a memo in a proposed order. 

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Werner's walking up. So Werner, if you want to go through your

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memo. Nice shoes. Thank you. 

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(item:19:Commission Staff's Werner Roth on memo concerning goal for natural gas) Werner Roth for Commission Staff. So um in statute

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we have the goal for natural gas that requires since

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2000. For at least 50% of the generating capacity built

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in Texas excluding renewable energy technologies to

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be fueled by natural gas. Part of that requirement

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is that each year by February 14th. Generators are

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required to file a report with the Commission that

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outlines the generation they have built since 2000. 

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And later in the year, Staff is required to um submit

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a report that summarizes those findings. To show that

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we are still in compliance with the goal for natural

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gas. Currently, Staff maintains a list of generators

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have been added since 2000. And that list shows that

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we are well in excess of the 50% threshold that would

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be required for implementing any program to ensure

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we have suff natural gas generation built. And so as

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we have done each year for ever since I started doing

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this. We were requesting a waiver from the requirement

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for generators to file the report with us. And for Staff

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to accumulate a report based off of those filings. 

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We have included with our memo, a proposed order that

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would facilitate that. And with that, I'm happy to

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answer any questions. Makes sense to me. If ya'll have

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any questions or comments? Yeah. Um sorry, go on. 

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(item:19:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I uh, I appreciate this. I've been a believer that this

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goal for natural gas since it started. Was kind of intended

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to ensure that we have enough natural gas capacity

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generation in the State. I asked Werner to look at

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this and if we took out the the word non-renewable. 

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So how much generating capacity in the State is natural

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gas since the beginning? It's below 50%. I highlight

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that because that could be an option for the Legislature.

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If we wanted to create a natural gas generation credit

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trading program. A lot of that in the, in the, in

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the uh statutes already there. But it would already

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be in effect because we're below that 50% threshold. 

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So just uh, food for thought as we go into the next

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Legislative Session. But I would, I'm happy about this. 

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And if it's, if you all don't have anything else to

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say. I'm happy to make the motion. (item:19:Chairman Gleeson's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) Yeah I would, I

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would just say that. You know Connie, if we can add

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that to the list as we're developing our agency report? Legislative

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recommendations going into the 2025 Session. Absolutely. 

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We'll work with each of you on that.

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Sure. Okay. We don't have any other comments. (item:19:Motion to adopt proposed order) I would entertain

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a motion to adopt the proposed order as filed. So moved. 

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Second. Have a motion and a second. All in favor, say aye. Aye. 

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Opposed? Motion prevails. Thank you Werner, appreciate

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you. And by the way, our very own Werner Roth does have

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his picture proudly in Public Utilities Fortnightly,

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the January edition. In case you didn't know that.

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Yes. I don't have anything on Item 20. (item:21:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 52373) So I'm going to bring

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up Items 21 and 22 together. (item:22:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 53298) So we'll call up Project

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52373, review of wholesale electric market design. And

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Project 53298, wholesale electric market design implementation. 

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Staff filed a memo in both of those dockets. Hi, 

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Harika. Hi, good morning.

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(item:21:Commission Staff's Harika Basaran on memo concerning 2 new projects) Harika Basaran for Staff. This is mostly a clean up Item. (item:22:Commission Staff's Harika Basaran on memo concerning 2 new projects)Connie and I have been working

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about to print for the wholesale market design. Most

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of the stuff in that has been done. In the Phase 2 

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Items, they have their own project. So we are just

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giving you a short update. And we are recommending to

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open 2 new project for firm field product. So that it

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can have its own project for budget and offer caps. 

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And also the only open items is the voltage compensation. 

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So we are to track it. We are recommending to open

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a new project for that. And that's really all I have. 

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And if you are ok with it, you would like to close

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those projects. (item:21:Chairman Gleeson's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) Again, I'd say that makes sense. You

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know for, for project hygiene. (item:22:Chairman Gleeson's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) Just to make sure we're

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closing out projects and and accounting for things

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properly. So happy to listen to any comments. I'm in

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agreement with Staff's recommendation. So would you

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characterize this as Spring cleaning? Yes. 

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(item:21:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I would say definitely in agreement on closing out

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the 2 docket items. (item:22:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I do believe that we should open

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a voltage support docket item. If it's ok with the

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other Commissioners? This becomes, this is becoming

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more and more an issue as we have more inverter based resources.

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How voltage is going to stay at the appropriate level

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throughout the system? Do we need to compensate for

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that? We compensate for just a very little bit today. 

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But as this might be an issue that we need to address

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in the future. And it would be good to, to paper and

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get and get positions on it through its own docket. 

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I'm good with that. 

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Harika, you have everything you need? Yes, thank you. 

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Thank you.

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Ok, I don't have anything on Item 23. (item:24:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 54445) So Item 24, Project

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54445. Review of protocols adopted by the independent

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organization. Staff filed a memo in a proposed order. 

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ERCOT is also here. So Harika, if you want to lay out

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recommendations? (item:24:Harika Basaran on Commission Staff's memos recommendations) These are the revision requests approved

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by the December Board. And Staff recommends approval

00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:15.000
all of them. All of them was unanimously approved by

00:14:15.359 --> 00:14:17.658
TAC and Board except one of them, and we highlight

00:14:17.668 --> 00:14:20.979
that. So we are here to answer any questions.

00:14:23.080 --> 00:14:25.989
(item:24:Commissioner Cobos' thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I don't have any feedback on any of the um revision

00:14:26.000 --> 00:14:29.538
requests. And would move to approve the proposed order

00:14:29.548 --> 00:14:32.489
approving the revision request. An associated market

00:14:32.500 --> 00:14:34.440
impact statements, you know, but I'm open to feedback

00:14:34.450 --> 00:14:39.788
on any of them. Yeah. Kathleen? I'm fine. (item:24:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I uh, I guess without

00:14:39.798 --> 00:14:42.158
Will here I get to, uh speak a little bit more. So, 

00:14:42.529 --> 00:14:42.700
uh.

00:14:45.139 --> 00:14:48.359
We'll let him know you said that. He's watching. We're

00:14:48.369 --> 00:14:54.489
now on Texas Admin Jimmy. Um, 1181. I

00:14:54.500 --> 00:14:58.950
do have concerns with. Just like uh, 1186. Um uh,

00:14:58.969 --> 00:15:02.840
as I do the uh the, the NPRR. That deals with

00:15:02.849 --> 00:15:09.009
uh, uh contracting for natural gas. Um, it's my view.

00:15:10.109 --> 00:15:14.460
That um these are things that ERCOT wants to know, but

00:15:14.469 --> 00:15:16.830
these are not critical for market operations for them. 

00:15:17.139 --> 00:15:20.908
It is the individual generator's responsibility to

00:15:20.918 --> 00:15:25.250
know how much coal they have? How much energy they

00:15:25.259 --> 00:15:29.690
have? Unless they are in our firm fuel product and then

00:15:29.700 --> 00:15:32.168
that's obviously critical, because we're paying them

00:15:32.178 --> 00:15:37.399
for that. I, I just uh you know. I think this

00:15:37.408 --> 00:15:41.399
is kind of an overreach quite frankly of the, of ERCOT

00:15:41.408 --> 00:15:44.590
wanting to have a bunch of information. And they can't

00:15:44.599 --> 00:15:46.798
do anything with it. They can't direct somebody to

00:15:46.808 --> 00:15:49.629
burn more coal. They can't direct him to have more

00:15:49.639 --> 00:15:54.950
or less. And it doesn't really do anything for the understanding

00:15:54.960 --> 00:15:57.719
of the operation of the, of the unit. You can have

00:15:57.729 --> 00:16:00.979
a frozen coal pile during a Winter storm and you've

00:16:00.989 --> 00:16:04.259
got a perfectly operational system. And 30 days of coal

00:16:04.269 --> 00:16:07.788
supply in the stack and it can't, can't operate. So

00:16:08.048 --> 00:16:10.908
um, you know. I'm, I'm not going to fight this. 

00:16:10.918 --> 00:16:13.298
But I think we're barking up the wrong tree on this. 

00:16:13.308 --> 00:16:16.690
And this kind of, in my view goes into the Mission

00:16:16.700 --> 00:16:22.580
Creek, uh area. So. Maybe if ERCOT could come up to the

00:16:22.590 --> 00:16:25.500
table, it could be helpful. Hi, Dan.

00:16:28.308 --> 00:16:31.918
Good morning, Dan Woodfin with ERCOT. So maybe if you

00:16:31.928 --> 00:16:35.440
could speak to that. Um, what benefits do you see operationally

00:16:35.450 --> 00:16:40.070
to having this information? (item:24:ERCOT's Dan Woodfin on operational benefits of having information for reliability) So I think, um I kind

00:16:40.080 --> 00:16:42.869
of agree with uh Commissioner Glotfelty. That, that

00:16:42.879 --> 00:16:45.229
we don't need this from a market operation perspective

00:16:45.239 --> 00:16:47.788
but for reliability operations. I think it's, it's

00:16:47.798 --> 00:16:50.599
critical. And one of the things we is the reliability

00:16:50.609 --> 00:16:53.879
coordinator for the region. We, we need situational

00:16:53.889 --> 00:16:58.308
awareness of future reliability risks. And uh, just

00:16:58.320 --> 00:17:01.859
as an example on this particular one. If we've got

00:17:01.869 --> 00:17:06.348
a, a plant that has uh, uh coal, they're running out

00:17:06.358 --> 00:17:09.229
of coal. There may be some rail issue or something. 

00:17:09.618 --> 00:17:13.439
We shouldn't be approving transmission outages that

00:17:13.449 --> 00:17:16.549
depend on one or more of those units at that plant

00:17:16.559 --> 00:17:19.199
being available. So that's something where we, that

00:17:19.209 --> 00:17:23.598
information is, is uh critical to us. To be able to

00:17:23.608 --> 00:17:27.279
uh make good decisions and, and avoid reliability

00:17:27.289 --> 00:17:30.338
problems. Because we have the information that we wouldn't

00:17:30.348 --> 00:17:32.920
do is if we didn't have it. The other thing is that, 

00:17:32.930 --> 00:17:37.699
that uh we've had, uh in the past. We've had government

00:17:37.709 --> 00:17:42.789
officials and regulators ask us. There's a potential

00:17:42.799 --> 00:17:46.289
rail strike coming, is that going to cause you reliability

00:17:46.299 --> 00:17:50.959
problems in the region? And the reason it would is

00:17:50.969 --> 00:17:53.779
if there was a limited amount of coal piles out there

00:17:53.789 --> 00:17:56.529
in coal, in the piles out there at some of the plants. 

00:17:56.868 --> 00:17:58.930
When this happened before, we found out that there

00:17:58.939 --> 00:18:01.818
was one plant that had a very limited amount of coal

00:18:01.828 --> 00:18:04.640
already. And so yes, it was going to cause a problem. 

00:18:05.219 --> 00:18:08.259
We didn't know that until we had to survey and it took

00:18:08.269 --> 00:18:10.828
us a long time to, to get through that. And so that

00:18:10.838 --> 00:18:14.049
there, there really are some good reliability reasons. 

00:18:14.130 --> 00:18:16.239
It's just common sense that we should need to know

00:18:16.250 --> 00:18:19.199
that kind of information as the reliability coordinator. 

00:18:19.250 --> 00:18:20.868
And would you say this is something that was kind of

00:18:20.880 --> 00:18:25.084
born out of our experience during Uri with fuel issues? (item:24:ERCOT's Dan Woodfin on lessons learned from Winter Storm Uri) During

00:18:25.094 --> 00:18:29.324
the, yes. This, this certainly this and the gas supply

00:18:29.334 --> 00:18:32.394
and some of the others are all lessons learned from

00:18:32.404 --> 00:18:35.814
Uri. Where we didn't have good visibility into kind of

00:18:35.824 --> 00:18:39.394
the fuel system. And that's so critical for providing

00:18:39.404 --> 00:18:42.505
inputs to the reliability of the electric system. (item:24:Commissioner Cobos' additonal thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) So

00:18:42.515 --> 00:18:45.414
I kind of view this NPRR similar to what we have

00:18:45.424 --> 00:18:48.555
remanded back on 1186. This is just information that

00:18:48.564 --> 00:18:52.213
ERCOT needs to be able to run the system reliably.

00:18:52.719 --> 00:18:56.229
And you know, one thing that I have found in, in the

00:18:56.239 --> 00:18:59.380
past. You know our, our myself, my office. We reach

00:18:59.390 --> 00:19:02.858
out to the generators and, and uh before every Summer

00:19:02.868 --> 00:19:05.170
and Winter season. And especially during the Winter

00:19:05.180 --> 00:19:08.400
we ask, what's your um coal supply look like? Just

00:19:08.410 --> 00:19:10.000
knowing that, you know, there's different factors that

00:19:10.009 --> 00:19:14.279
could implement, uh impact a uh generation company's

00:19:15.068 --> 00:19:18.108
supply of coal. So it's just information we have to

00:19:18.118 --> 00:19:20.920
ask. And it would be helpful to have a repository at

00:19:20.969 --> 00:19:23.549
ERCOT to know like where everybody sits. It's not,

00:19:23.559 --> 00:19:27.358
there's no compliance aspect, like non-compliance penalty

00:19:27.368 --> 00:19:31.789
aspect to 1181. It's just information you, you want

00:19:31.799 --> 00:19:36.529
to have so that you are more situationally aware from

00:19:36.539 --> 00:19:39.289
a reliability standpoint. I think that's correct. Yes. 

00:19:40.539 --> 00:19:43.049
(item:24:Commissioner Jackson's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I think part of what you share with me. Is that um

00:19:43.420 --> 00:19:46.209
you know many, much of the information that you are

00:19:46.219 --> 00:19:51.078
requesting is information that we're receiving informally. 

00:19:51.578 --> 00:19:55.078
And so in one regard, it is just kind of formulating

00:19:55.088 --> 00:19:59.239
or formalizing an existing process. Correct. And I

00:19:59.250 --> 00:20:02.380
believe this was something that, you know, ultimately

00:20:02.390 --> 00:20:06.390
is Harika mentioned. This was, this was unanimously approved

00:20:06.400 --> 00:20:11.140
at both PRS and, and TAC by the stakeholders. So

00:20:11.150 --> 00:20:14.630
they, they saw the need as well. So as we move forward

00:20:14.640 --> 00:20:18.969
and uh of course, want to manage risk. And to ensure

00:20:18.979 --> 00:20:21.420
the best reliability that we can get from the system. 

00:20:21.818 --> 00:20:24.779
We're also at the same time, managing change. And

00:20:24.789 --> 00:20:29.250
so any data and information that we can get. Again, targeted

00:20:29.259 --> 00:20:32.269
towards an objective. Knowing what the objective is

00:20:32.279 --> 00:20:35.118
going in. And so we are securing that information to

00:20:35.130 --> 00:20:38.809
meet that objective. Is going to help us to better manage

00:20:38.818 --> 00:20:44.150
the system. Particularly as we see increased need and

00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:47.279
growth in the system, as well as increased diversity. 

00:20:47.489 --> 00:20:50.118
So to be able to kind of put all those pieces together. 

00:20:51.250 --> 00:20:54.900
We we need, we need the data to be provided in a

00:20:55.000 --> 00:21:00.078
formal process, is my understanding. (item:24:Commissioner Glotfelty's additional thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) Again I,

00:21:00.088 --> 00:21:04.939
I think that having this information does not tell

00:21:04.949 --> 00:21:08.078
you what the status of a generating facility will be

00:21:08.098 --> 00:21:11.309
when you most need that facility. It will, it's 

00:21:11.318 --> 00:21:15.489
an information point that's important. If we can't find

00:21:15.500 --> 00:21:17.719
out that there's a coal strike going on without these

00:21:17.880 --> 00:21:21.420
reports being filed. I think we've got bigger challenges

00:21:21.430 --> 00:21:25.338
than, than the strike. The vast majority of our coal

00:21:25.348 --> 00:21:28.799
comes from Wyoming as does a lot of the coal for all

00:21:28.809 --> 00:21:32.618
of the Southeastern plants, coal plants. So we, we

00:21:32.630 --> 00:21:38.019
do have and we have had rail problems. We've, we've

00:21:38.029 --> 00:21:40.709
pivoted away from the mine mouth coal plants here in

00:21:40.719 --> 00:21:44.939
in Texas. So I, I just. I think we should keep

00:21:44.949 --> 00:21:47.489
an eye on this. I mean, you know, next we're gonna. 

00:21:47.680 --> 00:21:50.630
I hope this doesn't become next. We're gonna ask, you

00:21:50.640 --> 00:21:53.328
know, how many uh extra water pumps you have? And uh

00:21:53.338 --> 00:21:56.084
how many transformers do you have? And how many of this, that and

00:21:56.094 --> 00:21:59.295
the other you have? They're all reliability issues, 

00:21:59.535 --> 00:22:03.953
they all help, you know, inform your situational awareness. 

00:22:03.963 --> 00:22:07.934
But I think it has to be the most critical pieces and

00:22:07.943 --> 00:22:10.055
I'm willing to let this one go. But I wanted to voice

00:22:10.064 --> 00:22:14.299
my, my reservation about where it's going to go. And

00:22:14.309 --> 00:22:16.618
what we have before us is vastly different than the

00:22:16.630 --> 00:22:19.880
NPRR that was originally sponsored. Correct? There

00:22:19.890 --> 00:22:24.140
were quite a few changes made actually by market participants. 

00:22:24.150 --> 00:22:28.259
I think the ultimate version was was filed by a group

00:22:28.269 --> 00:22:31.189
of market participants, generators that own coal plants. 

00:22:31.858 --> 00:22:34.949
Yeah. And so I mean, just where I come from. (item:24:Chairman Gleeson's additional thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) You know, 

00:22:34.959 --> 00:22:39.670
is for me to substitute my judgment for the stakeholder

00:22:39.680 --> 00:22:42.140
process, I think has to be a pretty high bar. I think

00:22:42.150 --> 00:22:44.539
this is what, you know, as I was learning about this. 

00:22:44.739 --> 00:22:47.420
This is what I want out of a robust stakeholder process. 

00:22:47.500 --> 00:22:51.000
A NPRR that sponsored, robust debate happening and

00:22:51.009 --> 00:22:54.209
everyone coming to uh a negotiated outcome. And so

00:22:54.358 --> 00:22:56.880
just, just for me at least. I think to, to substitute

00:22:56.890 --> 00:23:00.068
something different from what came out of that process

00:23:00.078 --> 00:23:01.969
um is probably going to be a really high bar for me

00:23:01.979 --> 00:23:03.789
going forward. So

00:23:05.509 --> 00:23:05.930
Okay. 

00:23:07.650 --> 00:23:10.449
No other discussion. (item:24:Motion to adopt proposed order) Then I would entertain a motion

00:23:10.459 --> 00:23:12.769
to adopt the proposed order as filed. 

00:23:14.549 --> 00:23:19.088
So moved. Second. Motion and a second. All in favor? Aye. Opposed? Motion prevails.

00:23:19.578 --> 00:23:20.420
Thank you, Dan.

00:23:24.549 --> 00:23:30.729
(item:25:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 54702) So next up, we have Item 25, 54702. Report of the Texas

00:23:30.759 --> 00:23:36.039
Reliability Entity. Say Mr. Albright and his team here. 

00:23:36.400 --> 00:23:40.539
So I think Jim y'all are here to talk about the

00:23:40.549 --> 00:23:43.380
Black Start Report from December of 23. And then maybe

00:23:43.390 --> 00:23:46.189
some of the risks that you all are looking at uh throughout

00:23:46.199 --> 00:23:47.108
this calendar year. 

00:23:49.578 --> 00:23:50.660
It should be on. Okay.

00:23:52.170 --> 00:23:56.529
Thank you. (item:25:Texas RE's Jim Albright gives appreciation Commissioner Glotfelty & Chairman Gleeson) Jim Albright, Texas RE. Yes. Chair 

00:23:56.539 --> 00:23:58.880
Gleeson, we're here to talk about the focus areas

00:23:58.890 --> 00:24:01.779
for next year. We're also gonna touch on the Bury

00:24:01.789 --> 00:24:04.689
black start report that was uh just produced I guess

00:24:04.699 --> 00:24:07.689
mid December. So we're gonna touch on those areas. 

00:24:07.890 --> 00:24:09.578
I just want to touch on a couple of things before I

00:24:09.588 --> 00:24:11.358
turn it over to the team to talk about those things. 

00:24:11.588 --> 00:24:14.680
One I wanna um, I wanna thank Commissioner Glotfelty

00:24:14.689 --> 00:24:17.618
for allowing us to have this continuous dialogue. 

00:24:17.630 --> 00:24:21.259
We were here last, we were here in November uh recently

00:24:21.269 --> 00:24:24.189
and we're back today. And we'll try to continue

00:24:24.199 --> 00:24:26.380
when there's meaningful information that we want to

00:24:26.390 --> 00:24:28.880
provide to you. We'll keep coming back. So I want to

00:24:28.890 --> 00:24:30.868
assure you Commission Glotfelty that we still want to have

00:24:30.880 --> 00:24:34.098
this dialogue so I really appreciate that. And I want

00:24:34.108 --> 00:24:38.078
to thank Commissioner Glotfelty for serving on our Board. He's

00:24:38.088 --> 00:24:40.959
done a lot of good work for us. He's been a great

00:24:40.969 --> 00:24:43.729
voice uh, in our conversations that we're having at

00:24:43.739 --> 00:24:47.088
our board meetings. Um he's also uh benefited us by

00:24:47.098 --> 00:24:49.088
being actual keynote speaker in one of our workshops

00:24:49.098 --> 00:24:51.269
this past year. So we really appreciate that. And uh

00:24:51.279 --> 00:24:53.750
we want to thank you for all you do for reliability

00:24:53.759 --> 00:24:57.199
here in Texas um especially in the ERCOT interconnection

00:24:57.209 --> 00:25:02.608
for our sake. I wanna welcome Chair Gleeson. 

00:25:02.618 --> 00:25:05.439
We look forward to his point of view, working with

00:25:05.449 --> 00:25:07.930
our board and working with the organization. I also

00:25:07.939 --> 00:25:11.009
want to say that I was the one who brought him here. 

00:25:11.019 --> 00:25:13.838
So I'm gonna take some credit. That's right as you

00:25:13.848 --> 00:25:15.640
should, as you said. (item:25:Chairman Gleeson confirms his taking over Texas RE Board seat) Yeah and it, it's probably worth

00:25:15.650 --> 00:25:18.699
saying then. You know Jimmy with all, all you've

00:25:18.709 --> 00:25:21.170
got going on with the Nuclear Working Group and taking

00:25:21.180 --> 00:25:24.049
over MISO. Happy to take over responsibility for

00:25:24.059 --> 00:25:28.049
Texas RE. Happy to give it. Thank you. I'm not sure

00:25:28.059 --> 00:25:31.729
how I should take that. No. We look, we look

00:25:31.739 --> 00:25:33.890
forward to working with you. And we know that, you know

00:25:33.900 --> 00:25:35.818
you'll bring a different perspective and, and, and

00:25:35.828 --> 00:25:38.209
a good perspective. So it'll be, it'll be good to continue

00:25:38.219 --> 00:25:40.279
to build on the foundation that we have with Commissioner

00:25:40.699 --> 00:25:43.699
Glotfelty. With that, I'm gonna turn it over to

00:25:43.880 --> 00:25:45.380
I think we're gonna start with Joseph. He's gonna talk

00:25:45.390 --> 00:25:47.209
a little bit about the focus areas. And then Mark is gonna

00:25:47.219 --> 00:25:49.500
finish it off with the Uri black start report and what

00:25:49.509 --> 00:25:53.739
we found out of that. (item:25:Texas RE's Joseph Younger on focus areas) Good morning, uh Commissioners. 

00:25:53.789 --> 00:25:56.009
As Jim mentioned, I just want to talk for a few minutes

00:25:56.019 --> 00:25:59.799
about the risks we're seeing on the system. And our

00:25:59.809 --> 00:26:02.358
oversight priorities for the year to kind of set out

00:26:02.368 --> 00:26:05.630
what we're gonna be doing through our compliance monitoring

00:26:05.640 --> 00:26:09.130
and enforcement program for the rest of the year. 

00:26:09.779 --> 00:26:14.750
We each year the EROs, so NERC and the regions. Produce

00:26:14.759 --> 00:26:17.449
a document that's called our compliance monitoring

00:26:17.459 --> 00:26:20.880
and enforcement implementation plan, which is a mouthful. 

00:26:20.890 --> 00:26:23.890
But what it really is, is just a list of our high level 

00:26:24.000 --> 00:26:27.769
priorities and items that we're going to focus on. As 

00:26:27.779 --> 00:26:31.739
we do our risk analysis and then engage with entities. 

00:26:32.059 --> 00:26:37.348
The document highlights 8 priorities for this year

00:26:37.479 --> 00:26:40.739
and they're divided into really 2 buckets. (item:25:Joseph Younger on the two bucket priorities) The first

00:26:40.750 --> 00:26:43.818
bucket looks at energy risks. So those would be risks

00:26:43.828 --> 00:26:46.509
on your operations and planning side. And the second

00:26:46.519 --> 00:26:48.848
bucket looks at security risks. Which is primarily

00:26:48.858 --> 00:26:52.009
cyber security, but also physical security. And I'll

00:26:52.019 --> 00:26:54.650
touch on that in a minute. But to kind of talk about

00:26:54.660 --> 00:26:57.729
the energy risks that we're seeing. The first two risk

00:26:57.739 --> 00:27:00.108
priorities that we're going to focus on this year,

00:27:00.118 --> 00:27:03.140
focus on inverter based resources. That we've already

00:27:03.150 --> 00:27:06.059
been talking about. (item:25:Texas RE's Joseph Younger on IBR resources) And, and we're continuing to look

00:27:06.068 --> 00:27:10.539
at at IBR issues both in terms of resource performance

00:27:10.739 --> 00:27:14.529
as well as the need for accurate modeling of those

00:27:14.539 --> 00:27:18.500
resources. And the power system in general as they integrate

00:27:18.680 --> 00:27:22.640
uh onto the system. So as part of our auditing process

00:27:22.650 --> 00:27:25.880
for this year, we'll be leveraging standards to ensure

00:27:25.890 --> 00:27:28.000
that there is clear and consistent interconnection

00:27:28.009 --> 00:27:31.670
requirements around these IBR resources. And that they're

00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:34.160
being adequately studied as they come onto the system. 

00:27:34.578 --> 00:27:38.259
We're emphasizing also that they need to have appropriate

00:27:38.269 --> 00:27:41.368
voltage and frequency ride through capabilities. They're

00:27:41.380 --> 00:27:44.400
set forth under our current standards and those activities

00:27:44.410 --> 00:27:49.328
are ongoing while NERC and the regions are working

00:27:49.338 --> 00:27:53.250
to implement a FERC directive to revise the standards. 

00:27:53.259 --> 00:27:58.289
FERC issued an order in October identifying some reliability

00:27:58.299 --> 00:28:02.348
gaps that relate to inverter based resources. And really their

00:28:02.358 --> 00:28:05.309
integration into the system and their unique operating

00:28:05.318 --> 00:28:08.920
characteristics. And those are around data sharing requirements, 

00:28:08.930 --> 00:28:12.068
so making sure that adequate information is being provided. 

00:28:12.239 --> 00:28:15.750
That post disturbance information is being provided. 

00:28:15.838 --> 00:28:19.390
Model validation requirements so that the as built

00:28:19.400 --> 00:28:23.439
system with the IBR resource matches what's in the

00:28:23.449 --> 00:28:27.719
models and so the behavior can be understood. Also planning

00:28:27.729 --> 00:28:30.380
and operational assessments and that they're incorporated

00:28:30.390 --> 00:28:33.680
into that in an adequate way. And then finally performance

00:28:33.689 --> 00:28:36.519
requirements and in particularly the ability to ride

00:28:36.529 --> 00:28:40.318
through a disturbance as well as operational characteristics

00:28:40.328 --> 00:28:44.618
like ramping. So all that is, is in process under the

00:28:44.759 --> 00:28:48.459
FERC order. NERC filed a work plan with FERC a couple

00:28:48.469 --> 00:28:52.239
of weeks ago. It outlines the plan to implement all

00:28:52.250 --> 00:28:55.670
those standards projects. The first standards will

00:28:55.680 --> 00:28:58.180
be filed with FERC October of this year and those are

00:28:58.189 --> 00:29:02.275
around the IBR performance requirement and uh uh the

00:29:02.285 --> 00:29:05.875
post event data analysis. So as we're approaching those

00:29:05.884 --> 00:29:09.104
deadlines, uh we'll be emphasizing the new requirements

00:29:09.114 --> 00:29:12.324
in our outreach also in our engagements as well. 

00:29:12.334 --> 00:29:15.064
You know why they're not enforceable. We'll be looking

00:29:15.074 --> 00:29:17.953
at, you know, where folks are and exchanging information

00:29:17.963 --> 00:29:21.164
as we, we go through that process. (item:25:Joseph Younger on extreme weather response) The other item,

00:29:21.174 --> 00:29:24.045
obviously that we, we talk about again is extreme weather

00:29:24.055 --> 00:29:28.199
response. We, we keep talking about that issue as an

00:29:28.209 --> 00:29:31.160
initial matter, the cold weather preparedness requirements

00:29:31.170 --> 00:29:34.130
under the NERC standards are now in place. Those are

00:29:34.140 --> 00:29:37.759
to have plans to mitigate operational emergencies.

00:29:38.059 --> 00:29:41.969
So we're already engaged on those standards. We continue

00:29:41.979 --> 00:29:45.739
to do so through targeted engagements this year through

00:29:45.750 --> 00:29:48.559
our risk process. And we'll be conducting several site

00:29:48.568 --> 00:29:52.098
visits with generators that we're targeting that are

00:29:52.108 --> 00:29:55.608
on our schedule. To look at their preparedness both

00:29:55.618 --> 00:29:57.920
in those plans and for the new requirements that are

00:29:57.930 --> 00:30:01.739
coming. And on that note again, FERC has issued another

00:30:01.750 --> 00:30:04.670
order. They issued it back in February when they approved

00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:08.900
the second round of our Winterization standards. Those

00:30:08.910 --> 00:30:11.239
standards are now working their way through the stakeholder

00:30:11.250 --> 00:30:13.709
process and they were just approved. And they should

00:30:13.719 --> 00:30:16.549
be filed with FERC next month and will be effective

00:30:16.559 --> 00:30:20.689
in October of this coming year. So to address those

00:30:20.699 --> 00:30:23.739
directives. (item:25:Joseph Younger on facility ratings) And then, and then finally we're continuing

00:30:23.750 --> 00:30:28.219
to focus on facility ratings, which is something that

00:30:28.229 --> 00:30:31.729
we've focused on for a number of years. And, and really

00:30:31.739 --> 00:30:35.269
across NERC in the regions have really tried to engage

00:30:35.279 --> 00:30:38.489
with essentially every entity. That's responsible for

00:30:38.689 --> 00:30:42.348
setting facility ratings and then providing those accurate

00:30:42.358 --> 00:30:45.209
facility ratings in our case to ERCOT. So that, that's

00:30:45.219 --> 00:30:47.809
all reflected on the system. So that's going to continue

00:30:47.818 --> 00:30:51.689
to be a priority on the energy risk side for us in

00:30:51.699 --> 00:30:56.598
the coming year. (item:25:Joseph Younger on security concerns) In terms of security, we're continuing

00:30:56.608 --> 00:31:00.420
to see cyber security vulnerabilities and evolving

00:31:00.430 --> 00:31:03.250
threats and they're really evolving at an unceasing

00:31:03.259 --> 00:31:07.858
pace which is no surprise. And so like energy risks

00:31:07.868 --> 00:31:12.239
we're focused on four key areas. Remote connectivity, 

00:31:12.439 --> 00:31:16.078
supply chain security, incident response, and then

00:31:16.088 --> 00:31:19.598
physical security. In the first three elements, the

00:31:19.608 --> 00:31:22.078
remote connectivity, supply chain and incident response. 

00:31:22.289 --> 00:31:24.828
Those are the same as last year. They're continuing

00:31:24.838 --> 00:31:28.049
to focus on the risk we're seeing around vendor compromise, 

00:31:28.118 --> 00:31:32.078
credential harvesting, ransomware. As well as just threats

00:31:32.088 --> 00:31:35.838
that are pervasive given the geopolitical environment

00:31:35.969 --> 00:31:40.088
and what we're seeing from state actors. So we're closely

00:31:40.098 --> 00:31:42.739
monitoring the ways that entities are protecting their

00:31:42.750 --> 00:31:46.505
logical and physical perimeters, but also how their

00:31:46.515 --> 00:31:50.223
response plans. Under the assumption that they will

00:31:50.233 --> 00:31:53.594
be compromised. And that's really an inevitability

00:31:53.604 --> 00:31:57.693
if you engage in these, you know, cybersecurity conversations. 

00:31:57.934 --> 00:32:01.723
So you need to have a robust plan to respond when that

00:32:01.733 --> 00:32:05.213
happens. There's more standards development in this

00:32:05.223 --> 00:32:08.324
area as well, particularly around internal network

00:32:08.334 --> 00:32:11.463
security monitoring. So our current sip standards really

00:32:11.473 --> 00:32:14.769
look at the perimeter and are designed like to like

00:32:14.779 --> 00:32:18.000
castle walls to protect the perimeter. Internal

00:32:18.009 --> 00:32:21.410
network security monitoring is trying to move beyond

00:32:21.420 --> 00:32:25.680
that paradigm. And look at how information flows within

00:32:25.689 --> 00:32:28.799
the organization and monitor that traffic, establish

00:32:28.809 --> 00:32:32.338
baselines around that traffic. So again, it makes the

00:32:32.348 --> 00:32:35.299
systems more resilient if there's an incident. And

00:32:35.309 --> 00:32:38.078
so those standards are are underway. And that's another

00:32:38.088 --> 00:32:41.078
outreach priority that we have for the coming year. 

00:32:41.630 --> 00:32:45.078
And then the final area is physical security. We've

00:32:45.088 --> 00:32:47.269
all heard about the high profile attacks that happened

00:32:47.279 --> 00:32:51.068
in North Carolina, in the Pacific Northwest. So that's

00:32:51.078 --> 00:32:55.509
a new focus area across NERC and the regions this year

00:32:55.519 --> 00:32:58.920
in light of those incidents. So we're leveraging our

00:32:58.930 --> 00:33:02.309
sip 14, which is our physical security standard uh to

00:33:02.318 --> 00:33:05.719
look at those incidents. And also look at the, the preparations

00:33:05.729 --> 00:33:09.618
around uh, identification of critical substations that

00:33:09.630 --> 00:33:12.500
can have an acute reliability risk and then what

00:33:12.509 --> 00:33:15.670
the physical controls are. And also looking at the steps

00:33:15.680 --> 00:33:18.618
to uh build a more resilient system. So there aren't

00:33:18.630 --> 00:33:21.660
those critical nodes as well and have those conversations. 

00:33:22.088 --> 00:33:24.920
So all that is that's again outlined in the, the

00:33:25.068 --> 00:33:28.019
cmip IP. That's a public document. It's available on

00:33:28.029 --> 00:33:31.140
our website. It's, it's intended to provide information

00:33:31.150 --> 00:33:34.118
for stakeholders uh as much as what we're saying we're

00:33:34.130 --> 00:33:37.259
doing, but also talk about the risks. So we'd encourage

00:33:37.269 --> 00:33:40.328
folks to, to take a look at it. And with that

00:33:40.338 --> 00:33:43.358
I'll, I'll pass it over to, to Mark. To talk about

00:33:43.368 --> 00:33:46.630
the Uri black star report. (item:25:Texas RE's Mark Henry on report concerning lessons learned from Winter Storm Uri) Good morning Chair Gleeson, 

00:33:46.640 --> 00:33:49.140
Commissioners. I'm Mark Henry. I'm Chief Engineer and

00:33:49.150 --> 00:33:51.709
Director of Reliability Outreach. And I wanted to talk

00:33:51.719 --> 00:33:55.059
with you very briefly about the report that we worked

00:33:55.068 --> 00:33:59.338
on with Staff from FERC, NERC and all of the other NERC

00:33:59.348 --> 00:34:01.900
regions. To go back and look at one of the things we

00:34:01.910 --> 00:34:04.759
learned from Winter Storm Uri. When we're going through

00:34:04.769 --> 00:34:06.900
all the generation outages that occurred during that

00:34:06.910 --> 00:34:11.320
period of time. We noticed that uh 82% of the black

00:34:11.329 --> 00:34:15.500
start units that we had had some type of D rate outage

00:34:15.510 --> 00:34:18.659
or weren't able to start. And that raised some concerns

00:34:18.668 --> 00:34:20.949
because you expect these units to be there. If things

00:34:20.958 --> 00:34:24.349
deteriorated to what is, you know, frankly, an unthinkable

00:34:24.360 --> 00:34:27.949
condition where the grid did collapse. We've long prepared

00:34:27.958 --> 00:34:31.030
for that. ERCOT in the time that I've been in this

00:34:31.039 --> 00:34:34.789
industry has led the entities in this region to prepare

00:34:34.800 --> 00:34:36.978
some pretty solid programs. But there's always something

00:34:36.989 --> 00:34:39.570
more that can be learned. And so that was the purpose

00:34:39.579 --> 00:34:42.619
of the study. It was the 26th recommendation in the

00:34:42.628 --> 00:34:46.250
Uri report, so we're following up on it. And uh the report

00:34:46.260 --> 00:34:49.590
came out in December and we filed it with y'all. And

00:34:49.599 --> 00:34:51.800
again briefly, what we did is we interviewed a sample

00:34:51.809 --> 00:34:56.079
of entities uh and got some insight both from the electric

00:34:56.119 --> 00:34:59.878
generation, electric transmission and from the natural

00:34:59.889 --> 00:35:03.550
gas industry. And what what we learned in there. First

00:35:03.559 --> 00:35:06.050
of all, is that there are a lot of things that have

00:35:06.059 --> 00:35:08.539
happened in this region that should be shared with

00:35:08.550 --> 00:35:11.250
the rest of the country. Some of the things that we

00:35:11.260 --> 00:35:13.909
focused on. (item:25:Mark Henry on winterization activities) First of all is winterization activities

00:35:13.918 --> 00:35:16.849
here. You know, time it took us to write this study

00:35:16.909 --> 00:35:19.489
you all had approved a lot of measures. And they were

00:35:19.500 --> 00:35:22.860
being implemented by not just here but also the Railroad

00:35:22.869 --> 00:35:26.199
Commission. So the winterization activities were noted

00:35:26.208 --> 00:35:30.010
in the report. We also have an awareness in ERCOT

00:35:30.019 --> 00:35:32.269
now of some of the units that aren't under a black

00:35:32.280 --> 00:35:34.969
start ancillary service contract but may be able to

00:35:34.978 --> 00:35:37.050
provide some services. It's another option in your

00:35:37.059 --> 00:35:40.510
pocket. We also see the coordination of testing

00:35:40.728 --> 00:35:43.168
uh between the transmission companies and the generators. 

00:35:43.179 --> 00:35:45.929
As a plus that the rest of the country can benefit

00:35:45.938 --> 00:35:50.760
from knowing about. (item:25:Mark Henry on batteries) And um one thing too about batteries. 

00:35:50.769 --> 00:35:53.918
Not, not the big storage batteries we have. But the

00:35:53.929 --> 00:35:56.500
batteries and the substations that run communications

00:35:56.510 --> 00:35:58.878
equipment, protective relays and things like that.

00:35:59.019 --> 00:36:01.500
There was a strong awareness of how those things may

00:36:01.510 --> 00:36:05.829
be affected and have limitations in black start situations. 

00:36:05.840 --> 00:36:08.668
So those were positives that we shared among many other

00:36:08.679 --> 00:36:12.559
things that were done since Uri happened. But we did

00:36:12.570 --> 00:36:16.159
have seven recommendations overall. (item:25:Mark Henry on seven overall recommendations) The first recommendation

00:36:16.168 --> 00:36:18.728
had four subparts. And the first part of that was to

00:36:18.860 --> 00:36:22.340
examine fuel diversity, single points of failure, fuel

00:36:22.349 --> 00:36:25.099
arrangements and other related limitations. For each

00:36:25.110 --> 00:36:28.648
of the black start resources more thoroughly. Another

00:36:28.659 --> 00:36:31.590
thing was to evaluate the feasibility of bringing some

00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:34.860
other things into the black start plans as resources. 

00:36:35.079 --> 00:36:38.599
You know we, we pretty much depend on a set of

00:36:38.610 --> 00:36:41.099
natural gas fired units. I think there's one that's

00:36:41.110 --> 00:36:44.019
not presently. They have the ability to use dual fuel, 

00:36:44.030 --> 00:36:46.510
it's great, but there are other options too. We've

00:36:46.519 --> 00:36:49.978
got some direct current ties. We have variable frequency

00:36:49.989 --> 00:36:53.090
transformer in one place in the system. We've used

00:36:53.099 --> 00:36:55.300
block load transfers, not that we necessarily have

00:36:55.309 --> 00:36:58.280
to change the plans radically. But perhaps these sort

00:36:58.289 --> 00:37:01.349
of resources and things in the future. Energy storage

00:37:01.360 --> 00:37:04.119
resources are one that's prominent and perhaps some

00:37:04.128 --> 00:37:07.958
aspects of, of our renewable fleet. So as the grid

00:37:07.969 --> 00:37:11.079
transforms, perhaps the way we can look at black start

00:37:11.239 --> 00:37:13.668
may transform a little bit. Still have to have a very

00:37:13.679 --> 00:37:17.280
solid and dependable system though. Another thing

00:37:17.289 --> 00:37:19.309
that we thought was important with the natural gas

00:37:19.320 --> 00:37:21.760
importance. Is maybe we should look at trying to use

00:37:21.769 --> 00:37:25.269
natural gas storage for fuel in these units and see

00:37:25.280 --> 00:37:28.769
if there's some connections there. We have historically

00:37:28.780 --> 00:37:31.349
a lot of problems with field operations and natural

00:37:31.360 --> 00:37:34.159
gas are spread all over the state. Perhaps there's

00:37:34.168 --> 00:37:37.418
enough in storage to give us a more assured initial

00:37:37.429 --> 00:37:40.059
start off between that and the fuel oil that's now

00:37:40.070 --> 00:37:43.320
required. And then the last piece was a minor thing. 

00:37:43.329 --> 00:37:45.938
Is that we noticed that there's not a clear requirement

00:37:45.949 --> 00:37:49.599
to test black start resources on their alternate fuels

00:37:49.610 --> 00:37:53.648
starting from that alternate fuel. Recommendation two

00:37:53.918 --> 00:37:57.269
is more about coordinating and we're asking that for

00:37:57.280 --> 00:38:00.458
the regulators to facilitate and moderate engagement

00:38:00.570 --> 00:38:04.329
among the natural gas and electric entities. And perhaps

00:38:04.340 --> 00:38:07.619
some other industries as well. Water, communications, 

00:38:07.628 --> 00:38:10.469
transportation may have parts in this. But the key

00:38:10.478 --> 00:38:13.849
that we focused on is natural gas and electric. And

00:38:13.860 --> 00:38:16.239
we want to make sure that we understand. What is the

00:38:16.250 --> 00:38:19.668
impact of a blackout on the natural gas supply chain? 

00:38:19.789 --> 00:38:23.250
We didn't get an impression that that was well understood

00:38:23.260 --> 00:38:25.438
at this point. We know that the gas companies have

00:38:25.449 --> 00:38:28.159
done a lot of work. What we expect from the sample that

00:38:28.168 --> 00:38:31.389
we talked to. And then another part of that too. 

00:38:31.559 --> 00:38:35.059
Is to um make sure that our black star plan recognizes

00:38:35.070 --> 00:38:38.489
that and tries to look at the needs of both the electric

00:38:38.500 --> 00:38:41.909
and gas industries. If we were to ever have the unthinkable

00:38:42.090 --> 00:38:45.019
uh be prepared for that. And our last recommendation

00:38:45.030 --> 00:38:47.559
again was mostly for the regulators. To make sure that

00:38:47.570 --> 00:38:51.369
we prioritize the natural gas supply to the black start

00:38:51.378 --> 00:38:54.159
units. The Public Utility Commission, you all issued

00:38:54.168 --> 00:38:56.918
a guidance memo some time ago that that recommended

00:38:56.929 --> 00:38:59.360
that as one of the top things. The Railroad Commission's

00:38:59.369 --> 00:39:02.059
curtailment, I think still has all the generators lumped

00:39:02.070 --> 00:39:05.219
together. I really think that perhaps just looking

00:39:05.228 --> 00:39:08.478
at the black start plans that can be accomplished within

00:39:08.489 --> 00:39:11.250
the regulations that we have now. Just might need some

00:39:11.260 --> 00:39:13.719
encouragement to look for those things and set them

00:39:13.728 --> 00:39:17.869
up. So that's a summary of the report again. We recognized

00:39:17.878 --> 00:39:21.579
a lot of things here. The uh critical gas mapping is

00:39:21.590 --> 00:39:24.250
is one of the key things also that, that we see. And

00:39:24.260 --> 00:39:27.010
particularly with the Legislation that was passed last

00:39:27.019 --> 00:39:30.228
May. That allows the transmission and distribution

00:39:30.239 --> 00:39:32.469
companies at least in their area to work with the gas

00:39:32.478 --> 00:39:36.269
companies identify which of those facilities. That

00:39:36.280 --> 00:39:39.135
supply natural gas or transport natural gas are gonna

00:39:39.144 --> 00:39:42.114
be connected to the black start units. So that was

00:39:42.125 --> 00:39:44.313
a, that was a big thing for us to see that happen. 

00:39:44.664 --> 00:39:47.023
And uh we'd like to see more follow up. In fact, I'm

00:39:47.034 --> 00:39:49.773
aware that there's a little bit going on now that's

00:39:49.784 --> 00:39:52.155
very encouraging. And that's one of our future actions

00:39:52.164 --> 00:39:55.405
is gonna be to continue to follow up on these recommendations. 

00:39:55.724 --> 00:39:58.664
Another thing we're gonna be doing, although I don't

00:39:58.675 --> 00:40:00.945
know if I'll be doing it personally. Is there's

00:40:00.954 --> 00:40:03.485
going to be a follow up in the rest of the country

00:40:03.494 --> 00:40:06.503
because of Winter Storm Elliott. As you all are

00:40:06.514 --> 00:40:09.309
aware that they had some issues there. Their black

00:40:09.320 --> 00:40:12.579
start units didn't perform quite as they expected either. 

00:40:12.889 --> 00:40:15.079
And so there'll be a follow up report, undoubtedly

00:40:15.090 --> 00:40:17.889
we'll learn things from that activity and bring them

00:40:17.898 --> 00:40:21.090
back here. But we do intend more outreach within our

00:40:21.099 --> 00:40:24.219
region among the entities some of the ERCOT groups. 

00:40:25.168 --> 00:40:29.179
We also want to promote the attendance at ERCOT's groups. 

00:40:29.188 --> 00:40:32.059
They have a gas, electric coordinating group. They have

00:40:32.070 --> 00:40:35.458
a black start gas coordination working group hasn't

00:40:35.469 --> 00:40:38.239
met in a long time. We'd like to encourage those things

00:40:38.250 --> 00:40:41.530
to pick up again. And perhaps consider this and some

00:40:41.539 --> 00:40:44.438
other ideas that are out there. And then the last piece

00:40:44.449 --> 00:40:47.530
is uh we, we want to explore the opportunity perhaps

00:40:47.539 --> 00:40:50.789
for some type of tabletop exercise that involves natural

00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:53.780
gas and the electric companies and black start. We

00:40:53.789 --> 00:40:56.039
already have a great black start training program.

00:40:56.300 --> 00:40:59.070
We have Black Start Testing. We hope to perhaps

00:40:59.079 --> 00:41:02.090
get the gas companies to witness some of those and

00:41:02.099 --> 00:41:05.039
maybe some reciprocal activities on their side. So

00:41:05.050 --> 00:41:07.050
that's what I had to report. And again, I thank you

00:41:07.059 --> 00:41:07.969
for the opportunity.

00:41:09.530 --> 00:41:12.429
(item:25:Chairman Gleeson's thoughts on Texas RE's reports) I want to thank you all for being here. Jim. I wanna

00:41:12.438 --> 00:41:15.059
thank you and your staff for, for the work you do.

00:41:15.489 --> 00:41:18.369
I sat in on those meetings with the, with the FERC

00:41:18.378 --> 00:41:22.639
representatives when they came down and um it was immensely

00:41:22.648 --> 00:41:24.369
helpful to have your staff there in those meetings

00:41:24.378 --> 00:41:26.869
with us uh and the Railroad Commission. So I, I do

00:41:26.878 --> 00:41:29.360
appreciate that. Y'all have any questions for Texas

00:41:29.369 --> 00:41:33.648
RE? Yeah. (item:25:Commissioner Cobos' thoughts on the Texas RE's reports) I guess on, with respect to the recommendations

00:41:33.659 --> 00:41:37.070
is you've recommended um you know, further evaluation

00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:40.349
and, and perhaps implementation by the ERCOT stakeholder

00:41:40.360 --> 00:41:43.309
groups. You know you, you've set out these recommendations

00:41:43.320 --> 00:41:47.148
how do we turn these recommendations into um actual

00:41:47.159 --> 00:41:50.070
actions? Right. I think it's important for ERCOT

00:41:50.079 --> 00:41:52.070
to look at these recommendations and see what they

00:41:52.079 --> 00:41:56.659
can do to um implement some of the recommendations. 

00:41:56.668 --> 00:42:00.309
And also for, I guess the Commission to take some of

00:42:00.320 --> 00:42:02.139
the recommendations, like the one you just mentioned

00:42:02.148 --> 00:42:05.280
on the Railroad Commission and prioritizing the black

00:42:05.289 --> 00:42:07.958
start units. And the critical involving the critical

00:42:07.969 --> 00:42:12.599
map as well, like there's some additional uh you know

00:42:12.610 --> 00:42:15.500
benefits that we can provide through that collaboration

00:42:15.510 --> 00:42:18.648
to, to basically put that on the table, right? So that

00:42:18.659 --> 00:42:20.929
you know these, these are, I think were great recommendations. 

00:42:20.938 --> 00:42:23.739
And we should try to look for ways to try to get

00:42:23.750 --> 00:42:27.349
some of them implemented. Um and you know, continued

00:42:27.360 --> 00:42:32.309
obviously um collaboration with the oil and gas industry. 

00:42:32.320 --> 00:42:34.719
And, and you know, through various forms is important

00:42:34.728 --> 00:42:37.010
but I think I thought the recommendations are great. 

00:42:37.019 --> 00:42:39.378
And, and I'm just trying to you know make sure that

00:42:39.389 --> 00:42:42.168
we just don't like shelf the report. And see if there's

00:42:42.179 --> 00:42:45.329
you know actual, actionable items we can move forward. 

00:42:45.590 --> 00:42:49.128
Yeah, I appreciate that Commissioner Cobos. And what

00:42:49.139 --> 00:42:51.860
I see first is when, when the black start plans are

00:42:51.869 --> 00:42:55.139
developed. The transmission companies that we talked

00:42:55.148 --> 00:42:57.648
to and we'll talk to the others are already starting

00:42:57.659 --> 00:42:59.989
to use this map and look at it. It's just something

00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:03.090
they didn't do before. If they can start piecing together

00:43:03.159 --> 00:43:06.668
where the supplies for the black start units and next

00:43:06.679 --> 00:43:09.159
start units are at. I think that's gonna be a big step

00:43:09.168 --> 00:43:13.898
in may sort of happen organically. We may need you

00:43:13.909 --> 00:43:16.809
all to encourage some things. And certainly, you know

00:43:16.820 --> 00:43:18.070
with the Railroad Commission

00:43:19.800 --> 00:43:22.559
to have them bring the gas companies and encourage

00:43:22.570 --> 00:43:25.219
them to participate in this. But also recognize concerns

00:43:25.228 --> 00:43:28.059
that, that we may have overlooked too. I think that's

00:43:28.070 --> 00:43:30.918
going to be important. So that, that dialogue and again

00:43:30.929 --> 00:43:33.659
I come back to that mapping is central. Because you

00:43:33.668 --> 00:43:37.000
all have worked together to make that a reality. So

00:43:37.010 --> 00:43:39.458
that's the areas that I hope we'll see happen with

00:43:39.469 --> 00:43:43.800
some organic action just as people go through these

00:43:43.809 --> 00:43:47.119
items in the report and look at what they can obtain. 

00:43:47.530 --> 00:43:51.280
And then beyond that, uh um we'll have to see if

00:43:51.289 --> 00:43:55.909
if we run into any roadblocks. I think drastic improvements

00:43:55.918 --> 00:43:58.550
have been made since Uri. Absolutely. The fact of the matter is,

00:43:58.559 --> 00:44:01.688
as you noted, a large majority of our black start units

00:44:01.699 --> 00:44:04.389
had issues. And I remember when I came to the Commission

00:44:04.398 --> 00:44:07.159
that was an issue that really honestly was concerning

00:44:07.168 --> 00:44:08.898
to me. I mean, it should be concerning to everyone.

00:44:08.909 --> 00:44:11.110
and I know that ERCOT's has made a lot of improvements. 

00:44:11.119 --> 00:44:15.369
But we should continue to um enhance those improvements

00:44:15.378 --> 00:44:18.219
and, and uh foster further growth in this area and

00:44:18.228 --> 00:44:19.719
success. So, thank you.

00:44:21.300 --> 00:44:23.739
(item:25:Commissioner Jackson's thoughts on the Texas RE's reports) I think part of what I heard was that, you know, as

00:44:23.750 --> 00:44:27.019
the system is changing, we need to continue to evaluate

00:44:27.030 --> 00:44:30.280
right? Yes, ma'am. And so um we've got a set of recommendations

00:44:30.289 --> 00:44:34.099
now, but this collaboration that we've built uh will

00:44:34.110 --> 00:44:37.719
facilitate that. And so in the vein of continuous improvement. 

00:44:37.728 --> 00:44:40.559
You're always looking at well how is the system changing?

00:44:40.750 --> 00:44:44.679
And then how can I mitigate? And for those things that

00:44:44.688 --> 00:44:47.789
potentially I can't mitigate, what can I put in place

00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:50.800
to be able to recover quickly? And so I think that

00:44:50.809 --> 00:44:53.628
point of recognizing that. You know, if there's any

00:44:53.639 --> 00:44:57.559
system in the country that's changing, you know, quickly

00:44:57.570 --> 00:45:01.219
it's, it's Texas. And so, you know, having that recognition

00:45:01.228 --> 00:45:05.039
of ongoing continuous improvement. And the, but the

00:45:05.050 --> 00:45:08.309
foundation as you kind of pointed out has been built

00:45:08.320 --> 00:45:11.039
through the mapping and through the collaborative activities. 

00:45:12.769 --> 00:45:16.429
I uh appreciate the, the work on this. (item:25:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on the Texas RE's reports) We can always

00:45:16.438 --> 00:45:20.030
get better. I think unfortunately, we never find out

00:45:20.039 --> 00:45:24.059
uh until we've had a bad circumstance. The one part

00:45:24.070 --> 00:45:27.179
of this that I'm very encouraged about is the consideration

00:45:27.188 --> 00:45:29.639
of alternate resources in black start restoration.

00:45:29.860 --> 00:45:32.949
Specifically batteries and adjacent interconnections. 

00:45:33.228 --> 00:45:35.829
The adjacent interconnections is obviously a political

00:45:35.840 --> 00:45:39.699
issue unless they're dc ties. I had spoken with Pablo

00:45:39.708 --> 00:45:44.340
and Woody and Kristi not two weeks ago. About um I

00:45:44.349 --> 00:45:48.219
had heard that Sandia, Sandia National Lab had participated

00:45:48.228 --> 00:45:50.179
with someone and I can't remember who it was. That's

00:45:50.188 --> 00:45:55.800
part of my problem here. In the development and testing

00:45:55.809 --> 00:45:59.449
of a potential black start plan using only batteries. 

00:46:00.239 --> 00:46:05.769
And as our system grows from 5000 megawatts of batteries

00:46:05.780 --> 00:46:08.320
to 10,000 megawatts of batteries. I think it would

00:46:08.329 --> 00:46:13.429
be great for y'all, ERCOT, our Staff at least to have an

00:46:13.438 --> 00:46:16.239
understanding if that becomes a possibility. Or when

00:46:16.250 --> 00:46:19.579
that would become something hugely valuable for the

00:46:19.590 --> 00:46:22.289
people of ERCOT. When we think about Winter Storm Uri

00:46:22.668 --> 00:46:26.168
there were headlines that said that we were, you know

00:46:26.188 --> 00:46:30.409
minutes away from a long term outage. If these are

00:46:30.418 --> 00:46:33.128
viable resources for a black start plan, we sure ought

00:46:33.139 --> 00:46:36.039
to know about them sooner rather than later. So I hope

00:46:36.050 --> 00:46:39.840
we can facilitate that discussion or, or have that. 

00:46:39.869 --> 00:46:43.179
Or push you all to, to lead that effort and, and work

00:46:43.188 --> 00:46:45.958
with ERCOT and our, our Commission Staff on, on looking

00:46:45.969 --> 00:46:48.449
at that in the future. No, we will definitely do that. 

00:46:48.458 --> 00:46:51.039
I mean, I mean the point of this and the point of

00:46:51.050 --> 00:46:53.030
us talking to you about is have the conversation and

00:46:53.039 --> 00:46:55.188
continue the dialogue. And make sure, I mean, you're

00:46:55.199 --> 00:46:58.030
the first step. I mean, we did have, we actually did

00:46:58.039 --> 00:47:01.289
outreach on this yesterday uh to industry participants. 

00:47:01.648 --> 00:47:04.260
As Mark said, we're gonna get into the ERCOT working

00:47:04.269 --> 00:47:06.019
groups and start talking about the results from this

00:47:06.030 --> 00:47:09.579
and, and continue that conversation. And I mean, looking

00:47:09.590 --> 00:47:12.769
at other resources is gonna be critical. So I think

00:47:12.780 --> 00:47:15.349
that's gonna be and this is really just about building

00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:18.280
a more resilient grid. I mean we've, we've moved. 

00:47:18.289 --> 00:47:20.320
We've done a lot of good things over the last few years, 

00:47:20.329 --> 00:47:22.780
but there's still things that we can do to be better. 

00:47:23.320 --> 00:47:25.000
So, and that's our goal.

00:47:27.059 --> 00:47:29.978
Appreciate y'all being here. Thank you. Likewise. Thank you 

00:47:29.989 --> 00:47:30.590
for hearing us.

00:47:33.789 --> 00:47:38.389
(item:26:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55421) So next up Item 26, Project 55421. There's an update

00:47:38.398 --> 00:47:40.708
uh from Commissioner Glotfelty on the Texas Advanced

00:47:40.719 --> 00:47:46.260
Nuclear Reactor Working Group. Thank you. (item:31:Commissioner Glotfelty lays out updates for Nuclear Rector Working Group) I am just

00:47:46.269 --> 00:47:50.389
excited to say that we continue to have robust discussion

00:47:50.599 --> 00:47:53.860
and meetings on this. Our sub working groups, which

00:47:53.869 --> 00:47:56.898
we have four of them are meeting. Putting together

00:47:56.909 --> 00:48:00.869
lots of discussion items and recommendations. Two

00:48:00.878 --> 00:48:03.898
main things that I wanted to point out. One of them

00:48:03.909 --> 00:48:08.378
is that we have hired the University of Texas Bureau

00:48:08.389 --> 00:48:12.398
of Business Research. And we are, they are going

00:48:12.409 --> 00:48:15.188
to lead an effort to study the economic impact of a

00:48:15.478 --> 00:48:18.949
small modular reactor industry development throughout

00:48:18.958 --> 00:48:21.809
the State of Texas. So that will look at really the

00:48:21.820 --> 00:48:24.059
development of the workforce in the supply chain going

00:48:24.070 --> 00:48:27.800
forward. They'll use a nationally recognized model

00:48:27.809 --> 00:48:32.360
the Remy model um to, to do that. Uh they'll be reaching

00:48:32.369 --> 00:48:35.260
out to lots of folks in this industry and adjacent

00:48:35.269 --> 00:48:38.469
industries. And uh I think that's pretty exciting

00:48:38.478 --> 00:48:40.989
to get that kicked off. Thank you for your effort as

00:48:41.000 --> 00:48:44.469
Executive Director to help uh finalize this. It will

00:48:44.478 --> 00:48:47.829
be a, a good cornerstone for the project going forward. 

00:48:48.750 --> 00:48:54.309
Second um we've, we've there's an organization on

00:48:54.320 --> 00:48:58.110
the East Coast called Clear Path. Clear Path put

00:48:58.119 --> 00:49:02.840
together a financial model for new small modular reactors. 

00:49:03.340 --> 00:49:08.648
And, and they've tied it to some unique policy drivers

00:49:08.659 --> 00:49:12.050
that we can change and we can. So, so the goal of

00:49:12.059 --> 00:49:16.969
this is to utilize this model as a data input. To figure

00:49:16.978 --> 00:49:19.909
out if there, if the State wants to put money into

00:49:19.918 --> 00:49:23.228
a reactor. Or the State wants to put land into a reactor

00:49:23.250 --> 00:49:26.938
site, and we can value that. We can put it into the

00:49:26.949 --> 00:49:29.760
model and see if that really helps the development

00:49:29.769 --> 00:49:32.668
of reactors in the State. It's, we're going to be sending

00:49:32.679 --> 00:49:36.949
it out, we'll be filing it in our, our docket uh 55421. 

00:49:36.958 --> 00:49:39.668
But uh really excited about that. They've uh they've

00:49:39.679 --> 00:49:42.628
done a great job on that. And yesterday, I think we

00:49:42.639 --> 00:49:47.918
had uh 85, 85 people on the call. Shows that we've

00:49:47.929 --> 00:49:51.610
got a lot of interest in this, in this area for the

00:49:51.619 --> 00:49:54.679
future of Texas. So, uh if you all need any more information

00:49:54.688 --> 00:49:59.199
obviously reach out to me or, or V.A. But we're excited

00:49:59.208 --> 00:50:01.610
uh that we're making progress here. A lot of good work

00:50:01.619 --> 00:50:05.599
going on very, very quickly, very quickly. But I will

00:50:05.610 --> 00:50:09.418
say, I thought we had agreed to use Texas A&M. 

00:50:09.820 --> 00:50:13.458
And so I, I feel like I was maybe misled a little

00:50:13.469 --> 00:50:17.519
bit. You weren't. That's fair, that's fair. Now obviously, Texas

00:50:17.530 --> 00:50:22.590
A&M is involved. Where they, they own one cornerstone

00:50:22.599 --> 00:50:26.059
of the nuclear educational piece. Unfortunately, the

00:50:26.070 --> 00:50:28.360
University of Texas owns the other. Unfortunately,

00:50:28.369 --> 00:50:31.708
for you. But, you know, for me as a horned frog. We'd

00:50:31.719 --> 00:50:35.289
love to just get a little scrap. Um anyway, they're

00:50:35.300 --> 00:50:37.750
they're both very involved and uh are both critical

00:50:37.760 --> 00:50:40.579
for the future. Well, it makes Connie happy and that's

00:50:40.590 --> 00:50:42.369
of critical importance to us so. 

00:50:44.478 --> 00:50:50.079
(item:27:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55837) So next up, uh Item No. 27, Project 55837. Review

00:50:50.090 --> 00:50:53.360
of uh value of lost load in in the ERCOT market. Staff

00:50:53.369 --> 00:50:56.918
filed a memo with a recommendation. ERCOT is also here. 

00:50:56.929 --> 00:51:00.110
So Staff if y'all wanna come up and lay out your

00:51:00.119 --> 00:51:01.438
recommendation and memo.

00:51:08.989 --> 00:51:09.199
Okay.

00:51:21.918 --> 00:51:26.688
(item:27:Commission Staff's Brendan Ok on recommendation and memo) Brendan Ok for Commission Staff. Yeah. So Staff

00:51:26.699 --> 00:51:29.489
filed a memo that provides a recommendation for the

00:51:29.500 --> 00:51:33.128
interim voll value to be used in the reliability standard

00:51:33.139 --> 00:51:37.019
study. To calculate uh societal costs associated with

00:51:37.030 --> 00:51:41.708
reducing uh expected unserved energy or EUE. The

00:51:41.719 --> 00:51:44.059
memo provides an overview of the options presented

00:51:44.070 --> 00:51:47.119
by Brattle to estimate the cost of supply interruptions

00:51:47.128 --> 00:51:50.159
and discusses other estimates to provide additional

00:51:50.168 --> 00:51:50.780
context.

00:51:52.289 --> 00:51:55.668
Staff agrees with ERCOT that Brattles Options 2A 

00:51:55.679 --> 00:51:58.849
and 2B are the most reasonable. We propose setting

00:51:58.860 --> 00:52:03.829
the interim voll at $25,000 per Megawatt hour. While

00:52:03.840 --> 00:52:07.059
none of the options uh presented are perfect. That's

00:52:07.070 --> 00:52:10.489
primarily due to limited data availability, availability. 

00:52:10.809 --> 00:52:13.648
And the planned public survey of the Texas electricity 

00:52:13.659 --> 00:52:16.438
consumers will provide more accurate and recent data. 

00:52:17.389 --> 00:52:20.199
So option one provides estimates that range anywhere

00:52:20.208 --> 00:52:24.929
from $5,400 to over $100,000 per Megawatt hour. And these

00:52:24.938 --> 00:52:29.519
results yield um weighted system wide averages of um

00:52:29.530 --> 00:52:32.918
a system wide average estimate of around $67,000 per

00:52:32.929 --> 00:52:36.110
Megawatt hour. We appreciate the econometric approach

00:52:36.119 --> 00:52:40.909
employed here but note that it relies on um an existing

00:52:40.918 --> 00:52:44.530
um an existing model estimated with non ERCOT specific

00:52:44.539 --> 00:52:48.550
uh data. And because the uh estimates obtained by

00:52:48.559 --> 00:52:51.329
option one are considerably higher than what has been

00:52:51.340 --> 00:52:53.978
found in existing literature. We recommend going with

00:52:53.989 --> 00:52:58.849
Option 2 which uh, um which puts the value at around

00:52:59.228 --> 00:53:03.750
$25,000 per Megawatt hour. The Econometric approach

00:53:03.760 --> 00:53:06.409
uh employed in Option 1 will likely be more insightful. 

00:53:06.418 --> 00:53:09.188
Once we have more up to date data collected from the

00:53:09.199 --> 00:53:14.010
survey responses. Next, any study that uses the interim

00:53:14.019 --> 00:53:18.750
voll value should also be used should also conduct

00:53:18.760 --> 00:53:21.889
sensitivity analysis. So for example, the reliability

00:53:21.898 --> 00:53:24.590
standards study, the next step is to narrow down the

00:53:24.599 --> 00:53:28.070
options based on changes in costs associated with reducing

00:53:28.148 --> 00:53:32.199
EUE uh which is highly dependent on the voll. So ERCOT

00:53:32.309 --> 00:53:35.458
should conduct this analysis using a range of voll 

00:53:35.590 --> 00:53:41.628
uh numbers between $20,000 and $70,000 per Megawatt hour. And during

00:53:41.639 --> 00:53:44.050
the last open meeting, Commissioner Glotfelty specifically

00:53:44.059 --> 00:53:47.489
asked about the effects of capping the estimates as

00:53:47.500 --> 00:53:51.050
done in Option 2. We agreed that this is not an ideal

00:53:51.059 --> 00:53:54.449
approach, but we would also note that potomac economics

00:53:54.458 --> 00:53:57.000
also took a similar approach when estimating voll for

00:53:57.309 --> 00:54:00.648
MISO. Um and also the estimates obtained in Options

00:54:00.659 --> 00:54:03.809
2A and 2B are in line with the ERCOT IMMs

00:54:03.820 --> 00:54:08.570
uh opinion on the true voll um from the 2022 state

00:54:08.579 --> 00:54:12.188
of the market report for ERCOT. This approach gives

00:54:12.199 --> 00:54:14.599
us the most reasonable result for this temporary interim

00:54:14.610 --> 00:54:18.418
voll measure until the final report is delivered. And

00:54:18.429 --> 00:54:20.849
finally, we want to reiterate that the use of this

00:54:20.860 --> 00:54:24.809
interim voll value is only for study purposes, uh in

00:54:24.820 --> 00:54:27.769
particular, the reliability standards study. And will

00:54:27.780 --> 00:54:31.179
not have any impact on consumer cost of electricity. 

00:54:32.938 --> 00:54:36.070
Thank you. (item:27:Chairman Gleeson's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) And I think that last point is critically

00:54:36.079 --> 00:54:39.539
important. I've, I've gotten some questions about whether

00:54:39.550 --> 00:54:42.789
or not raising this to $25,000 or some number greater

00:54:42.800 --> 00:54:45.958
than $5,000 will have any effect on the market. And so

00:54:45.969 --> 00:54:49.418
thank you for clarifying that. I'm comfortable with

00:54:49.429 --> 00:54:52.119
Staff's recommendations. Would love to hear y'alls opinions?

00:54:53.250 --> 00:54:57.478
(item:27:Commissioner Jackson's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) I'm comfortable with it. Um uh particularly the uh

00:54:57.510 --> 00:54:59.889
I guess the second part of your recommendation. Which

00:54:59.898 --> 00:55:02.878
was not only do we want to set the interim value for

00:55:02.889 --> 00:55:07.099
study purposes but also the need to run uh the sensitivities. 

00:55:07.429 --> 00:55:10.340
And, um, it's my understanding that it would be, you

00:55:10.349 --> 00:55:14.619
know range, uh range between the, the um, the $20,000

00:55:14.724 --> 00:55:17.974
in the, in the $70,000. So, I guess theoretically right

00:55:17.985 --> 00:55:20.625
now we have five. Right, that's what we're running.

00:55:20.793 --> 00:55:24.043
And then we, we would set it theoretically at an interim

00:55:24.054 --> 00:55:28.614
value of 25 and then potentially do a sensitivity at

00:55:28.625 --> 00:55:31.543
45 and the sensitivity at 65. Is that kind of what you're

00:55:31.554 --> 00:55:31.985
thinking? 

00:55:34.099 --> 00:55:37.090
(item:27:Commission Staff's Chris Brown on memo) Chris Brown with Staff. Yes, ma'am. We would just like to

00:55:37.099 --> 00:55:40.199
see a handful of values in this range. To better understand

00:55:40.208 --> 00:55:42.570
the full picture of how voll is going to affect the

00:55:42.579 --> 00:55:45.329
estimates we're getting out of the study. So 25, 45 and

00:55:45.340 --> 00:55:49.050
65 I think is a good starting point for that. So I

00:55:49.059 --> 00:55:51.800
think that's important because as we kind of move through

00:55:51.809 --> 00:55:54.789
that'll give us the data points that we need to help

00:55:54.800 --> 00:55:55.849
us in our evaluation.

00:55:57.429 --> 00:55:59.639
(item:27:Commissioner Cobos' thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) Yeah, I'm I'm in agreement as well with the use of

00:55:59.648 --> 00:56:03.320
a $25,000 interim voll. I think Staff did a good job of

00:56:03.329 --> 00:56:07.978
anchoring that, that figure to ERCOT Brattle literature

00:56:07.989 --> 00:56:10.579
review and the state of market reports. And the ERCOT

00:56:10.590 --> 00:56:13.648
market and MISO market. So I think overall that's a

00:56:13.659 --> 00:56:16.510
good starting point. Um I think the range is a good

00:56:16.519 --> 00:56:21.289
idea just to kind of get different um cost outcomes, 

00:56:21.300 --> 00:56:23.929
estimated cost outcomes. That help us start and kind

00:56:23.938 --> 00:56:27.128
of looking at the reliability standard um in a different

00:56:27.139 --> 00:56:29.958
lens. From, you know, with those two ranges or the the

00:56:29.969 --> 00:56:33.039
three ranges you recommended. I think my understanding

00:56:33.050 --> 00:56:36.360
was those those ranges that you laid out. Would be used

00:56:36.369 --> 00:56:40.438
to evaluate the expected unserved energy and the reliability

00:56:40.449 --> 00:56:44.938
standard. And so I think, you know, whatever analysis

00:56:44.949 --> 00:56:48.878
we can start doing now to start for informing our ultimate

00:56:48.889 --> 00:56:53.628
um reliability standard decisions later this year. Would

00:56:53.639 --> 00:56:54.199
be helpful.

00:56:56.260 --> 00:56:57.969
(item:27:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on Commission Staff's memo) Yeah, I'm in agreement on both. I think y'all have

00:56:57.978 --> 00:56:59.918
done a great job on this. So thanks for your work.

00:57:00.800 --> 00:57:03.188
And I would, I would just note the analysis you see

00:57:03.199 --> 00:57:06.708
here. Is actually a result of an appropriation request

00:57:06.719 --> 00:57:08.929
that we had in the last Legislative Session to put

00:57:08.938 --> 00:57:12.969
together an analytics team. And that effort was spearheaded

00:57:12.978 --> 00:57:16.458
by Commissioner Glotfelty to get that in the LAR and

00:57:16.469 --> 00:57:19.878
uh great work, guys really appreciate the input. Well 

00:57:19.929 --> 00:57:20.840
done, thank you.

00:57:25.059 --> 00:57:29.708
Okay. (item:28:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55845) Next up Item 28, Project 55845. Review of ancillary

00:57:29.898 --> 00:57:33.280
services in the ERCOT market. Staff filed a memo and

00:57:33.289 --> 00:57:37.208
a scoping document. ERCOT and the IMM are here as well, 

00:57:37.239 --> 00:57:39.239
if we need to call them up as a resource. 

00:57:41.360 --> 00:57:41.789
Hi, again Harika. Hi again. 

00:57:44.110 --> 00:57:47.340
Harika Basaran with Staff and I have Chris Brown with me. So we filed the

00:57:47.349 --> 00:57:50.739
memo that had the timelines as well as the scope agreed

00:57:50.750 --> 00:57:54.989
upon by us, IMM and ERCOT Staff. And Chris is gonna lay

00:57:55.000 --> 00:57:55.898
out the memo for you. 

00:57:58.148 --> 00:58:00.789
(item:28:Chris Brown lays out Commission Staff's memo) So, PURA requires the Commission to conduct a review

00:58:00.800 --> 00:58:03.610
of ancillary services in the ERCOT market. To determine

00:58:03.619 --> 00:58:05.809
whether those services will continue to meet the needs

00:58:05.820 --> 00:58:09.539
of the region. The study will be undertaken as a collaboration

00:58:09.550 --> 00:58:13.989
between ERCOT, IMM and Commission Staff. As Harika mentioned, 

00:58:14.000 --> 00:58:17.099
we filed a memo with the post timeline and scoping document. 

00:58:17.820 --> 00:58:20.269
The study will review the purpose, determination of

00:58:20.280 --> 00:58:23.489
quantity and cost of each service. And it will also

00:58:23.500 --> 00:58:26.539
include discussion and recommendations by ERCOT, IMM 

00:58:26.550 --> 00:58:30.369
and Staff regarding proposed changes if any to existing

00:58:30.378 --> 00:58:34.539
ancillary services or recommendations for additional

00:58:35.059 --> 00:58:36.898
ancillary services needed for liability.

00:58:41.789 --> 00:58:44.628
So during the briefings, we received feedback from

00:58:44.639 --> 00:58:47.610
offices. Do you guys want to speak to that or do you

00:58:47.619 --> 00:58:50.418
want to let Commissioner Cobos, you had some suggestions

00:58:50.429 --> 00:58:52.590
about the timeline? Yeah, why don't we let Commissioners

00:58:52.599 --> 00:58:57.269
lay out. Yes. Thank you, Harika and Chris. I think you

00:58:57.280 --> 00:59:01.369
guys did a great job of um laying out the preliminary

00:59:01.378 --> 00:59:04.119
scope and a timeline. (item:28:Commissioner Cobos' thoughts on proposed timeline and study) This is an important study

00:59:04.128 --> 00:59:07.039
obviously, um Senate Bill 3 requires us to do this. 

00:59:07.050 --> 00:59:11.099
And, and so really my, my feedback is on the proposed

00:59:11.110 --> 00:59:14.760
uh timeline and schedule. And that's just adding more

00:59:14.769 --> 00:59:18.030
um stakeholder feedback on during the study development

00:59:18.039 --> 00:59:23.168
process at ERCOT. And what I envisioned there is um

00:59:23.179 --> 00:59:28.228
in June for um the sort of the preliminary study direction

00:59:28.239 --> 00:59:30.820
to be presented to the stakeholders at the June TAC

00:59:30.829 --> 00:59:33.969
meeting. So that the stakeholders start getting an idea

00:59:33.978 --> 00:59:38.090
of, you know what, what preliminary data inputs, assumptions, 

00:59:38.099 --> 00:59:40.489
direction the studies headed and provide feedback,

00:59:40.550 --> 00:59:44.050
feedback at that point. And then, as you stated in

00:59:44.059 --> 00:59:48.168
your outline, July 31st would be the draft study presented

00:59:48.179 --> 00:59:54.398
to TAC. And then I would say that if necessary um to

00:59:54.409 --> 00:59:58.840
have further deliberation after, after that. Before

00:59:58.849 --> 01:00:02.688
it goes to the board and the board meeting is in on

01:00:02.699 --> 01:00:06.000
August 20th and the TAC meeting is after that currently. 

01:00:06.010 --> 01:00:10.500
So if there's a need to have further uh feedback before

01:00:10.510 --> 01:00:12.938
the final draft studies presented to the ERCOT board

01:00:12.949 --> 01:00:16.898
of directors. Then I, I would recommend maybe a special

01:00:17.079 --> 01:00:20.300
TAC meeting or for TAC to be moved up earlier ahead

01:00:20.309 --> 01:00:22.570
of the ERCOT board meeting. Just so there's plenty

01:00:22.579 --> 01:00:25.889
of deliberation before that report goes to the Board. 

01:00:25.898 --> 01:00:29.179
The final draft study goes to the board and then ultimately

01:00:29.188 --> 01:00:32.019
is filed at the Commission. When we will have stakeholder

01:00:32.030 --> 01:00:34.378
feedback at the Commission and workshops. But I think

01:00:34.389 --> 01:00:36.829
it's really important to add more stakeholder feedback

01:00:36.840 --> 01:00:38.510
in the study development process at ERCOT.

01:00:40.148 --> 01:00:42.659
That makes sense to me. I may be helpful to have ERCOT

01:00:42.739 --> 01:00:44.530
come up since we're talking about

01:00:46.418 --> 01:00:47.559
their schedules.

01:00:52.079 --> 01:00:54.909
Dan is what Commissioner Cobos is, is requesting is

01:00:54.918 --> 01:00:58.168
that work for y'all? (item:28:Dan Woodfin on proposed timeline) Dan Woodfin with ERCOT. I think that's

01:00:58.179 --> 01:01:00.570
fine. I think it's a good idea to get stackholder feedback

01:01:00.579 --> 01:01:03.340
and those are seem to be the right places to do it

01:01:03.349 --> 01:01:04.369
so. Okay. 

01:01:08.989 --> 01:01:10.820
Anything else? Can I ask 

01:01:12.639 --> 01:01:15.309
Staff? Yeah. I, I've had good conversations with Harika and her

01:01:15.320 --> 01:01:18.260
staff. (item:28:Commissioner Glotfelty's thoughts on proposed timeline and study) I had three points that I wanted to make on

01:01:18.269 --> 01:01:21.300
this. One was there were three questions that I asked. 

01:01:21.309 --> 01:01:23.958
One of them if any ancillary service product is actually

01:01:23.969 --> 01:01:28.090
being used as a resource adequacy tool. For them to

01:01:28.099 --> 01:01:32.030
analyze, to complete an analysis of the conservative

01:01:32.039 --> 01:01:34.360
operations effect on the cost and procurement amount

01:01:34.369 --> 01:01:39.829
of ancillary services. And are we following any guidelines

01:01:39.840 --> 01:01:43.148
for the expected durations of utilizing each service

01:01:43.458 --> 01:01:47.110
whenever they're called upon? I, we've had really good

01:01:47.119 --> 01:01:51.179
discussions about this. Harika has assured me that

01:01:51.188 --> 01:01:57.000
these are implicitly going to be included in there. 

01:01:57.269 --> 01:02:01.610
I just wanted to, to explain my intent for these. My

01:02:01.619 --> 01:02:05.418
intent is that we're trying to make sure or I'm trying

01:02:05.429 --> 01:02:09.030
to make sure that ERCOT uses ancillary service tools

01:02:09.039 --> 01:02:11.909
as they're defined by NERC. That is the entity that

01:02:11.918 --> 01:02:15.628
defines ancillary services and the PUC. We have that

01:02:15.639 --> 01:02:21.909
ability as well. And that these rules and services do

01:02:21.918 --> 01:02:28.208
not impact price formation in ERCOT NA in the, in the

01:02:28.219 --> 01:02:30.938
real time market. We want ancillary services there

01:02:30.949 --> 01:02:34.128
for reliability, whatever that looks like at that time. 

01:02:34.139 --> 01:02:38.800
But we want to know that the price signals are not

01:02:38.809 --> 01:02:43.809
being dampened by over utilization of, of uh ancillary

01:02:44.418 --> 01:02:48.780
service. NERC's defined ancillary services and their

01:02:48.789 --> 01:02:51.000
uses. And we should ensure that each has a reason for

01:02:51.010 --> 01:02:53.978
being in existence. That all of our ancillary services

01:02:53.989 --> 01:02:57.409
are tied to a compliance effort and they have a beginning

01:02:57.418 --> 01:03:00.909
and an end time frame. This is blocking and tackling

01:03:00.918 --> 01:03:03.860
in my opinion. We need to make sure that the market

01:03:03.869 --> 01:03:08.000
knows how, how the market is going to operate. So I've

01:03:08.010 --> 01:03:11.938
been assured that we in our discussions and I am very

01:03:11.949 --> 01:03:14.010
comfortable with this process going forward.

01:03:15.800 --> 01:03:19.809
(item:28:Commissioner Jackson's thoughts on proposed timeline and study) I had one thought and uh it, it's really more maybe

01:03:19.820 --> 01:03:24.909
clarifying what the intent of, of the study is. And

01:03:25.179 --> 01:03:27.438
you know we, we spend some time in the scope, in the

01:03:27.449 --> 01:03:31.219
scope. Kind of outlining what the the definition is

01:03:31.228 --> 01:03:35.148
of the protocol. Kind of how do you qualify to participate

01:03:35.628 --> 01:03:38.728
and then how that service is going to mitigate the

01:03:38.739 --> 01:03:42.849
risk. But um and then we talk about, you know, how

01:03:42.860 --> 01:03:47.099
it was actually used during real time operations. But

01:03:47.110 --> 01:03:50.059
before we kind of get to the part where we talk about

01:03:50.070 --> 01:03:54.639
is, is change needed. I think it needs to be clear that

01:03:54.648 --> 01:03:58.898
um we are evaluating the effectiveness in meeting um

01:03:58.909 --> 01:04:01.820
the intended reliability requirements and obligations. 

01:04:01.829 --> 01:04:05.340
So I just I think feel, feel like we need to clarify

01:04:05.639 --> 01:04:09.519
the step. That we are evaluating the effectiveness of

01:04:09.530 --> 01:04:13.219
each of the ancillary services. And I think we've talked

01:04:13.228 --> 01:04:17.559
about this um and you feel like that that is appropriate. 

01:04:18.260 --> 01:04:21.780
I, I think, I think that's uh good that we evaluate

01:04:21.789 --> 01:04:26.128
it uh singly and together because it's kind of a program

01:04:26.139 --> 01:04:30.280
overall. And we use them all to provide a piece of

01:04:30.289 --> 01:04:34.780
the puzzle. It is a suite and you're exactly right

01:04:34.789 --> 01:04:37.679
Dan. They all are a piece of the puzzle, but the market

01:04:37.688 --> 01:04:40.269
needs to understand where one piece stops and one piece

01:04:40.280 --> 01:04:45.070
starts. This is critical for price formation in, in

01:04:45.079 --> 01:04:49.648
the market. And I look forward to, to seeing how this

01:04:49.668 --> 01:04:54.389
happen this un. And, and I would say that I think evaluating

01:04:54.398 --> 01:04:59.139
the effectiveness is important in terms of um clarifying

01:04:59.300 --> 01:05:02.478
the value that it brings to the system. Both individually

01:05:02.489 --> 01:05:05.438
and as a whole. So I would recommend that we add that

01:05:05.628 --> 01:05:09.800
that in the scope. I'm good with that. Thank you. 

01:05:09.809 --> 01:05:13.530
And I guess going forward, do we need to kind of maybe

01:05:13.539 --> 01:05:16.500
let ERCOT kind of take these back. And take a look at

01:05:16.510 --> 01:05:19.309
them and then come back to us with some sort of recommendation? 

01:05:19.699 --> 01:05:22.099
So I think this is scheduled to come back up at the

01:05:22.110 --> 01:05:25.929
next open meeting to finalize it. (item:28:Harika Basaran on proposed timeline and study) Yes, we will take

01:05:25.938 --> 01:05:28.418
all this. We will provide a red line version of the

01:05:28.429 --> 01:05:32.329
memo and the scope and the timelines and a clean version. 

01:05:32.590 --> 01:05:35.050
File it for the next open meeting. So you will see

01:05:35.059 --> 01:05:38.728
the final one for your approval. And continue to have ERCOT and  

01:05:38.739 --> 01:05:42.570
Staff and the IMM working together. Three amigos working

01:05:42.579 --> 01:05:46.550
together. Yeah. And all I would say I know comments

01:05:46.559 --> 01:05:49.469
were due yesterday in this. So uh the one thing I would

01:05:49.478 --> 01:05:52.030
just caution guard against scope creep coming out of

01:05:52.039 --> 01:05:56.239
any of that as well. Okay. Yes, Dan. (item:28:Dan Woodfin on ancillary services) I guess one of the things

01:05:56.250 --> 01:05:58.329
that I think would be helpful to note. Is that there

01:05:58.340 --> 01:06:00.769
are actually multiple efforts going on related to ancillary

01:06:00.878 --> 01:06:03.668
services. There's a, there's a near term thing which

01:06:03.679 --> 01:06:07.250
is the part of the TAC approval of the current year

01:06:07.590 --> 01:06:10.199
ancillary services. Which we will be working on between

01:06:10.208 --> 01:06:14.139
now and April that we would expect it to happen 

01:06:14.148 --> 01:06:16.489
you know before Summer, I think that's the idea. There's

01:06:16.500 --> 01:06:19.208
a second thing which is the, what we're going to do

01:06:19.219 --> 01:06:22.809
for 2025 ancillary service requirements. And so there'll

01:06:22.820 --> 01:06:26.458
be work going on that will both be informed by this

01:06:26.469 --> 01:06:29.918
study, but also will inform this study. Uh that would

01:06:29.929 --> 01:06:33.340
need to be done by the end of the year, basically. 

01:06:33.349 --> 01:06:37.050
Which, and part of doing that is the NPRR that

01:06:37.059 --> 01:06:41.869
we would uh ultimately file. To say that that the Commission

01:06:41.878 --> 01:06:44.300
will approve that ancillary service methodology. And

01:06:44.309 --> 01:06:46.599
so, so we're working on that too. So that's a second

01:06:46.610 --> 01:06:49.909
change. And then this study that and that, that second

01:06:49.918 --> 01:06:53.728
change would affect 2025 ancillary services. And then

01:06:53.739 --> 01:06:57.179
this study is kind of a longer term thing. It will

01:06:57.188 --> 01:07:00.110
affect kind of Legislative recommendations and those

01:07:00.119 --> 01:07:02.648
kind of things. I, I just I I've, I've heard a lot

01:07:02.659 --> 01:07:04.659
of discussion in the stakeholder community about okay 

01:07:04.668 --> 01:07:06.809
how do all these pieces fit together? And I thought

01:07:06.820 --> 01:07:10.478
it might be good to clarify that. So, so Dan with

01:07:10.489 --> 01:07:14.519
respect to the near term review for the 2024 AS methodology

01:07:14.530 --> 01:07:18.889
for this Summer. And is that an effort that ERCOT and

01:07:18.898 --> 01:07:21.300
the IMM and Staff are working on together? And when

01:07:21.309 --> 01:07:24.139
will we get a sort of an update of where things stand? 

01:07:24.188 --> 01:07:26.869
We're at this point, we're working on it internally. 

01:07:26.878 --> 01:07:30.228
We'll be working with the other two parties, as you

01:07:30.239 --> 01:07:33.260
mentioned. Once we kind of get our figure out what

01:07:33.269 --> 01:07:35.260
we're going to do or what we're going to recommend. 

01:07:35.628 --> 01:07:38.398
Is the plan to take the final recommendation to the

01:07:38.429 --> 01:07:39.750
ERCOT board meeting in April? 

01:07:41.878 --> 01:07:44.389
I haven't actually done the, the math on whom we would

01:07:44.398 --> 01:07:47.610
have to do that. Okay, yeah. It, it would just be

01:07:47.619 --> 01:07:50.059
helpful to kind of get an idea of where things stand

01:07:50.070 --> 01:07:53.010
before you know, that's ultimately approved by

01:07:53.019 --> 01:07:55.969
the Board for all of us. I think just to get a

01:07:56.309 --> 01:08:00.199
get a picture of where, where things end up. And ultimately

01:08:00.208 --> 01:08:03.760
I think what you're saying is the 2025 AS methodology

01:08:03.978 --> 01:08:11.300
and beyond. Will be sort of, I guess contingent on

01:08:11.309 --> 01:08:15.760
the AS study and the, the findings? That actually it

01:08:15.769 --> 01:08:19.060
will be informed by it, but actually the AS study

01:08:19.069 --> 01:08:22.970
is like a September thing. I think we about that same

01:08:22.979 --> 01:08:25.609
time is when we have to have the recommendation for

01:08:25.619 --> 01:08:30.500
the 2025 one. Okay. So 2026 and beyond will be more informed

01:08:30.509 --> 01:08:33.770
by the AS study finding. I think it's right. Okay. 

01:08:35.628 --> 01:08:38.208
Harika, do you have everything you need? Yes, I do. Perfect. Thanks

01:08:38.220 --> 01:08:39.140
y'all, appreciate it.

01:08:40.788 --> 01:08:47.797
I don't have anything from 29 until 35. (item:33:Commissioner Glotfelty on how stakeholders interact with ERCOT's Board) So, can I bring

01:08:47.809 --> 01:08:48.988
up something on 33? This is

01:08:50.877 --> 01:08:54.099
just very simple. Item No. 33. So I had, uh this was a discussion

01:08:54.108 --> 01:08:56.788
that I had with Interim Chairman Jackson before the

01:08:56.797 --> 01:09:01.007
holiday. I know ERCOT is working on this. I just wanted

01:09:01.019 --> 01:09:05.208
to make a statement about this. Since the Legislature

01:09:05.220 --> 01:09:07.979
changed the way TAC works and the Board works at

01:09:07.989 --> 01:09:10.890
ERCOT. The question becomes, how do stakeholders

01:09:10.899 --> 01:09:14.399
interact with the Board? Are there designated times? 

01:09:14.409 --> 01:09:18.140
Are there designated places? Are there designated opportunities

01:09:18.149 --> 01:09:20.970
for stakeholders, market participants to have face

01:09:20.979 --> 01:09:23.779
time with the Board to discuss their issues? I know

01:09:23.789 --> 01:09:27.069
that ERCOT is working on a proposal and look forward

01:09:27.079 --> 01:09:29.949
to getting that. But I think it's critically important

01:09:29.958 --> 01:09:34.640
in that our market have such a mechanism. So I don't

01:09:34.649 --> 01:09:35.829
know when you all are going to do it. I hope you

01:09:35.838 --> 01:09:38.029
all can give us a report sometime. Rebecca, if you

01:09:38.039 --> 01:09:38.810
want to come up and. 

01:09:42.199 --> 01:09:45.939
(item:33:Rebecca Zerwas on ERCOT's Board engagement plan) Rebecca Zerwas with ERCOT. We are working on a Board engagement

01:09:45.949 --> 01:09:48.600
plan for engagement between the Board and stakeholders. 

01:09:48.609 --> 01:09:51.810
There was a presentation given at TAC in January and

01:09:51.819 --> 01:09:54.319
there will be a follow up in February. The first piece

01:09:54.329 --> 01:09:57.449
of this is kicking off before the February Board. We're

01:09:57.458 --> 01:09:59.789
going to bring stakeholders in for one on ones with

01:09:59.798 --> 01:10:02.378
board members um in advance of the Board meeting. And

01:10:02.390 --> 01:10:05.329
that again is just the first step of bringing this

01:10:05.338 --> 01:10:08.088
initiative for this year. Great, thank you. Yeah. 

01:10:08.100 --> 01:10:10.708
And I know Connie, this is one of uh one of your

01:10:10.720 --> 01:10:12.699
initiatives that you're really looking at this year, 

01:10:12.708 --> 01:10:16.659
so. (item:33:PUC Executive Director Connie Corona on ERCOT's Board engagement plan) Yes. So uh we intend to look comprehensively at

01:10:16.668 --> 01:10:20.838
the ERCOT stakeholder process. As we open up the ERCOT

01:10:20.850 --> 01:10:21.539
governance. 

01:10:24.088 --> 01:10:24.750
Thanks Rebecca.

01:10:26.560 --> 01:10:30.500
Okay. (item:36:Chairman Gleeson lays out standing item for Agency Administrative Issues) So next up Item 36, we have an update from our

01:10:30.509 --> 01:10:35.289
Interim Executive Director. (item:36:Connie Corona gives appreciation for appointment and introduces Chief of Staff) First of all, uh thank

01:10:35.298 --> 01:10:37.890
you Commissioners for your literal vote of confidence

01:10:37.899 --> 01:10:41.048
and appointing me as Interim Executive Director. 

01:10:41.060 --> 01:10:43.850
I look forward to continuing our strong working relationship

01:10:43.859 --> 01:10:45.958
that we've developed over the past couple of years. 

01:10:46.220 --> 01:10:50.168
I'd also like to introduce my Chief of Staff, Louisa

01:10:50.180 --> 01:10:55.259
Benagoni. She's been with us um 2 weeks now and she keeps

01:10:55.270 --> 01:10:58.878
coming back, which is a good sign. She comes to

01:10:58.890 --> 01:11:02.039
us with a wealth of public policy experience both in

01:11:02.048 --> 01:11:04.779
the Texas Capitol and in public sector consulting.

01:11:05.159 --> 01:11:09.458
Um really she, she's already made herself indispensable

01:11:09.470 --> 01:11:12.569
um in the hallway I feel. And I know that the

01:11:12.579 --> 01:11:15.640
Commissioner Staff and uh stakeholders in the PUC 

01:11:15.649 --> 01:11:18.039
community will enjoy working with her. So welcome,

01:11:18.048 --> 01:11:18.619
Louisa.

01:11:25.489 --> 01:11:29.890
Thank you, Connie. So that's. (item:36:Commissioner Glotfelty on rulemaking calendar) Can I, can I go back and ask? Absolutely, we skipped. I'm 

01:11:31.890 --> 01:11:35.369
sorry. I just wanted to make the statement that I've

01:11:35.378 --> 01:11:38.029
talked to David Smeltzer about this, about the rulemaking

01:11:38.039 --> 01:11:43.088
calendar. It's important to me that we try to complete

01:11:43.100 --> 01:11:46.548
the ADER interconnection rule process. This is not a

01:11:48.949 --> 01:11:52.020
uh, this is part of the rulemaking calendar. Uh, if

01:11:52.029 --> 01:11:53.609
we can get that up as soon as possible, that would

01:11:53.619 --> 01:11:57.600
be great. Just to clarify. We did that up under Item

01:11:57.609 --> 01:11:58.430
35.

01:12:01.458 --> 01:12:04.810
All right. All right. If no one has anything else,

01:12:04.819 --> 01:12:06.600
that's all I have in front of me for this meeting.

01:12:06.609 --> 01:12:09.359
(item:39:Chairman Gleeson adjourns meeting) So this meeting of Public Utility Commission is adjourned.