WEBVTT 00:00:08.198 --> 00:00:10.798 (item:0:Chairman Gleeson calls meeting to order) This meeting of the Public Utility Commission of Texas 00:00:10.808 --> 00:00:13.569 will come to order. To discuss matters that have been 00:00:13.579 --> 00:00:16.649 previously posted with the Secretary of State for today 00:00:16.658 --> 00:00:20.367 April 11, 2024. Shelah, will you walk us through the 00:00:20.378 --> 00:00:23.777 Consent Agenda? Yes. Good morning Commissioners. First, 00:00:23.788 --> 00:00:27.158 an update on recusals. The Chairman filed a memo stating 00:00:27.169 --> 00:00:30.748 that he is recused from the following items: 10, 14, 00:00:30.759 --> 00:00:35.478 17 and 18. (item:0.1:Shelah Cisneros with Commission Counsel lays out Consent Agenda) For the Consent Agenda by individual ballot, 00:00:35.490 --> 00:00:38.279 the following items are placed on your Consent Agenda: 00:00:38.840 --> 00:00:45.709 Items 4-10, 14, 17, 18, 20 and 21. Thank you, Shelah. (item:0.1:Chairman Gleeson asks for motion to approve items on Consent Agenda) I would 00:00:45.719 --> 00:00:49.310 entertain a motion to adopt the Consent Agenda as laid 00:00:49.319 --> 00:00:52.889 out by Shelah. So moved. Second. I have a motion and second. All those 00:00:52.899 --> 00:00:56.993 in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. Commissioner 00:00:57.444 --> 00:00:59.274 Glotfelty, I'll turn it over to you. I heard you might 00:00:59.283 --> 00:01:01.255 have some, some remarks you wanted to make at the outset 00:01:01.264 --> 00:01:06.004 of the meeting. (item:0.1:Commissioner Glotfelty's remarks on meeting concerning wildfires and April 18th) Two things. First of all, in regards 00:01:06.013 --> 00:01:09.439 to the meeting in Tampa. I just wanted to say, uh on 00:01:09.448 --> 00:01:12.709 wildfires. I wanted to say thank you to Mike and Louisa 00:01:12.719 --> 00:01:17.260 on our Staff. You all probably heard this up there. 00:01:17.269 --> 00:01:20.579 But I heard it in Houston from a member of the Legislature 00:01:20.588 --> 00:01:22.888 that y'all did a really, really good job. And you represented 00:01:22.900 --> 00:01:25.730 the public and you represented this agency really well. 00:01:25.739 --> 00:01:28.750 So I wanted to say up here, thank you all for your 00:01:29.120 --> 00:01:32.329 for your help, for your work, uh for your professionalism. 00:01:32.338 --> 00:01:39.849 Thank you. Second thing is April 18th is National Lineman 00:01:39.859 --> 00:01:44.299 Appreciation Day. And I wanted to make sure that this 00:01:44.308 --> 00:01:49.739 agency made a commitment to put out a press release. 00:01:50.489 --> 00:01:54.510 That, that we acknowledge the men and women who are 00:01:54.519 --> 00:01:56.980 linemen. Who keep our lights on every single day through 00:01:56.989 --> 00:02:00.180 bad weather and good weather. And I just hope that 00:02:00.189 --> 00:02:03.829 we can put out a press release considering their efforts 00:02:03.838 --> 00:02:06.349 in this dangerous job, and thanking them for a job 00:02:06.359 --> 00:02:09.569 well done. Thank you, Commissioner. No I, I think 00:02:09.580 --> 00:02:11.210 that's really important. We appreciate the linemen 00:02:11.219 --> 00:02:13.169 everything they do. And, and thank you for recognizing 00:02:13.179 --> 00:02:16.169 that. So we're going to take things a little out of 00:02:16.179 --> 00:02:18.538 order. We have a couple of items we have to discuss 00:02:18.550 --> 00:02:20.330 in Closed Session. So we're going to actually take 00:02:20.338 --> 00:02:23.500 that up first. (item:45:Chairman Gleeson pauses Open Meeting, to hold Closed Session) So having convened in a duly noticed 00:02:23.508 --> 00:02:27.588 open meeting. The Commission will now at 9:33am 00:02:27.889 --> 00:02:30.699 hold a Closed Session. Pursuant to Chapter 551 of 00:02:30.710 --> 00:02:32.808 the Government Code. It will consult with its attorney 00:02:32.819 --> 00:02:36.919 pursuant to Section 551.071 of the code. Deliberate 00:02:36.929 --> 00:02:40.830 personnel matters pursuant to Section 551.074 of the 00:02:40.838 --> 00:02:43.979 code. And deliberate security matters pursuant to Section 00:02:43.990 --> 00:02:48.050 551.076 of the code. So we'll stand in recess until 00:02:48.058 --> 00:02:48.710 we come back. 00:03:00.008 --> 00:03:04.469 (item:45:Chairman Gleeson concludes Closed Session, Public Meeting resumed) The Closed Session is hereby concluded at 9:59am 00:03:04.479 --> 00:03:07.710 on April 11, 2024. And the Commission will resume 00:03:07.719 --> 00:03:11.969 its Public Meeting. Having deliberated in the Closed 00:03:11.979 --> 00:03:16.028 Session. (item:45:Motion to authorize PUC's outside FERC Counsel to file protest on behalf of PUC) I would entertain a motion to authorize the 00:03:16.038 --> 00:03:19.028 PUC's outside FERC Counsel to file a protest on behalf 00:03:19.038 --> 00:03:25.389 of the PUC in FERC Docket No. ER-241499. To recommend 00:03:25.399 --> 00:03:28.949 rejection of the proposal or alternatively to make 00:03:28.960 --> 00:03:33.058 subject to. Be made subject to the outcome of FERC's 00:03:33.069 --> 00:03:36.258 decision concerning the justness and reasonableness 00:03:36.278 --> 00:03:39.419 of the proposed three step methodology for allocating 00:03:39.429 --> 00:03:45.960 net operating loss carry forward, NOLC. And NOLC accumulated 00:03:45.969 --> 00:03:50.860 deferred income taxes under the MSS 4R tariff. 00:03:52.528 --> 00:03:56.808 So moved. I second. We have a motion and a second. All 00:03:56.819 --> 00:04:01.778 those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion carries. Okay. Number 00:04:01.788 --> 00:04:07.838 2. (item:45:Motion to increase Commission Counsel's salary) I would entertain a motion to increase the Commission 00:04:07.849 --> 00:04:14.389 Counsel's salary to $226,020 per year effective today. 00:04:14.979 --> 00:04:18.519 So moved. I second. Motion and a second. All those in favor, 00:04:18.528 --> 00:04:23.069 say aye. Aye. Opposed? Congratulations Shelah. Thank you, 00:04:23.079 --> 00:04:23.298 sir. 00:04:26.389 --> 00:04:30.269 Okay, so now we can start with our contested case items. 00:04:30.629 --> 00:04:33.488 Shelah, will you please lay out Item No. 1? 00:04:35.730 --> 00:04:39.759 Yes, Chairman. (item:1:Michelle Andersson against Labella Palms 117, LLC & La Bella Palms Apts.) Item 1 is Docket No. 49925. This 00:04:39.769 --> 00:04:42.790 is the complaint of Michelle Andersson against La Bella 00:04:42.939 --> 00:04:47.819 Palms 117, LLC and La Bella Palms Apartments. Before you 00:04:47.829 --> 00:04:51.129 is a proposal for decision from SOAH. No corrections 00:04:51.139 --> 00:04:54.379 or exceptions were filed. Chairman Gleeson filed a memo 00:04:54.389 --> 00:04:58.088 in this docket. So like Shelah said, I filed a memo in 00:04:58.100 --> 00:05:02.399 this um with my thoughts. Happy to hear y'alls or to 00:05:02.410 --> 00:05:05.750 uh to entertain a motion, if there's no discussion needed. 00:05:06.920 --> 00:05:09.100 I was in agreement with your position in your memo. 00:05:09.809 --> 00:05:14.910 I also was, is as well. I move to adopt the motion per 00:05:14.920 --> 00:05:19.108 your memo. Is that the correct? So I'll weigh it out. 00:05:19.119 --> 00:05:22.178 (item:1:Motion to adopt PDF & direct OPDM to draft final order consistent with Chairman Gleeson's memo) So I'd entertain a motion to adopt the PFD consistent 00:05:22.189 --> 00:05:25.178 with my memo and direct OPDM to draft a final order 00:05:25.189 --> 00:05:26.858 consistent with the memo. 00:05:28.850 --> 00:05:31.608 So moved. I second. Motion and second. All those in favor, 00:05:31.619 --> 00:05:34.850 say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion prevails. 00:05:37.379 --> 00:05:40.379 Shelah, will you lay out Item No. 2 please? Yes, sir. (item:2:Petition of Treasure Island to amend Mustang Special Utility District's CCN) Item 00:05:40.389 --> 00:05:44.910 2 is Docket No. 53734. This is the petition of 00:05:44.920 --> 00:05:49.678 Treasure Island to amend Mustang Special Utility District's 00:05:49.920 --> 00:05:54.358 CCN by decertifying a portion of the service area in 00:05:54.369 --> 00:05:58.139 Grayson County. An order was filed that requested briefing 00:05:58.149 --> 00:06:00.619 on certain threshold legal issues in this proceeding. 00:06:01.019 --> 00:06:04.278 Treasure Island, Mustang SUD and Commission Staff 00:06:04.290 --> 00:06:08.000 each filed briefs. And the party's briefs on the threshold 00:06:08.009 --> 00:06:10.160 legal issues are what are before the Commission now. 00:06:10.850 --> 00:06:13.459 So as Shelah said, a briefing order was filed February 00:06:13.470 --> 00:06:16.970 9th. I filed a memo in this docket with my thoughts. 00:06:16.980 --> 00:06:21.829 Do we need any discussion? I support all of the, uh 00:06:21.838 --> 00:06:24.019 I agree with your thoughts as laid out in your memo. 00:06:24.819 --> 00:06:25.629 I do as well. 00:06:27.329 --> 00:06:30.100 Same. All right. (item:2:Motion to direct Docket Management prepare an order on briefing issues consistent with Chairman Gleeson's memo) I will entertain a motion to direct Docket 00:06:30.108 --> 00:06:32.750 Management to prepare an order on briefing issues consistent 00:06:32.759 --> 00:06:33.079 with my memo. 00:06:35.309 --> 00:06:38.250 So moved. I second. All those, I have a motion and a second. All those 00:06:38.259 --> 00:06:41.509 in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. 00:06:43.329 --> 00:06:45.769 Alright Shelah, can you take us through Item No. 3 please? 00:06:46.220 --> 00:06:50.829 Yes, sir. (item:3:Application of Corix Utilities (Texas) Inc. for authority to change rates) Item 3 is Docket No. 53815. This is 00:06:50.838 --> 00:06:54.750 the application of Corix Utilities (Texas) Inc. 00:06:54.759 --> 00:06:58.170 for authority to change rates. Before you is a proposal 00:06:58.178 --> 00:07:02.230 for decision from SOAH. Corix, the Office of Public Utility 00:07:02.238 --> 00:07:05.209 Counsel and Commission Staff each filed exceptions 00:07:05.220 --> 00:07:09.100 to the PFD. SOAH filed a letter responding to the exceptions. 00:07:09.108 --> 00:07:11.829 And recommended that a final number run be conducted 00:07:11.838 --> 00:07:14.278 to make certain corrections that were identified by 00:07:14.290 --> 00:07:17.559 Corix. I filed a Commission Counsel memo recommending 00:07:17.569 --> 00:07:21.358 changes to the final order. Thank you. And I believe 00:07:21.379 --> 00:07:24.160 oral argument was asked for in this docket and was denied, 00:07:24.170 --> 00:07:25.889 is that correct? That is correct. 00:07:27.829 --> 00:07:29.970 So happy to hear y'alls thoughts on this. 00:07:29.980 --> 00:07:32.889 I think the ALJ got, got it right on the issues. 00:07:32.899 --> 00:07:34.819 But I'm, I'm happy to hear y'alls thoughts. 00:07:36.910 --> 00:07:40.899 I'm in agreement as well. I, I think the ALJ's PFD um 00:07:40.910 --> 00:07:43.329 did a good job of addressing all the issues. And I would 00:07:43.338 --> 00:07:45.129 be in favor of adopting the PFD. 00:07:47.759 --> 00:07:49.649 Agreed. I'd be in favor as well and I guess we need a 00:07:49.660 --> 00:07:53.819 number run. Yeah. (item:3:Motion to adopt PFD, authorize OPDM to direct Staff to perform final number run & final order) So if there's agreement, I'd entertain 00:07:53.829 --> 00:07:57.129 a motion to adopt the PFD and authorize OPDM to direct 00:07:57.139 --> 00:08:00.088 Staff to perform a final number run, to implement the 00:08:00.100 --> 00:08:03.540 recommendations in the PFD and direct OPDM to draft 00:08:03.548 --> 00:08:06.170 a final order. Consistent with our discussion and to 00:08:06.178 --> 00:08:09.720 bring this order back at a future open meeting. And 00:08:09.730 --> 00:08:12.639 include the corrections proposed by Commission Counsel's 00:08:12.649 --> 00:08:13.040 memo? 00:08:14.619 --> 00:08:17.040 Yes, if that's the Commission's decision. 00:08:19.619 --> 00:08:22.278 So moved. I second. Have a motion and second. All those in favor, say 00:08:22.290 --> 00:08:26.119 aye. Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. 00:08:27.970 --> 00:08:33.090 All right. Items 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and 9 were all consented. 00:08:33.099 --> 00:08:35.428 That brings us to Item No. 11. Shelah, will you 00:08:35.440 --> 00:08:38.178 lay this out please? Yes. And 10 was also consented, 00:08:38.190 --> 00:08:43.038 just to note. (item11:Application of Southwestern Public Service Company for authority to Change rates) Item 11 is Docket No. 54634. This 00:08:43.048 --> 00:08:45.960 is the application of Southwestern Public Service Company 00:08:45.969 --> 00:08:49.654 for authority to change rates. Before you is a revised proposed 00:08:49.663 --> 00:08:52.695 order that addresses an unopposed agreement among the 00:08:52.705 --> 00:08:55.695 parties in this proceeding. And Commissioner Glotfelty 00:08:55.705 --> 00:08:58.913 filed a memo in this docket. Thank you, Shelah. And 00:08:59.085 --> 00:09:03.734 I, I would probably say I'm not alone in thinking that 00:09:03.744 --> 00:09:07.330 you're. This was an amazing, amazing filing you made. 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:11.308 It was very thought provoking. I spent a good amount 00:09:11.320 --> 00:09:13.979 of time last night, almost didn't sleep thinking about 00:09:13.989 --> 00:09:17.989 it. So happy to have you lay out your memo. I 00:09:18.000 --> 00:09:20.869 I consented this item. So uh happy to have you take 00:09:20.879 --> 00:09:23.474 the lead, Commissioner Glotfelty. So first of all 00:09:24.234 --> 00:09:27.884 as you all know I, I don't file memos very often. 00:09:27.894 --> 00:09:32.364 So it takes a whole lot to get me to do this. 00:09:33.244 --> 00:09:36.644 (item11:Commissioner Glotfelty lays out his memo) And in the few times that I do this, I realize that 00:09:36.654 --> 00:09:39.134 I put the wrong docket number on there. So I apologize 00:09:39.144 --> 00:09:42.695 for my mistake. There's supposed to be a little levity 00:09:42.705 --> 00:09:47.965 in this. But the point is black box settlements, there 00:09:47.974 --> 00:09:51.070 are pros and cons for them. We don't know what's in 00:09:51.080 --> 00:09:54.590 them and you don't know what's in mine. And the point 00:09:54.599 --> 00:09:59.029 is that, you know, these aren't great all the time. 00:09:59.038 --> 00:10:02.960 Sometimes they get to the point. But people, if you're 00:10:02.969 --> 00:10:06.879 not in the case you know nothing. And my point was 00:10:06.889 --> 00:10:10.129 just to try to say that. That I know there's a, there's 00:10:10.139 --> 00:10:13.119 a place for these, and I know there's a reason for these. 00:10:13.129 --> 00:10:16.070 But they're not always that great. Especially when 00:10:16.080 --> 00:10:18.649 we have to make decisions on behalf of all consumers 00:10:18.869 --> 00:10:23.450 and we don't know what's in it. So totally understand 00:10:23.460 --> 00:10:25.710 the sentiment. You know I, I think I've made my 00:10:25.719 --> 00:10:27.869 feelings on this pretty clear. I like settlements, 00:10:27.879 --> 00:10:29.889 I think we should encourage settlements. And settlements 00:10:29.899 --> 00:10:32.418 don't exist without black box, you know, provisions. 00:10:32.428 --> 00:10:36.729 So um understand, understand the issue. But yeah 00:10:36.739 --> 00:10:40.529 I think it's just something we, we deal with. Yeah. 00:10:42.469 --> 00:10:44.879 Thoughts, no? No other commentary on Commissioner Glotfelty's 00:10:44.889 --> 00:10:48.000 memo? I'll always appreciate his memos. 00:10:50.820 --> 00:10:54.119 Yes. Okay. I don't think we need to approve this one for, for 00:10:54.178 --> 00:10:57.599 inclusion in this case. But you know, we don't need 00:10:57.609 --> 00:11:00.200 to modify the order for this. Not on this one. Not 00:11:00.210 --> 00:11:01.119 on this one. May the next one. 00:11:03.019 --> 00:11:05.099 That's right. Okay. So like I said, I consented this. Did anyone have 00:11:05.109 --> 00:11:08.538 any other issues they want to discuss on this? I would 00:11:08.548 --> 00:11:13.058 just say one other thing. This is a big issue. I think 00:11:13.119 --> 00:11:16.940 this is a, this is a rate case. There have been a 00:11:16.950 --> 00:11:18.690 lot of things that have happened between the time this 00:11:18.700 --> 00:11:21.190 is filed, and the time this is litigated in this meeting. 00:11:21.440 --> 00:11:26.469 That being the the largest wildfire in Texas history 00:11:26.479 --> 00:11:30.399 has affected this system. This is not the place to 00:11:30.408 --> 00:11:33.239 discuss that. But I think it needs to be mentioned 00:11:33.250 --> 00:11:37.500 that to the people of this service territory. That we 00:11:37.509 --> 00:11:43.908 support them. This was a, a docket that preceded this 00:11:43.918 --> 00:11:48.298 fire and the trauma that they have experienced. And 00:11:48.460 --> 00:11:50.979 I just wanted to make sure that we said that as a 00:11:50.989 --> 00:11:55.168 Commission. But uh we'll have our, our discussions 00:11:55.359 --> 00:11:58.750 with them on this, uh on this issue in the future in 00:11:58.759 --> 00:12:02.080 a different docket. Absolutely well said. (item11:Motion to approve revised proposed order filed 04/02/2024) So with 00:12:02.090 --> 00:12:04.840 that, I will entertain a motion to approve the revised 00:12:04.849 --> 00:12:10.070 proposed order filed April 2, 2024. So moved. I second. Have a motion 00:12:10.080 --> 00:12:13.369 and a second. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? Motion 00:12:13.379 --> 00:12:16.710 prevails. Shelah, will you please lay out Item No. 00:12:16.719 --> 00:12:17.399 12. 00:12:23.479 --> 00:12:28.090 Yes. (item12:Application of El Paso Electric Company to amend CCN for a 150 MW solar facility) Item 12 is Docket No. 54929. This is the application 00:12:28.099 --> 00:12:32.418 of El Paso Electric Company to amend it CCN for a 150 00:12:32.428 --> 00:12:35.918 MW solar facility. Before you is a revised proposed 00:12:35.928 --> 00:12:38.570 order that addresses a unanimous agreement among the 00:12:38.580 --> 00:12:42.349 parties in this proceeding. So again, I consented this 00:12:42.359 --> 00:12:46.369 item. So happy to hear y'alls thoughts on it. I can 00:12:46.379 --> 00:12:50.918 consented as well. I I'm, I'm good with the um proposed 00:12:50.928 --> 00:12:53.899 order and I would consent it as well. My only feedback 00:12:53.908 --> 00:12:58.450 would be that as El Paso looks to meet their increasing 00:12:58.460 --> 00:13:03.139 electricity demand in their service territory. Um and 00:13:03.149 --> 00:13:06.340 uh you know procure and, and build new facilities 00:13:06.349 --> 00:13:10.440 for, for meeting that demand. That um we ensure like 00:13:10.450 --> 00:13:13.158 we have been doing for the other non-ERCOT utilities. 00:13:13.168 --> 00:13:17.330 That um they are adding generation to their fleet to 00:13:17.340 --> 00:13:20.259 maintain reliability for the future. And I think the 00:13:20.269 --> 00:13:22.979 solar facility is, is a you know they, they conducted 00:13:22.989 --> 00:13:25.288 a RFP. They, they selected this facility. But as they 00:13:25.298 --> 00:13:27.729 look to retire power plants in the future. To make sure 00:13:27.739 --> 00:13:33.178 that they are also replacing some of that retired generation 00:13:33.190 --> 00:13:38.149 with dispatchable generation as well. But otherwise 00:13:38.158 --> 00:13:42.058 I'm, I'm good with the um outcome of this case. And 00:13:42.070 --> 00:13:44.408 I have one question for El Paso on this. Would you 00:13:44.418 --> 00:13:46.239 mind if I ask them to come to the dais? 00:13:51.590 --> 00:13:53.899 Sure, absolutely. Please state your name and who you represent. (item12:El Paso Electric's Casey Bell on affiliated company building solar farms) Good 00:13:53.908 --> 00:13:55.779 morning, Commissioners. Casey Bell here on behalf of 00:13:55.788 --> 00:13:59.250 El Paso Electric. Thank you, appreciate it. So throughout 00:13:59.259 --> 00:14:03.840 this docket, I have tried to understand whether one 00:14:03.849 --> 00:14:06.548 energy resource. The company that you all have awarded 00:14:06.558 --> 00:14:09.509 this bid to, to build the solar farms is an affiliate 00:14:09.519 --> 00:14:12.479 of yours. And I can't find anywhere where it is an 00:14:12.489 --> 00:14:15.288 affiliate or where it's not affiliate. And I just wanted 00:14:15.298 --> 00:14:18.509 to understand that on the record, if it is or if it's 00:14:18.519 --> 00:14:22.529 not? No, it is not. Okay, that's all I have. All right. 00:14:22.558 --> 00:14:23.960 Thank you. Thank you. 00:14:28.820 --> 00:14:31.158 All right. (item12:Motion to approve proposed order) For Item 12, I will entertain a motion to 00:14:31.168 --> 00:14:33.580 approve the proposed order that approves the Texas 00:14:33.590 --> 00:14:36.750 Solar One jettering facility and amends El Paso Electric 00:14:36.928 --> 00:14:41.038 CCN No. 30050 to the extent provided by the proposed 00:14:41.048 --> 00:14:45.259 order. So moved. I second. Have a motion and a second. All 00:14:45.269 --> 00:14:50.099 those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. Shelah, 00:14:50.109 --> 00:14:54.918 will you please lay out Item No. 13? (item13:Application of TNMP Company to amend CCN for Pilot Point 138-kV Transmission Line Project in Collin, Grayson, and Denton Counties) Item 13 is 00:14:54.928 --> 00:14:59.099 Docket No. 55114. This is the application of Texas 00:14:59.109 --> 00:15:03.149 New Mexico Power Company to amend its CCN with Pilot 00:15:03.158 --> 00:15:07.629 Point 138-kV transmission line project and Collin, Grayson 00:15:07.639 --> 00:15:10.440 and Denton Counties. The Commission filed an order 00:15:10.450 --> 00:15:14.279 in this docket on February 1st. Four Seasons Ranch Limited 00:15:14.288 --> 00:15:17.149 filed a timely motion for rehearing. The Commission, 00:15:17.158 --> 00:15:19.580 Commission voted to add the motion for a hearing to 00:15:19.590 --> 00:15:22.469 this agenda for consideration of the merits of the 00:15:22.479 --> 00:15:27.090 motion. And I filed a memo, did I? No I didn't. Did 00:15:27.129 --> 00:15:33.229 I? No. No. So, out of sorts here. So motion for rehearing 00:15:33.239 --> 00:15:36.960 like Shelah said. I'm prepared to grant rehearing for 00:15:36.969 --> 00:15:40.859 a very limited purpose on this issue. So I'm happy 00:15:40.869 --> 00:15:43.889 to hear y'alls thoughts on this. I would agree as 00:15:43.899 --> 00:15:47.109 well. I would be in favor of granting rehearing for 00:15:47.119 --> 00:15:51.450 point of order number four. To ensure that um all landowners 00:15:51.460 --> 00:15:54.960 consent to the proposed modification to link 1a. And 00:15:54.969 --> 00:15:58.229 that one landowner, I think that um we're specifically 00:15:58.239 --> 00:16:01.109 talking about is Sparkling Ranch. I think that's consistent 00:16:01.119 --> 00:16:03.599 with Commission precedent in our interpretation of 00:16:03.609 --> 00:16:07.609 the Commission's rule. Of um making sure that affected 00:16:07.619 --> 00:16:11.250 landowners get notice of any modifications to links. 00:16:11.519 --> 00:16:14.710 As they may have been participating in a proceeding 00:16:14.719 --> 00:16:16.928 and, and later drop off. Because they don't think that 00:16:16.940 --> 00:16:19.090 the route is going to impact them. And so we just need 00:16:19.099 --> 00:16:24.229 to make them aware and get consent. And so, um I would 00:16:24.239 --> 00:16:26.779 be in favor again of granting rehearing on that limited 00:16:26.788 --> 00:16:30.359 purpose issue for a point of order, point of error number 00:16:30.369 --> 00:16:34.950 four. And consequently, then abate the proceeding to 00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:39.960 give TNMP the opportunity to obtain consent from Sparkling 00:16:39.969 --> 00:16:47.639 Ranch on the modified um link 1A. I also think we 00:16:47.649 --> 00:16:50.639 need to allow you all to accept that into the record, 00:16:50.889 --> 00:16:55.129 if they file a consent from that landowner. So we can 00:16:55.548 --> 00:16:58.690 included in the record. We can remand this back. Right, I recommend 00:16:58.700 --> 00:17:01.700 in that case. That we, that the Commission would want 00:17:01.710 --> 00:17:04.769 to consider remanding this to docket management. To 00:17:04.779 --> 00:17:07.328 allow the parties to file the information that's requested. 00:17:07.500 --> 00:17:10.019 And that way the ALJ can enter it into the record if 00:17:10.029 --> 00:17:12.939 they follow. Hopefully the parties will file a motion, 00:17:12.949 --> 00:17:16.039 for a motion to admit the evidence. Okay. 00:17:17.750 --> 00:17:19.578 All right. (item13:Motion to grant rehearing) Then I would entertain a motion to grant 00:17:19.588 --> 00:17:21.789 rehearing. For the sole purpose of determining whether 00:17:21.799 --> 00:17:25.049 the landowners Sparkling Ranch affected by the proposed 00:17:25.059 --> 00:17:28.699 modification of Link 1A will consent to this modification. 00:17:28.709 --> 00:17:31.549 And remand this docket to docket management to allow 00:17:31.559 --> 00:17:34.680 TNMP to file evidence through a sworn affidavit. Of 00:17:34.689 --> 00:17:37.608 the landowner's consent to the modification of Link 00:17:37.618 --> 00:17:41.140 1A, and further set a deadline to file this evidence 00:17:41.150 --> 00:17:44.380 no later than April 22, 2024. So that we can consider 00:17:44.390 --> 00:17:50.259 this at the May 2nd Open Meeting. So moved. Second. I have a motion 00:17:50.269 --> 00:17:54.049 and a second. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? The motion 00:17:54.059 --> 00:17:54.838 prevails. 00:17:56.539 --> 00:18:01.209 Item No. 14 was consented, so Item No. 15. Shelah, 00:18:01.289 --> 00:18:04.848 please lay that out for us. (item15:Application of South Texas Electric Coop, Inc. to amend CCN for Hondo Creek-to-Pearson 69-kV transmission line rebuild & upgrade in Medina County) Item 15 is Docket No. 00:18:04.858 --> 00:18:09.469 55563. This is the application of South Texas Electric 00:18:09.479 --> 00:18:13.309 Cooperative to amend it CCN for the Honda Creek-to-Pearson 00:18:13.338 --> 00:18:17.618 69-kV transmission line rebuild and upgrade in Medina 00:18:17.630 --> 00:18:20.809 County. Before you is a proposal for decision from SOAH. 00:18:20.818 --> 00:18:24.920 Party Upper Elstone Road filed exceptions to the 00:18:24.930 --> 00:18:28.529 PFD. The SOAH ALJ filed a letter declining to make changes 00:18:28.539 --> 00:18:31.049 to the PFD. And Chairman Gleeson filed a memo in this 00:18:31.059 --> 00:18:34.449 docket. So I generally agree with the ALJ, with the 00:18:34.459 --> 00:18:37.449 exception of the one issue I laid out in my memo. Happy 00:18:37.459 --> 00:18:41.529 to hear your thoughts. Good catch, I'm in agreement. 00:18:41.660 --> 00:18:47.309 I'm in agreement as well. I think RVs are uh habitable 00:18:47.318 --> 00:18:49.959 structures as well. I did have one other comment on 00:18:49.969 --> 00:18:54.838 this. And that was, that as we see, reconductoring become more 00:18:54.848 --> 00:18:59.348 and more. This is reconductoring an existing right of way 00:18:59.358 --> 00:19:02.368 but it's widening. It may be something that we want 00:19:02.380 --> 00:19:04.209 to work with the Legislature on here in the future 00:19:04.219 --> 00:19:07.549 on widening an existing right of way. Are there exclusions 00:19:07.559 --> 00:19:10.170 from that or not. It does impact landowners. It would 00:19:10.180 --> 00:19:12.750 be a statutory issue. But I bring that up as something 00:19:12.759 --> 00:19:14.009 for us to think about in the future. 00:19:15.789 --> 00:19:19.088 Perfect, all right. (item15:Motion to adopt PFD in part consistent with Chairman Gleeson's memo & direct OPDM to final order) So I will entertain a motion to adopt the 00:19:19.098 --> 00:19:21.920 PFD in part consistent with my memo and our discussion 00:19:21.930 --> 00:19:24.479 direct ODM to prepare a final order consistent with 00:19:24.489 --> 00:19:25.108 our discussion. 00:19:27.130 --> 00:19:29.598 So moved. Second. I have a motion and a second. All those in favor, say aye. 00:19:30.000 --> 00:19:32.269 Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. 00:19:34.118 --> 00:19:39.588 Shelah, Item number 16 please. (item:16:Application of CPS Energy to amend CCN for proposed 138 kV transmission line in Bexar County) Item 16 is Docket No. 55728. 00:19:39.838 --> 00:19:44.318 This is the application of CPS Energy to amend its CCN for 00:19:44.519 --> 00:19:48.358 a proposed 138-kV transmission line in Bexar County. 00:19:48.709 --> 00:19:51.588 Before you is a proposed order that addresses the unanimous 00:19:51.598 --> 00:19:54.328 agreement among the parties to route the transmission 00:19:54.338 --> 00:19:58.009 line along Route S. So I think I've been pretty clear 00:19:58.019 --> 00:20:01.098 in the past on my opinion. That the bar to overturn 00:20:01.108 --> 00:20:03.348 unanimous stipulations needs to be really high. So 00:20:03.358 --> 00:20:06.650 I'm, I'm inclined to agree with this settlement. I 00:20:06.660 --> 00:20:09.858 would say however, that I was unable to find anything 00:20:09.868 --> 00:20:14.630 to in the, you know, testimony to support Route S. So 00:20:14.979 --> 00:20:17.130 you know, I'm in favor of it I think. But I'd like 00:20:17.140 --> 00:20:19.209 to see something, you know, in the record about that. 00:20:19.219 --> 00:20:22.078 So I'm inclined to remand this docket back to allow 00:20:22.088 --> 00:20:24.068 the parties to file evidence in support of Route S. 00:20:24.078 --> 00:20:27.818 And if we get that, I'm inclined to approve this. I'm 00:20:27.838 --> 00:20:31.380 a, I can go with that. I'm a believer that Route H 00:20:31.390 --> 00:20:35.539 is the more appropriate route. I think we've, it's 00:20:35.549 --> 00:20:41.170 been a long tradition. That a, a landowner that says 00:20:41.180 --> 00:20:45.219 I have a future development on my property. Is not a 00:20:45.229 --> 00:20:50.410 reason to exclude that piece of property from, from 00:20:50.420 --> 00:20:53.489 consideration. That's what we have here. Nonetheless 00:20:53.500 --> 00:20:55.459 the parties did agree to this. 00:20:57.118 --> 00:21:00.890 Again, I don't think it's the right uh route. But 00:21:00.900 --> 00:21:02.989 in fact, it is an agreement. So, uh I would support 00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:06.019 your effort if we get the uh, uh evidence in the record. 00:21:08.299 --> 00:21:11.410 I'm in agreement with supporting settlement agreements 00:21:11.420 --> 00:21:13.410 in cases. I think it's important that we continue to 00:21:13.420 --> 00:21:16.219 encourage settlement agreements. However, like you 00:21:16.229 --> 00:21:18.199 Chairman Gleeson. I think that the parties need to 00:21:18.209 --> 00:21:21.259 file supporting testimony into the evidentiary record 00:21:21.269 --> 00:21:22.108 on settlement Route S. 00:21:23.979 --> 00:21:27.739 I'm in agreement as well. Okay. (item:16:Motion to remand docket to Docket Management) Then I would entertain 00:21:27.750 --> 00:21:29.959 a motion to remand this docket to Docket Management. 00:21:29.969 --> 00:21:32.219 To allow the parties to file evidence in support of 00:21:32.229 --> 00:21:35.328 Route S that addresses the routing criteria in PURA 00:21:35.338 --> 00:21:38.239 and the Commission's rules and policies. Set a deadline 00:21:38.250 --> 00:21:41.920 for that evidence to be submitted no later than April 00:21:41.930 --> 00:21:44.279 22, 2024 at Noon. 00:21:48.309 --> 00:21:50.180 So moved. Second. I have a motion and a second. All those in favor, say 00:21:50.209 --> 00:21:53.049 aye. Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. 00:21:55.059 --> 00:21:59.140 Item 17 and 18 were consented. So that brings us to 00:21:59.150 --> 00:22:02.358 Item No. 19. Shelah, will you lay out Item 19 please. 00:22:03.078 --> 00:22:07.108 (item:19:Application of Lone Star Transmission, LLC to amend CCN and notice of PURA ยง 14.101 Transaction) Item 19 is Docket No. 55991. The application 00:22:07.118 --> 00:22:12.439 of Lone Star Transmission, LLC to amend it CCN and there's 00:22:12.449 --> 00:22:17.719 also a notice of a PURA 14.101 transaction. TIEC filed 00:22:17.729 --> 00:22:20.078 an appeal of order number eight in this proceeding. 00:22:20.250 --> 00:22:22.818 The Commission voted to place this docket on this agenda 00:22:22.828 --> 00:22:26.390 for this meeting solely. To consider whether to extend 00:22:26.400 --> 00:22:29.160 time to act on TIEC's appeal of order number eight. 00:22:30.098 --> 00:22:32.608 I'm fine with this extension, if everybody else is. 00:22:32.880 --> 00:22:37.019 I am too. I'm fine. Yes. Okay. (item:19:Motion to extend the time to act on this appeal to the maximum extent allowed) Then I would entertain a motion 00:22:37.029 --> 00:22:39.348 to extend the time to act on this appeal to the maximum 00:22:39.368 --> 00:22:40.509 extent allowed. 00:22:42.739 --> 00:22:46.239 So moved. Second. I have a motion and second. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? 00:22:46.559 --> 00:22:52.009 Motion prevails. Items 20 and 21 were consented. So that 00:22:52.019 --> 00:22:54.739 brings us to Item No. 22. Shelah, do we have anyone 00:22:54.750 --> 00:22:58.098 signed up for Public Comment? I'm gonna pause and check 00:22:58.108 --> 00:22:59.759 with my because I actually don't have the sign 00:22:59.769 --> 00:23:00.420 in sheet. 00:23:07.969 --> 00:23:12.309 (item:22:Shelah Cisneros confirms there are no Public Comments) We did have three people that signed up. Three public, 00:23:12.410 --> 00:23:14.318 three members of the public that signed up to speak 00:23:14.328 --> 00:23:17.699 for this item. However, those the three people signed 00:23:17.709 --> 00:23:20.269 up to speak about one of the dockets on this agenda 00:23:20.279 --> 00:23:22.380 and I believe that you addressed this earlier. Saying 00:23:22.489 --> 00:23:24.618 that the Commission voted not to grant oral argument 00:23:24.630 --> 00:23:27.279 in that docket. That's correct. And no one else has signed up to speak. 00:23:27.630 --> 00:23:28.680 Okay, thank you. 00:23:30.828 --> 00:23:36.309 So I don't have anything on Items 23, 24 or 25. (item:26:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 54445) So that 00:23:36.318 --> 00:23:43.068 brings us to Item No. 26. That is Project 54445, 00:23:43.078 --> 00:23:45.900 review of protocols adopted by the independent organization. 00:23:56.338 --> 00:23:59.549 So we have 19 proposed revisions in this, this time 00:23:59.559 --> 00:24:02.618 around. All the revisions were, were passed. I think 00:24:02.630 --> 00:24:04.709 they were all unanimous. So I'm in favor of approving 00:24:04.719 --> 00:24:05.059 this. 00:24:06.670 --> 00:24:09.848 I am as well. But I do want to take the time 00:24:09.858 --> 00:24:14.489 to um thank ERCOT, their staff, the stakeholders and 00:24:14.500 --> 00:24:16.828 everybody involved in all the hard work. The Board as 00:24:16.838 --> 00:24:22.088 well. On NPRR 1186 it was a long um deliberation. 00:24:22.098 --> 00:24:26.250 And um I really appreciate um ERCOT and the work they've 00:24:26.259 --> 00:24:29.809 put into trying to, you know, look at storage more. 00:24:29.818 --> 00:24:33.328 And ultimately, I think we're moving in the right direction. 00:24:33.338 --> 00:24:37.449 I appreciate the Board um, you know, working with 00:24:37.459 --> 00:24:40.328 us on this remand. And so I just want to take the 00:24:40.338 --> 00:24:45.390 time to thank everybody involved. And would be in favor 00:24:45.400 --> 00:24:47.838 of moving forward with approving the proposed order 00:24:47.848 --> 00:24:50.039 that adopts all of these market rule changes. I think 00:24:50.049 --> 00:24:52.969 that's well said. This, I think shows that the process 00:24:52.979 --> 00:24:55.029 we've set up is definitely working. 00:24:56.568 --> 00:25:00.769 I agree as well. I'm supportive of all these NPRRs. 00:25:00.779 --> 00:25:04.229 All of them, all of them. All just NPRRs I think. 00:25:04.410 --> 00:25:07.469 That's good. All right. (item:26:Motion to adopt proposed order) I will entertain a motion to 00:25:07.479 --> 00:25:10.299 adopt the proposed order. Which approves the revisions 00:25:10.309 --> 00:25:12.088 and the accompanying market impact statements. 00:25:14.338 --> 00:25:17.549 So moved. I second. I have a motion and a second. All those in favor, say aye. 00:25:18.098 --> 00:25:23.410 Aye. Opposed? The motion prevails. (item:27:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 54584) That brings us to Item 00:25:23.420 --> 00:25:28.529 No. 27. Project 54584, reliability standard for the 00:25:28.559 --> 00:25:29.519 ERCOT market. 00:25:31.259 --> 00:25:32.779 Staff wants to come up? 00:25:43.338 --> 00:25:44.719 Morning Werner. Morning Chris. 00:25:47.098 --> 00:25:49.400 (item:27:Commission Staff's Werner Roth on reliability standard project) So Werner Roth on behalf of Commission Staff. ERCOT ended 00:25:49.410 --> 00:25:51.848 up filing the data for the last scenario runs for the 00:25:51.858 --> 00:25:53.670 reliability standard project. And they also included 00:25:53.680 --> 00:25:56.098 a memo in their filing that has some recommendations 00:25:56.108 --> 00:25:58.539 for the um different parameters that go into the reliability 00:25:58.549 --> 00:26:01.779 standard. Staff doesn't really have anything to 00:26:01.789 --> 00:26:03.890 weigh in on that on any of the recommendations at this 00:26:03.900 --> 00:26:07.299 time. But I just today kind of wanting to hear a discussion 00:26:07.309 --> 00:26:08.920 and try to figure out what next steps are going to 00:26:08.930 --> 00:26:12.059 be in this project. Perfect. And thank you to you, to 00:26:12.068 --> 00:26:14.858 the PUC Staff, to ERCOT as well for, for all this work. 00:26:14.868 --> 00:26:17.078 This is, it's been a lot of work. It's taken a lot 00:26:17.088 --> 00:26:21.059 of time. So as, as I was talking to staff, you know 00:26:21.068 --> 00:26:23.098 we're going to do a rule on this. I think the rule 00:26:23.108 --> 00:26:25.608 needs to be adopted by August. So I think, you know 00:26:25.618 --> 00:26:28.390 as we move forward, we probably have a deadline of 00:26:28.400 --> 00:26:31.539 the May 16th open meeting to define all these parameters. 00:26:31.549 --> 00:26:34.328 And to give our feedback on, you know, metrics and 00:26:34.338 --> 00:26:38.299 the value of those metrics. So with that in mind 00:26:38.309 --> 00:26:40.939 you know, I think. One of, one of the options I heard 00:26:40.949 --> 00:26:44.219 was. Having ERCOT and Staff, you know, brief us independently 00:26:44.229 --> 00:26:47.140 on, on all these runs and, and answering any questions. 00:26:47.650 --> 00:26:50.670 I think it may be more productive to have a, do something 00:26:50.680 --> 00:26:52.979 publicly. So that we're all getting the same information, 00:26:52.989 --> 00:26:55.739 the public is hearing that information. So if it's 00:26:55.750 --> 00:26:58.309 all right with you all, I think. (item:27:Chairman Gleeson proposes a technical work session on 05/02/2024) I'd like to set 00:26:58.318 --> 00:27:02.568 a technical work session for May 2nd. We have an open 00:27:02.578 --> 00:27:07.390 meeting that day, hopefully it won't go too long. 00:27:07.400 --> 00:27:09.430 But I would say sometime in the early afternoon, maybe 00:27:09.439 --> 00:27:12.549 one or two o'clock depending on people's availability. 00:27:12.559 --> 00:27:16.068 I believe ERCOT's staff would be available that day. 00:27:16.250 --> 00:27:18.868 And so I think if that works for you all that'll, 00:27:18.880 --> 00:27:20.828 that works for me. And I think that's really the right 00:27:20.838 --> 00:27:21.818 way to handle this. 00:27:23.828 --> 00:27:27.380 I'm supportive of a hearing all the same thing at the 00:27:27.390 --> 00:27:29.660 same time, so I think that works great. I agree as well. 00:27:29.670 --> 00:27:31.568 I think that's part of our success as a stakeholder 00:27:31.578 --> 00:27:34.789 input that we've had along the way. And so I think 00:27:34.799 --> 00:27:36.219 this is a very appropriate 00:27:37.789 --> 00:27:40.910 mechanism to continue to get that feedback. Yeah, I 00:27:40.920 --> 00:27:43.279 think that's a great idea, Chairman Gleeson for all 00:27:43.289 --> 00:27:45.420 those reasons. I think, you know, just being transparent 00:27:45.430 --> 00:27:47.858 on the information we receive from our economy and 00:27:47.868 --> 00:27:50.519 the discussions and having dialogue that involves stakeholders 00:27:50.529 --> 00:27:53.769 is really important on this very important metric for 00:27:53.779 --> 00:27:57.680 the market. So Connie if, if you Barksdale, Staff. You 00:27:57.689 --> 00:28:01.039 all would work to get an agenda together, work with 00:28:01.049 --> 00:28:04.250 the offices, talk to ERCOT. We can put together 00:28:04.259 --> 00:28:07.848 an agenda and get that posted. So people can come and 00:28:07.858 --> 00:28:10.088 and be informed about what we're going to discuss. 00:28:10.650 --> 00:28:14.769 We'll certainly do that. And we will endeavor to start 00:28:14.779 --> 00:28:18.549 as promptly after the regular open meeting as possible. 00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:20.848 So that folks can get on to their other plans for the 00:28:20.858 --> 00:28:25.588 day. Absolutely. Anything else Werner at this point? 00:28:25.880 --> 00:28:28.229 We're good. All right, thanks y'all. Appreciate the 00:28:28.239 --> 00:28:28.578 time. 00:28:31.150 --> 00:28:35.729 (item:28:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55000) So next is Item No. 28. Project 55000, performance 00:28:35.739 --> 00:28:41.709 credit mechanism. Staff filed a memo in this docket. 00:28:41.729 --> 00:28:45.910 So Werner? (item:28:Werner Roth on filed memo summarizing discussion at 03/21/2024 Open Meeting) Werner Roth, Commission Staff. So following 00:28:45.920 --> 00:28:47.939 the March 21st open meeting. The Commissioners have 00:28:47.949 --> 00:28:51.529 directed staff to um kind of file a memo to summarize 00:28:51.539 --> 00:28:53.709 the conversation that took place during that open meeting. 00:28:53.920 --> 00:28:55.939 We've done so here. Highlighting some of the key 00:28:55.949 --> 00:28:58.108 talking points such as simplifying the process wherever 00:28:58.118 --> 00:29:02.269 possible. Reviewing the cost cap, the pucm seasons, 00:29:02.279 --> 00:29:05.439 the hours for the performance credits, both and how 00:29:05.449 --> 00:29:06.979 they're determined and what metric are gonna be is 00:29:06.989 --> 00:29:10.449 gonna be used for um determining what hours are pc 00:29:10.459 --> 00:29:13.400 hours. We also highlighted that there. We need to 00:29:13.410 --> 00:29:16.250 get additional information on the 2026 base year. Essentially 00:29:16.259 --> 00:29:18.000 we're asking ERCOT and E3 three to work together. To 00:29:18.009 --> 00:29:20.920 provide the entire list of assumptions um as quickly 00:29:20.930 --> 00:29:22.500 as possible. So, stakeholders are able to weigh in 00:29:22.509 --> 00:29:24.250 on those assumptions because we're using that as the 00:29:24.259 --> 00:29:28.449 comparison point. Also provided an updated timeline 00:29:28.459 --> 00:29:30.890 that kind of outlines. Okay? We have the workshop with 00:29:30.900 --> 00:29:34.439 um at ERCOT on April 17th. And then highlights the steps that 00:29:34.449 --> 00:29:38.108 will take place after that through June. So 00:29:38.118 --> 00:29:40.309 during this just wanted to make sure we captured all 00:29:40.318 --> 00:29:42.979 the talking points correctly. And um if you have any 00:29:42.989 --> 00:29:45.250 questions we can answer them. No, I appreciate the 00:29:45.259 --> 00:29:47.328 work Werner. Yeah, I was good with everything that 00:29:47.338 --> 00:29:50.568 was in there. I appreciated it. You know, as, as 00:29:50.578 --> 00:29:53.779 I've said before, I think. We're we, we have a task 00:29:53.789 --> 00:29:56.729 to complete by December. I think we need to have the 00:29:56.739 --> 00:30:00.729 cost estimates, the cost analysis done. November, early 00:30:00.739 --> 00:30:02.838 December at the latest. So we have something to present 00:30:02.848 --> 00:30:05.660 to the Legislature. So I'm good with their timeline 00:30:05.670 --> 00:30:08.650 you know having the, the first work session workshop 00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:12.868 at, at ERCOT. And then some, I'm in June or July having 00:30:12.880 --> 00:30:15.709 the work session that we talked about here. So that 00:30:15.719 --> 00:30:19.259 we could ask questions of market participants. So I 00:30:19.269 --> 00:30:21.039 was good with all that. And then, you know, hopefully 00:30:21.049 --> 00:30:23.949 we can get all, all of that work done and completed. 00:30:24.118 --> 00:30:27.709 And then, you know, in December have that final report 00:30:27.719 --> 00:30:30.670 on costs submitted. And start distributing it to the 00:30:30.680 --> 00:30:32.009 members of the Legislature and the Governor. 00:30:33.910 --> 00:30:37.289 Sounds perfect, yeah. Thank you so much for summarizing 00:30:37.299 --> 00:30:39.150 our feedback from the last open meeting. And I'm, I'm 00:30:39.160 --> 00:30:41.739 good with the memo and the next steps as proposed by 00:30:41.750 --> 00:30:44.789 Staff and Chairman Gleeson. All right. 00:30:49.529 --> 00:30:51.769 Shelah, did we have any? I sorry, I skipped over. Did 00:30:51.779 --> 00:30:56.108 we have anything on 25? Looking at ERCOT? Did we have 00:30:56.118 --> 00:30:57.328 anything on reports? 00:31:00.459 --> 00:31:02.088 Didn't want to skip over you, Rebecca? 00:31:03.979 --> 00:31:05.549 I know we had talked about a few things. I didn't know 00:31:05.559 --> 00:31:08.108 if that was where you plan to talk about them or if 00:31:08.118 --> 00:31:11.640 we're going to do them under the Permian. So we had 00:31:11.650 --> 00:31:14.578 the filing last open meeting regarding. I'm sorry. (item:25:ERCOT's Rebecca Zerwas on South Texas GTCs) Rebecca 00:31:14.588 --> 00:31:17.410 Zerwas for ERCOT. We had the filing for the last open meeting 00:31:17.420 --> 00:31:20.608 regarding the new South Texas, GTCs. And there were 00:31:20.618 --> 00:31:23.588 some items that ERCOT was continuing to look at. And 00:31:23.598 --> 00:31:25.509 we were just requesting if there was any feedback from 00:31:25.519 --> 00:31:28.140 the Commission at this time. (item:25:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55999) So yeah, so I think so 00:31:28.150 --> 00:31:31.949 Item No. 25. Project number 55999, reports of the 00:31:31.959 --> 00:31:34.910 Electric Reliability Council of Texas. So if you're 00:31:34.920 --> 00:31:37.180 looking for feedback on that. I think the only feedback 00:31:37.189 --> 00:31:39.779 I would have is. It's an issue that we need to look 00:31:39.789 --> 00:31:43.719 to address. And so, you know, the things that I've 00:31:43.729 --> 00:31:46.348 I've thought about are, you know, a demand response 00:31:46.358 --> 00:31:49.338 effort there to, to increase demand response, to address 00:31:49.348 --> 00:31:51.689 these issues. And then we also talked about one of 00:31:51.699 --> 00:31:54.170 the options you all laid out was around shadow pricing 00:31:54.180 --> 00:31:58.640 for the IROL. I think, you know, that's a short term gain 00:31:58.650 --> 00:32:02.039 we can get if we look at those two items. But happy 00:32:02.049 --> 00:32:06.108 to hear from, from the dais. I, I reached out to 00:32:06.118 --> 00:32:09.578 Woody on this. With uh I had seen a technology in I 00:32:09.588 --> 00:32:14.789 think Forbes or Fortune magazine about uh uh a uh technology 00:32:14.799 --> 00:32:17.328 that could be put on the system uh to better utilize 00:32:17.338 --> 00:32:19.818 capacity. Um I had not seen this one before, although 00:32:19.828 --> 00:32:22.989 there are a lot of them. He assured me that they were 00:32:23.000 --> 00:32:25.489 looking at all of the technologies that were potentially 00:32:25.500 --> 00:32:28.539 available to work with CPS. To see how they could minimize 00:32:28.549 --> 00:32:32.838 this, this constraint, you know, while ensuring reliability. 00:32:32.848 --> 00:32:35.588 I think that's, this is a good example of something 00:32:35.598 --> 00:32:39.608 that there may be a logical advancement that can be 00:32:39.618 --> 00:32:46.400 a short term solution. That will minimize huge congestion 00:32:46.410 --> 00:32:51.568 costs. And that looks at that and works with CPS I 00:32:51.578 --> 00:32:54.199 think that would be really, really good so. 00:32:56.189 --> 00:33:00.430 You know, I think we need to take steps to mitigate 00:33:00.439 --> 00:33:03.828 the risk in South Texas. With whatever short term 00:33:03.838 --> 00:33:06.838 measures are available to us right now. And I know 00:33:06.848 --> 00:33:09.348 ERCOT generally referred to the ones you mentioned 00:33:09.358 --> 00:33:12.789 in their last filing, Chairman Gleeson. Which is um 00:33:12.799 --> 00:33:15.368 trying to look at more demand response solutions in 00:33:15.380 --> 00:33:19.039 the interim. And um ERCOTs gone through a process 00:33:19.049 --> 00:33:22.509 of, of um sort of putting out an RFP on demand response 00:33:22.519 --> 00:33:26.479 resources recently. And I think they feel like they 00:33:26.489 --> 00:33:29.358 have gotten information, received information from 00:33:29.368 --> 00:33:31.930 interested stakeholders. That leads in them, believe 00:33:31.939 --> 00:33:35.390 that there's a potential for demand response resources 00:33:35.400 --> 00:33:38.549 out there to participate in sort of the short term 00:33:38.559 --> 00:33:43.009 measure. And um on this limited purpose or limited focus 00:33:43.019 --> 00:33:46.779 uh type of effort for demand response for a very important 00:33:46.880 --> 00:33:50.910 um uh matter in South Texas. That we need to take um 00:33:50.939 --> 00:33:54.769 you know, diligent action to address. Until the CPS 00:33:54.779 --> 00:33:58.239 Energy project is up and running. I, I am in agreement 00:33:58.250 --> 00:34:02.088 with um you know, looking at demand response solutions. 00:34:02.098 --> 00:34:06.170 And if that's through, you know, an RFP measure um 00:34:06.180 --> 00:34:10.909 that ERCOT Staff um and our PUC Staff can work together 00:34:11.228 --> 00:34:13.639 um on an expedited fashion. To see what we can get for 00:34:13.648 --> 00:34:17.418 this Summer. And um obviously, you know, coming back 00:34:17.429 --> 00:34:19.239 to us to make sure we're good with the megawatts and 00:34:19.250 --> 00:34:23.050 the money. That would be spent on such an RFP would 00:34:23.059 --> 00:34:28.429 be a good idea. Um, the shadow pricing and IROL 00:34:28.510 --> 00:34:32.099 I'm not as familiar with. And, and would have to 00:34:32.110 --> 00:34:35.739 understand that a little bit more. But um, certainly 00:34:35.750 --> 00:34:39.679 I think the DR search um, would be a good prudent 00:34:39.688 --> 00:34:40.340 action to take. 00:34:42.090 --> 00:34:46.769 Yeah, so perhaps maybe work with PUC Staff. And kind of 00:34:46.780 --> 00:34:50.869 flesh out, you know, how these these different options 00:34:51.199 --> 00:34:53.820 would work. How they would help mitigate kind of our 00:34:53.829 --> 00:34:56.349 short term issue as, as you know, we're building more 00:34:56.360 --> 00:34:58.929 transmission and more localized generation. Different 00:34:58.938 --> 00:35:01.010 areas of the state to, to try to address our short 00:35:01.019 --> 00:35:03.978 term issues. We'll continue to work on the technology 00:35:03.989 --> 00:35:06.269 issues with Commissioner Glotfelty's office and the affected 00:35:06.280 --> 00:35:09.599 utilities. Along with Staff on the mitigation measures 00:35:09.610 --> 00:35:12.530 outlined in the memo from the last open meeting and 00:35:12.539 --> 00:35:15.030 possibly bring an update on the 25th. So I think it's 00:35:15.039 --> 00:35:17.809 important that um ERCOT move forward with what 00:35:17.869 --> 00:35:20.688 you've just been kind of directed to do. But also just 00:35:20.699 --> 00:35:22.898 wanted to mention that we'd be interested in, in any 00:35:22.909 --> 00:35:26.769 broader um demand response solutions as well. To just 00:35:27.050 --> 00:35:29.728 throw that out there. So everybody's thinking, I know 00:35:29.739 --> 00:35:32.119 we've scheduled some time with your new energy efficiency 00:35:32.128 --> 00:35:35.489 director. To work on potential solutions and options 00:35:35.500 --> 00:35:38.110 for landing demand response through that program. I'm 00:35:38.168 --> 00:35:41.478 looking forward to that. And then also um we had talked 00:35:41.489 --> 00:35:45.070 about generation citing hub steps that our ERCOT can 00:35:45.079 --> 00:35:48.809 take to sort of signal. Um How so maybe potential storage 00:35:48.820 --> 00:35:51.938 resources could be used to mitigate their risk in South 00:35:51.949 --> 00:35:54.989 Texas along the scene from San Antonio to Dallas. Where 00:35:55.000 --> 00:35:58.429 all that demand is right, just north of the South Texas 00:35:59.199 --> 00:36:03.489 um constraint. So I would ask that ERCOT continue to look 00:36:03.500 --> 00:36:06.860 at those measures. Generation citing, you know, type 00:36:06.869 --> 00:36:10.039 of efforts to try to signal to resources that can come 00:36:10.050 --> 00:36:15.360 online quickly to um locate along that scene. We can 00:36:15.369 --> 00:36:19.898 bring an update back on my 25th. Perfect. Thanks, Rebecca. 00:36:19.909 --> 00:36:20.329 Thank you. 00:36:22.978 --> 00:36:27.050 Okay. (item:29:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55718) Next up is Project number 55718, reliability plan 00:36:27.059 --> 00:36:31.188 for Permian Basin under PURA 39.167. 00:36:35.750 --> 00:36:37.958 Commissioner Cobos? Yes. Thank you, Chairman Gleeson. So I've asked Kristi 00:36:37.969 --> 00:36:41.789 Hobbs to be here today to provide an overview of the 00:36:41.800 --> 00:36:44.320 filing that are made for the month of April. Because 00:36:44.329 --> 00:36:48.550 I think it contains a lot of more detailed updated 00:36:48.559 --> 00:36:51.550 information that is helpful for all of us to understand 00:36:51.559 --> 00:36:53.978 and, and discuss. As we continue to move forward with 00:36:53.989 --> 00:36:56.989 developing the reliability plan for the Permian Basin. All right. 00:36:57.010 --> 00:36:59.769 Good morning Chairman, Commissioners. (item:29:ERCOT's Kristi Hobbs with updates in the past month) Kristi Hobbs 00:36:59.780 --> 00:37:04.188 for ERCOT. So since our last update uh that we provided 00:37:04.199 --> 00:37:08.438 to you what's changed them in, in the past month. We 00:37:08.449 --> 00:37:13.418 began work on refining uh the numbers based off of 00:37:13.429 --> 00:37:16.619 updated data that we received from the TSPs. So the 00:37:16.628 --> 00:37:19.469 previous uh update I provided you all we talked about 00:37:19.478 --> 00:37:22.869 there was a large amount of unconfirmed additional 00:37:22.878 --> 00:37:27.550 load in the region. The TSPs have since provided updates 00:37:27.559 --> 00:37:31.829 of what load was confirmed in the region. For example 00:37:31.878 --> 00:37:34.449 in the update that we provided in the, the January 00:37:34.458 --> 00:37:39.360 February time frame, 56% of the additional load was 00:37:39.369 --> 00:37:44.769 unconfirmed. That is now only 8%. So that represents 00:37:44.780 --> 00:37:48.889 you know, less than 1000 megawatts in the region that 00:37:48.898 --> 00:37:52.478 is is unconfirmed load. Because of that, we had originally 00:37:52.489 --> 00:37:55.409 uh suggested that we would look at the coming to you 00:37:55.418 --> 00:37:59.159 with a plan in two phases with confirmed and unconfirmed 00:37:59.168 --> 00:38:02.519 load. Since that number of unconfirmed load now is 00:38:02.530 --> 00:38:05.300 so small compared to the total load in the region. 00:38:05.599 --> 00:38:08.739 We are now looking at it as one reliability plan for 00:38:08.750 --> 00:38:09.300 the region. 00:38:11.938 --> 00:38:14.909 The team has been working to perform the reliability 00:38:14.918 --> 00:38:19.878 needs analysis um for local projects in the region. 00:38:19.929 --> 00:38:22.610 Just some quick stats for you of what we're seeing 00:38:22.619 --> 00:38:25.199 in our initial study results. We're seeing the need 00:38:25.208 --> 00:38:27.780 for substantial amounts of transmission within the 00:38:27.789 --> 00:38:33.199 region to meet the 24,000 megawatts of load that is 00:38:33.208 --> 00:38:38.050 forecast to be added. We're right now estimating about 00:38:38.059 --> 00:38:42.550 565 miles of new 345 lines just within the region. 00:38:43.969 --> 00:38:51.590 8 new 345 Substations, 326 miles of updates to 00:38:51.599 --> 00:38:57.510 existing 345. As well as 344 miles of 138 KV. And that's 00:38:57.519 --> 00:39:00.679 just within the region. The team is now looking at 00:39:00.688 --> 00:39:05.559 the needs that would be, uh needed for a plan to be 00:39:05.570 --> 00:39:09.309 able to get generation moved across the state into 00:39:09.320 --> 00:39:12.208 the region. Because there is not a lot of generation 00:39:12.219 --> 00:39:15.760 within the Permian Basin region to serve all the additional 00:39:15.769 --> 00:39:17.250 load that is being forecasted. 00:39:18.769 --> 00:39:24.099 We will continue looking at revising the plan for the 00:39:24.110 --> 00:39:26.579 local region as well as coming to you with the stats 00:39:26.590 --> 00:39:29.320 for what is going to be needed for imports across the 00:39:29.329 --> 00:39:30.789 state into the region. 00:39:33.329 --> 00:39:39.728 Kristi, so with respect to the confirm by letter. 00:39:39.739 --> 00:39:44.418 Well, actually to the non oil and gas confirm load. 00:39:45.478 --> 00:39:48.188 Have you all broken down like what that's comprised 00:39:48.199 --> 00:39:51.619 of primarily that 13,000 of non oil and gas additional 00:39:51.628 --> 00:39:56.550 load? Yes. So for um the approximately the just under 00:39:56.559 --> 00:39:59.699 12,000 megawatts of additional non oil and gas load 00:39:59.708 --> 00:40:06.059 in the region. 8% of that is data center load, 12% 00:40:06.168 --> 00:40:12.250 is commercial industrial load. 58% is crypto data mining 00:40:12.260 --> 00:40:15.250 load and 22% green hydrogen. 00:40:17.570 --> 00:40:20.139 About how many megawatts does that represent in crypto? 00:40:22.269 --> 00:40:27.449 So 58%. So probably just over 6000. 00:40:30.469 --> 00:40:36.000 And the hydrogen facility? It's 22%. So I would 00:40:36.010 --> 00:40:39.510 just estimate just over 2000 megawatts. 00:40:43.090 --> 00:40:44.250 Okay. So 00:40:46.978 --> 00:40:50.070 there's a lot there. We're gonna continue to move 00:40:50.079 --> 00:40:52.719 forward with ERCOT will continue to move forward with 00:40:52.728 --> 00:40:56.708 um developing the reliability plan. But what we're 00:40:56.719 --> 00:41:00.429 doing here with respect to the Permian Basin region 00:41:00.438 --> 00:41:03.789 alone. Is just one example of what we're going to continue 00:41:03.800 --> 00:41:07.128 to see throughout the rest of the state. As we look 00:41:07.139 --> 00:41:10.119 to look at reliability plans that other utilities turn 00:41:10.128 --> 00:41:18.599 in um be a House Bill 5066. And the new um ability 00:41:18.610 --> 00:41:21.719 for the TSPs to submit reasonable load forecast data. 00:41:22.539 --> 00:41:26.800 And so I, I think it's really important um that the 00:41:26.809 --> 00:41:31.159 Staff um Connie. That we move forward um in prioritizing 00:41:31.168 --> 00:41:34.989 the implementation of House Bill 5066, as soon as possible. 00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:42.639 So that um the Commission has the ability to um develop 00:41:42.688 --> 00:41:46.039 policy criteria to look at the reasonableness of the 00:41:46.090 --> 00:41:50.128 um TSP low data. As we look to ensure that the infrastructure 00:41:50.139 --> 00:41:54.019 is built out um to meet the rising demand. That 00:41:54.030 --> 00:41:56.550 is necessitated by population, economic growth throughout 00:41:56.559 --> 00:41:59.539 the state. But at the same time that we're being diligent 00:41:59.550 --> 00:42:03.128 stewards of the consumer cost that is gonna also be 00:42:03.300 --> 00:42:07.269 um part of this entire deliberation. So I think it's 00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:09.619 important that we get that rule done as soon as possible. 00:42:09.628 --> 00:42:11.679 In parallel with the Permian Basin reliability 00:42:11.688 --> 00:42:15.090 plan. Yes, ma'am. We'll, we'll move that up on the 00:42:15.099 --> 00:42:15.688 priority. 00:42:18.309 --> 00:42:22.179 Kristi, I'd like to ask a question. I continue to 00:42:22.188 --> 00:42:28.829 sense that ERCOT and the uh the RPG study things in 00:42:28.840 --> 00:42:33.340 silos. So they'll study the Permian Basin and then 00:42:33.349 --> 00:42:36.030 they'll study an import, export out of West Texas. And 00:42:36.039 --> 00:42:38.438 then they'll study synchronous condensers. And there's 00:42:38.449 --> 00:42:41.168 not an effort to study them altogether as to what they 00:42:41.179 --> 00:42:43.699 would do to the system. Can you just take that back 00:42:43.708 --> 00:42:45.688 and see if that's something that we can get done? I 00:42:45.699 --> 00:42:51.059 think this will have an impact on inverters resources 00:42:51.070 --> 00:42:55.090 out there. Uh It will have the uh a uh an impact 00:42:55.099 --> 00:42:59.179 on what we can import to that area and export out of 00:42:59.188 --> 00:43:01.679 that area. And I just think we need to have a better 00:43:01.688 --> 00:43:05.378 picture. Uh Generally speaking with all of those things 00:43:05.389 --> 00:43:10.000 modeled together. So we continue um you know, evolving 00:43:10.010 --> 00:43:13.769 the transmission planning process at ERCOT is one of 00:43:13.780 --> 00:43:17.219 our, our key goals. We recognize the tremendous 00:43:17.228 --> 00:43:21.360 load growth on the system. We also recognize that the 00:43:21.369 --> 00:43:23.918 types of resources that are being out of the system 00:43:24.199 --> 00:43:27.179 um are not the traditional resources that we once planned 00:43:27.188 --> 00:43:31.320 for. Um the third leg of that stool though is the transmission 00:43:31.329 --> 00:43:34.110 planning process which takes a little bit longer. 00:43:34.119 --> 00:43:36.500 Because it takes time to put the steel on the ground. 00:43:36.969 --> 00:43:39.969 So we are looking at ways that we can continue to 00:43:39.978 --> 00:43:43.260 evolve the process. To, to meet the needs for the 00:43:43.269 --> 00:43:44.309 fast growing state. 00:43:46.699 --> 00:43:49.059 And along with that transmission infrastructure that 00:43:49.070 --> 00:43:51.628 will be built out with House Bill 5066. We're gonna 00:43:51.639 --> 00:43:53.628 have to have the power generation to move around too. 00:43:53.639 --> 00:43:57.239 So, um we gotta have to look at this from a macro 00:43:57.250 --> 00:44:01.019 level. And to Commissioner Glotfelty's point, I know ERCOT 00:44:01.030 --> 00:44:04.699 looking a variety of things like 765 KV. Through 00:44:04.708 --> 00:44:07.840 a study. And so, I mean, we gotta make sure all of 00:44:07.849 --> 00:44:10.519 this is syncing up in some form or fashion. Because 00:44:10.530 --> 00:44:12.389 if we're gonna sort of, you know, build a bunch of 00:44:12.398 --> 00:44:16.579 infrastructure in West Texas to serve 26 gigs. And then 00:44:16.590 --> 00:44:20.418 that's all 345 KV. I mean, my understanding and I'm 00:44:20.429 --> 00:44:24.099 not an engineer, maybe Jimmy knows. Or maybe my professionally 00:44:24.110 --> 00:44:26.789 licensed engineer over here to the left knows. But 00:44:26.800 --> 00:44:31.579 um you can't just go from 765 and jump on to the 00:44:31.590 --> 00:44:34.079 broader system. That's a much lower voltage that you're 00:44:34.090 --> 00:44:36.809 gonna have to sort of incorporate that throughout the 00:44:36.820 --> 00:44:41.148 system. Because of the step down in, in voltage from 00:44:41.159 --> 00:44:44.760 765 to 345. So there's, there's implications. I don't 00:44:44.769 --> 00:44:47.570 think you just go overlay 765 on top of the system. 00:44:47.579 --> 00:44:49.530 You're gonna have to make a bunch of changes to accommodate 00:44:49.539 --> 00:44:53.628 765 as well. If ultimately ERCOT moves forward based 00:44:53.639 --> 00:44:55.449 on their study and the Commission and everybody's fine 00:44:55.458 --> 00:44:59.224 with that. Right. As you, you highlighted. We've begun 00:44:59.235 --> 00:45:04.063 a study for 765. A step up and looking at what the 00:45:04.074 --> 00:45:07.043 back bone would be needed for the state. And we've just 00:45:07.054 --> 00:45:09.804 begun that analysis and we'll soon soon be sharing 00:45:09.813 --> 00:45:12.583 that and bringing it in to the stakeholders. For um 00:45:12.594 --> 00:45:15.375 getting their input and review. Um We're moving on 00:45:15.385 --> 00:45:18.083 a fast timeline because we recognize as we see the 00:45:18.094 --> 00:45:21.253 Permian Basin load. As we've seen what we've uh received 00:45:21.264 --> 00:45:24.074 in load forecast as we do our annual regional transmission 00:45:24.083 --> 00:45:27.050 plan. Again like I said, we can't keep planning uh 00:45:27.070 --> 00:45:30.708 the way we have been planning historically. And so 00:45:30.719 --> 00:45:33.550 we want to be able to bring to you options later this 00:45:33.559 --> 00:45:37.228 Summer. Um So that you can look at the cost benefit 00:45:37.239 --> 00:45:41.030 if we, you know, continue to stay uh using the traditional 00:45:41.039 --> 00:45:44.590 methods that we have with the 345 system. And then 00:45:44.599 --> 00:45:47.789 an overlay of what that same plan would look like. 00:45:48.398 --> 00:45:50.949 What we expect to see is there are gonna be some lines 00:45:50.958 --> 00:45:53.570 that are not gonna be needed if we decide to make that 00:45:53.579 --> 00:45:56.309 decision. And so given that we're at this juncture 00:45:56.320 --> 00:45:58.489 where we're seeing the incredible low growth in the 00:45:58.500 --> 00:46:02.168 state. Um It's time to, to, to make that policy call 00:46:02.179 --> 00:46:06.599 on how we move forward. And against balancing reliability 00:46:06.668 --> 00:46:10.949 with affordability. Because we, we have to make sure 00:46:10.958 --> 00:46:13.668 that we're also taking affordability into consideration. 00:46:13.679 --> 00:46:16.110 As we build this massive amount of transmission infrastructure. 00:46:16.648 --> 00:46:22.719 And so, um um thank you for that. I think, um you 00:46:22.728 --> 00:46:26.349 know, nationally speaking. There's a lot of discussions 00:46:26.360 --> 00:46:29.090 going on with these larger loads that are coming on 00:46:29.099 --> 00:46:32.418 to the system. Like data centers that are being operated 00:46:32.429 --> 00:46:34.719 by artificial intelligence. So we're not alone here 00:46:34.728 --> 00:46:37.648 in Texas on that front or even on the crypto mining 00:46:37.659 --> 00:46:40.269 front. We just have a lot more of that interest here 00:46:40.280 --> 00:46:42.590 for a lot of good reasons. Because we're a good market 00:46:42.599 --> 00:46:45.469 and we're a great state that have private businesses. But 00:46:45.478 --> 00:46:49.958 we have to maintain um our vigilance and making sure 00:46:49.969 --> 00:46:53.199 we're balancing everything out. And so thank you for 00:46:53.208 --> 00:46:55.599 this update. I think it's just not just about the Permian. 00:46:55.610 --> 00:47:00.769 This is just, you know, one example of a very important 00:47:00.780 --> 00:47:03.208 initiative we're working on. But ultimately, what we 00:47:03.219 --> 00:47:07.418 do here um will be sort of the adhoc version of 00:47:07.429 --> 00:47:10.418 what we kind of maybe take lessons learned to apply 00:47:10.429 --> 00:47:14.039 for the rest of the state. But at the same time, it's 00:47:14.050 --> 00:47:16.219 really important that we get a process in place over 00:47:16.228 --> 00:47:19.280 here. For reviewing those reliability plans that come 00:47:19.289 --> 00:47:22.989 to us. And I think they'll come to us quickly um via 00:47:23.000 --> 00:47:25.260 House Bill 5066 and that implementation. 00:47:26.840 --> 00:47:29.090 Commissioner Glotfelty I, I can't remember. Do you 00:47:29.099 --> 00:47:32.989 do you have feelings about high voltage lines or what 00:47:33.000 --> 00:47:38.219 what are your thoughts? So, thank you sir. So to answer 00:47:38.228 --> 00:47:42.320 your question. You can go from a 765 to a 345. It's 00:47:42.329 --> 00:47:45.019 just a larger transformer that you need. You don't 00:47:45.030 --> 00:47:50.349 need to step down to a 500 then a 345. 765 system 00:47:50.369 --> 00:47:52.309 there will be under builds that are going to have to 00:47:52.320 --> 00:47:55.250 happen. So you're going to have to upgrade many of 00:47:55.260 --> 00:47:59.228 the 138 and 230 lines. And we won't know that until 00:47:59.239 --> 00:48:04.369 they run the, the transmission model. Um very different 00:48:04.378 --> 00:48:07.010 If you do HVDC. You don't have to do under 00:48:07.019 --> 00:48:11.958 builds. Because much of that will be um well, it's converted 00:48:11.969 --> 00:48:15.179 and only the amount that you need um coming out of 00:48:15.188 --> 00:48:17.708 the HVDC converter station. So there are pros and 00:48:17.719 --> 00:48:20.090 cons to both. I know you all originally looked at an 00:48:20.099 --> 00:48:23.148 HVDC line from the West. Um I'd encourage you to keep 00:48:23.159 --> 00:48:26.519 looking at that. I know that's no surprise. It was 00:48:26.530 --> 00:48:30.590 also considered as a uh HVDC solution when we originally 00:48:30.599 --> 00:48:34.159 built the CRS lines. One that I think many might go 00:48:34.168 --> 00:48:38.148 back and, and uh wish that we had looked at a little 00:48:38.159 --> 00:48:42.228 harder. Um But um I, I think that you all are doing 00:48:42.239 --> 00:48:45.949 the right thing looking at higher voltages really to 00:48:45.958 --> 00:48:46.789 plan for the future. 00:48:48.438 --> 00:48:51.119 So in my mind, kind of what we talked about is management 00:48:51.128 --> 00:48:53.599 of change. Which is one of the things that I think 00:48:53.610 --> 00:48:57.579 Texas has done historically very well. And driven by 00:48:57.590 --> 00:49:01.378 recognizing the benefits that need to be um provided 00:49:01.389 --> 00:49:03.699 for the system as a whole. And so making sure that 00:49:03.708 --> 00:49:06.168 we incorporate all the things that, that you mentioned 00:49:06.179 --> 00:49:10.179 that are going on collectively at the same time. And 00:49:10.478 --> 00:49:13.179 then also kind of recognizing that the first thing 00:49:13.188 --> 00:49:16.659 is to kind of identify the issue or the opportunity 00:49:16.668 --> 00:49:21.918 or the problem. And then to, to use data and information 00:49:21.929 --> 00:49:25.128 in order to, to formulate your plan going forward. 00:49:25.139 --> 00:49:27.688 And I think that was, you know, one of the points that 00:49:27.699 --> 00:49:31.159 you made early on. Was um you know, now that we have 00:49:31.168 --> 00:49:34.418 a different mechanism for transmission planning. Beyond 00:49:34.429 --> 00:49:37.128 just the signed service agreement, we may need a little 00:49:37.139 --> 00:49:40.208 bit more granularity in terms of going in. And using 00:49:40.219 --> 00:49:43.260 some different indicators to determine what is uh which 00:49:43.269 --> 00:49:46.958 is reasonable going forward. But um I'm, I'm really 00:49:46.969 --> 00:49:50.179 excited that we're, we're taking a look at this again 00:49:50.188 --> 00:49:53.478 from a broader standpoint. As you know, we need 00:49:53.489 --> 00:49:56.329 more generation in Texas. Um and we're dispatchable 00:49:56.340 --> 00:49:59.668 generation in Texas to enhance your liability. And 00:49:59.679 --> 00:50:02.510 we absolutely have to have the transmission to go 00:50:02.519 --> 00:50:05.628 along with it. So that, you know, hopefully in the future 00:50:05.769 --> 00:50:08.269 you know, the answer is I want to come, if the answer 00:50:08.280 --> 00:50:10.809 the question is, do I want to come to Texas? The answer 00:50:10.820 --> 00:50:15.878 is always we can accommodate you. If, if you allow 00:50:15.889 --> 00:50:18.429 me, I'd like to say one other thing. And that is with 00:50:18.438 --> 00:50:21.628 regard to generation in the Permian Basin. I came back 00:50:21.639 --> 00:50:26.079 from meetings yesterday and the day before with the 00:50:26.090 --> 00:50:29.668 Nuclear Regulatory Commission. And at least 11 of the 00:50:29.679 --> 00:50:33.269 largest oil and gas companies in the Permian Basin 00:50:33.519 --> 00:50:36.139 that are looking at project are looking at small modular 00:50:36.148 --> 00:50:39.929 reactor projects. Another company in the Permian Basin 00:50:39.938 --> 00:50:44.579 has signed an agreement to look at PPA terms and conditions 00:50:45.309 --> 00:50:48.458 on a small modular reactor for them. So these things 00:50:48.469 --> 00:50:51.583 are happening in this nuclear space and it's pretty 00:50:51.594 --> 00:50:54.063 exciting to see the biggest companies in the world. 00:50:54.224 --> 00:50:57.844 Are kind of taking their trying to find the solutions 00:50:57.994 --> 00:51:01.184 to their problems. And I think we're going to see a 00:51:01.195 --> 00:51:03.945 lot of generation built out there in time. 00:51:05.929 --> 00:51:08.340 Kristi, I know y'all are doing a ton of work. Appreciate 00:51:08.349 --> 00:51:09.989 you and your team over at ERCOT. Thanks. 00:51:11.909 --> 00:51:18.500 One Kristi, um what um your son came in, what position 00:51:18.510 --> 00:51:21.070 at the Houston Livestock Show and Rodeo, and the steer? 00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:25.349 He had the Reserve Champion. Oh, Reserve Champion. Reserve Champion, y'all. 00:51:30.079 --> 00:51:33.878 Oh wow. That's big time. Kristi, you should lead with that 00:51:33.889 --> 00:51:34.539 information. 00:51:36.139 --> 00:51:36.159 Yeah. 00:51:38.449 --> 00:51:42.760 All right. (item:30:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55812) Next up is Item 30. Project 55812, Texas 00:51:42.769 --> 00:51:46.619 Energy Fund Completion Bonus Grant Program. Staff, if 00:51:46.628 --> 00:51:47.438 y'all wanna come up 00:51:53.039 --> 00:51:54.978 David, if you want to just kind of lay out the, the 00:51:54.989 --> 00:51:58.438 PFA. And then um we'll probably have some questions 00:51:58.449 --> 00:51:58.780 for y'all. 00:52:00.539 --> 00:52:02.938 Great. Thank you, Chairman Gleeson and Good morning 00:52:02.949 --> 00:52:06.809 Commissioners. (item:30:Commisson Staff's David Gordon on recommended adoption order for TX Energy Fund Completion Bonus Grant Rule) This is Commission Staff's recommended 00:52:06.820 --> 00:52:09.949 adoption order for the Texas Energy Fund Completion 00:52:09.958 --> 00:52:13.188 Bonus Grant Rule. Before jumping into the mechanics 00:52:13.199 --> 00:52:15.550 I want to give thanks to a few people who worked on 00:52:15.559 --> 00:52:18.688 this. Uh this was another big group effort from the 00:52:18.699 --> 00:52:21.500 rules and projects team. I'm sure David Smeltzer is 00:52:21.510 --> 00:52:23.539 happy to know that half of his people now report to 00:52:23.550 --> 00:52:27.489 Alison Fink. It's just been a huge credit to this rule. 00:52:27.918 --> 00:52:31.329 Um Also Tyler Nicholson and Chris Brown to my right. 00:52:31.639 --> 00:52:34.530 Worked so much on the performance components of 00:52:34.539 --> 00:52:36.938 this rule and uh they deserve a lot of credit there. 00:52:37.699 --> 00:52:41.469 And then finally, um our partners at ERCOT were immensely 00:52:41.478 --> 00:52:44.539 helpful in this and uh did a great job responding to 00:52:44.550 --> 00:52:47.590 our inquiries about the rule. And I'd also want 00:52:47.599 --> 00:52:50.958 to thank um our partners at the at Deloitte who helped 00:52:50.969 --> 00:52:54.719 a lot with making this uh into the shape that it's 00:52:54.728 --> 00:52:59.050 in today. The main operation of this rule is very 00:52:59.059 --> 00:53:02.769 similar to how we proposed it in November. Applicants 00:53:02.780 --> 00:53:06.099 will submit an application for eligibility. Those who 00:53:06.110 --> 00:53:09.750 are approved can then seek to obtain a completion bonus 00:53:09.760 --> 00:53:13.539 grant payment for 10 successive years. Um The main 00:53:13.550 --> 00:53:16.340 area where this rule has changed is in the performance 00:53:16.349 --> 00:53:20.228 performance metrics. We now have two components. 00:53:20.239 --> 00:53:23.418 One is the performance reliability factor which will 00:53:23.429 --> 00:53:27.139 measure the actual real time performance of each of 00:53:27.148 --> 00:53:29.989 these units during those 100 most constrained hours. 00:53:30.269 --> 00:53:34.090 And then we also have included an availability reliability 00:53:34.099 --> 00:53:38.579 factor. Which will measure um availability of the 00:53:38.590 --> 00:53:42.099 of the units uh during those hours. And that can be 00:53:42.110 --> 00:53:45.010 a potential discount. I'll, I'll leave Chris Brown to 00:53:45.099 --> 00:53:47.429 discuss this in more detail later. But those are the 00:53:47.438 --> 00:53:50.898 big changes. And then those measures are compared to 00:53:50.909 --> 00:53:54.989 a sample group of um a representative sample of similar 00:53:55.000 --> 00:53:59.208 technologies that would be selected by ERCOT um for 00:53:59.219 --> 00:54:04.280 resources that were commissioned after 2004. Um A big 00:54:04.289 --> 00:54:07.769 noteworthy item in this rule is that we understood 00:54:07.780 --> 00:54:10.918 the Commission's direction at the March 21st open meeting. 00:54:11.139 --> 00:54:15.429 Switchable units that can operate in more than one ISO 00:54:15.539 --> 00:54:19.059 are eligible to participate in this program. But they 00:54:19.070 --> 00:54:21.320 would be subject to the same performance standards 00:54:21.329 --> 00:54:25.458 as any other ERCOT generation resource that's in 00:54:25.469 --> 00:54:29.289 the program. And then finally, one thing I want 00:54:29.300 --> 00:54:32.260 to mention is that the way we have recommended this 00:54:32.269 --> 00:54:36.250 program. Is that it is allowable for new construction 00:54:36.519 --> 00:54:41.260 but would not consider um upgrades to facilities. And 00:54:41.269 --> 00:54:46.000 the reasoning for that is that um the, the new Legislation 00:54:46.010 --> 00:54:50.579 in Chapter 34 does not use the term upgrade for the 00:54:50.590 --> 00:54:54.898 completion bonus grant program. And that is consistent 00:54:54.909 --> 00:54:57.800 with the position that we took in the in ERCOT loan 00:54:57.809 --> 00:55:02.050 program role. So, with that layout, I'm I'm happy to 00:55:02.059 --> 00:55:04.750 address any questions and we have a good set of the 00:55:04.760 --> 00:55:07.938 team here to, to help. Thank you, David. So yeah, so 00:55:07.949 --> 00:55:11.378 you, you addressed uh briefly two of the items I want 00:55:11.389 --> 00:55:14.228 to discuss. So let's start with the availability reliability 00:55:14.239 --> 00:55:16.728 factor. Can Chris, can you tell us how is that calculated? 00:55:17.519 --> 00:55:21.809 Yes. Chris Brown, Commission Staff. The availability 00:55:21.820 --> 00:55:24.539 reliability factor looks at the proportion of time 00:55:24.550 --> 00:55:27.260 that overlaps with those 100 hours. The resource is 00:55:27.269 --> 00:55:31.659 not in a planned outage, so they're actually available. 00:55:32.128 --> 00:55:36.519 And the reason behind this is that the PRF excludes 00:55:36.530 --> 00:55:38.378 intervals of planned outage. We don't want to ding 00:55:38.389 --> 00:55:41.610 resources for being in maintenance. Uh but we want 00:55:41.619 --> 00:55:45.898 to incentivize resources to be available. Um So we 00:55:45.909 --> 00:55:49.659 think this serves two kind of important purposes. Without 00:55:49.668 --> 00:55:53.369 this factor, it's theoretically possible resource could 00:55:53.378 --> 00:55:56.559 be available for a very small subset of hours, achieve 00:55:56.570 --> 00:55:58.860 high performance in those hours and get a payment. 00:55:59.300 --> 00:56:02.429 Um So this seems undesirable. So we want to have availability 00:56:02.438 --> 00:56:06.559 taken into consideration as well. Uh It also serves 00:56:06.570 --> 00:56:10.139 as a kind of an equity consideration. So two resources 00:56:10.148 --> 00:56:13.969 achieving the same performance in the PRF may have 00:56:13.978 --> 00:56:17.329 different ARFs. And so this discount would reward the 00:56:17.340 --> 00:56:21.579 resource that's more available. Um So I think that's 00:56:21.590 --> 00:56:25.708 the main mechanism for that. So let's run through an 00:56:25.719 --> 00:56:28.719 example real quick. So say I had a resource and we 00:56:28.800 --> 00:56:34.360 say we removed the A R metric. If a resource was available 00:56:34.369 --> 00:56:38.188 for say five hours of the 100 hours, what percent of 00:56:38.199 --> 00:56:41.829 the bonus would they get? So it would depend on their 00:56:41.840 --> 00:56:44.438 pr score but saying they got a perfect pr F score in 00:56:44.449 --> 00:56:46.510 those five hours, they could get their full payment 00:56:46.519 --> 00:56:48.820 without taking the A F into consideration. 00:56:52.869 --> 00:56:55.110 Do you have any thoughts on, on this issue? 00:56:59.800 --> 00:57:03.168 Say that again, what you just said, I didn't quite 00:57:03.179 --> 00:57:05.989 follow the example that you let out. So I believe the 00:57:06.000 --> 00:57:10.159 example was a resource that's in a planned outage 95 00:57:10.168 --> 00:57:13.628 of the tightest hours and available in five if they 00:57:13.639 --> 00:57:17.329 perform perfectly during those five hours without the 00:57:17.340 --> 00:57:20.329 ARF discount factor that we've added. Now, they would 00:57:20.340 --> 00:57:22.610 get their full grant payment despite the fact that 00:57:22.619 --> 00:57:25.579 they're only really available during five, this very 00:57:25.590 --> 00:57:29.110 small subset of hours because they have been in an 00:57:29.119 --> 00:57:33.438 approved outage and the other approved outage. Yes 00:57:33.449 --> 00:57:37.389 and the other 95. So can you can you talk to the 00:57:37.398 --> 00:57:40.969 magnitude of the of the two factors in terms of which 00:57:40.978 --> 00:57:45.530 one kind of controls. More overall the actual payment 00:57:45.728 --> 00:57:51.610 and what contribution would be um would the other factor 00:57:51.619 --> 00:57:57.530 have in terms of a discount? Yes. So let's say that 00:57:57.539 --> 00:58:01.478 the PRF is the primary determinant of assessing performance. 00:58:01.820 --> 00:58:05.289 So based on statute, they have to achieve a median 00:58:05.300 --> 00:58:08.000 surpassed median performance of the 50th percentile 00:58:08.010 --> 00:58:11.478 of the comparison group to receive any payment. And 00:58:11.489 --> 00:58:13.750 then the amount that they're eligible for scales up 00:58:13.760 --> 00:58:17.590 as their performance improves. And then the ARF is 00:58:17.599 --> 00:58:21.110 a discount on whatever amount they're eligible for. 00:58:22.099 --> 00:58:25.409 But it has a very minimal impact at the beginning. 00:58:25.418 --> 00:58:28.699 So missing a few hours in a planned outage wouldn't 00:58:28.840 --> 00:58:32.719 impact their the payment amount they receive very much 00:58:32.728 --> 00:58:36.199 at all. And this is recalculated every year for each 00:58:36.208 --> 00:58:37.989 of the 10 years. Yes. 00:58:41.188 --> 00:58:43.500 So maybe I should have said at the outset, I'm just 00:58:43.510 --> 00:58:45.989 for, for my colleagues up here. I'm gonna request that 00:58:46.000 --> 00:58:48.878 we postpone adopting this till the next open meeting. 00:58:48.889 --> 00:58:50.938 Because just the issues that got brought up to me mostly 00:58:50.949 --> 00:58:53.539 in the last couple of days. Um I wanna talk to staff 00:58:53.550 --> 00:58:55.708 more about it and I want to talk to market participants 00:58:55.719 --> 00:58:59.438 more about to understand. Um So this one's, you 00:58:59.449 --> 00:59:01.289 know, as I'm thinking about, it's tough for me. Because 00:59:01.300 --> 00:59:04.110 I don't, you know, we want companies to take their 00:59:04.119 --> 00:59:07.309 planned outages that they need to. But the purpose 00:59:07.320 --> 00:59:09.289 of a of this completion bonus, it's supposed to be 00:59:09.300 --> 00:59:13.260 a high bar. And um like in the, in the example we 00:59:13.269 --> 00:59:15.789 laid out, I don't know if someone who's in planned 00:59:15.800 --> 00:59:20.389 outage for 95% of the 100 tightest hours should get 00:59:20.398 --> 00:59:23.039 the full bonus. And so I want to think through that 00:59:23.050 --> 00:59:27.090 some more and talk to some folks. About, about how 00:59:27.099 --> 00:59:30.250 they think about that, how that impacts their decision 00:59:30.260 --> 00:59:34.820 to, to invest in these projects. Um It, it's just something 00:59:34.829 --> 00:59:37.030 I need to kind of think over some more and talk to 00:59:37.039 --> 00:59:41.918 folks. I'm in agreement that I'm happy to, to delay 00:59:41.929 --> 00:59:47.449 this. My, my, my question on this is not as much the 00:59:47.769 --> 00:59:52.409 the, the ARF as it is the definition of new facility. 00:59:53.110 --> 00:59:55.090 And I, I say that I brought this up the last two 00:59:55.099 --> 00:59:58.449 open meetings. That flexibility is key in my opinion. 00:59:58.648 --> 01:00:02.989 I think the way it works in reality in life is if 01:00:03.000 --> 01:00:07.659 you have a simple cycle project, project. And 01:00:07.668 --> 01:00:10.958 you want to add another combustion turbine and a steam 01:00:10.969 --> 01:00:13.559 turbine, you're going to do that as an upgrade to an 01:00:13.570 --> 01:00:15.780 existing facility. You're not going to apply for a 01:00:15.789 --> 01:00:19.898 full new interconnection. And under this rules under 01:00:19.909 --> 01:00:22.378 this, it would not be eligible. And I just want us 01:00:22.389 --> 01:00:27.179 to think through that a little bit more. As to way 01:00:27.188 --> 01:00:29.878 the way the real the world really works when you're 01:00:29.889 --> 01:00:31.918 when you're working with facilities like that. So I 01:00:31.929 --> 01:00:34.559 I appreciate this extra time. We'll work on that issue 01:00:34.570 --> 01:00:35.478 as we go forward. 01:00:37.000 --> 01:00:39.679 I, I think that it would be helpful to explore both 01:00:39.688 --> 01:00:42.530 of those issues some more and uh with staff and, and 01:00:42.539 --> 01:00:45.369 market participants that are interested. I, I hear what 01:00:45.378 --> 01:00:47.918 Commissioner Glotfelty is saying with respect to the 01:00:47.929 --> 01:00:52.059 realities of generation development. Um My initial 01:00:52.070 --> 01:00:55.478 thoughts on this right now are that. I would not be 01:00:55.489 --> 01:00:57.739 in favor of giving completion bonuses for up rates 01:00:57.750 --> 01:01:00.699 to existing facilities. My understanding is they probably 01:01:00.708 --> 01:01:03.409 wouldn't be greater than 100 megawatts. Some, some 01:01:03.418 --> 01:01:06.429 up rates are not but aggregating them. And then coming 01:01:06.438 --> 01:01:08.688 in for a completion bonus on an existing facility is 01:01:08.699 --> 01:01:11.239 not something I would be in favor of. Because I, I want 01:01:11.250 --> 01:01:13.719 to make sure we get new megawatts, whether that's, 01:01:13.728 --> 01:01:16.449 you know, new construction, not, you know, squeezing 01:01:16.458 --> 01:01:18.559 more megawatts out of an existing generation plan. 01:01:18.829 --> 01:01:21.449 And to be clear, Commissioner Cobos, when you say upright 01:01:21.458 --> 01:01:24.030 that's distinct from building new generation resources 01:01:24.039 --> 01:01:28.688 that existing facilities? In my mind, an upper grade 01:01:28.699 --> 01:01:33.070 is dropping another CT at a generation facility. An 01:01:33.079 --> 01:01:36.228 upgrade is adding some kind of equipment to squeeze 01:01:36.239 --> 01:01:38.639 out more megawatts out of an existing part. Thank you 01:01:38.659 --> 01:01:41.030 for that. Yeah, I think that's, I think that's the 01:01:41.039 --> 01:01:44.159 appropriate terminology in the industry. If you switch 01:01:44.168 --> 01:01:46.869 out a steam turbine for a new, more efficient one, 01:01:46.878 --> 01:01:49.668 you're upgrading it. You're putting in a new piece 01:01:49.679 --> 01:01:53.050 of equipment just to squeeze out more megawatts from 01:01:53.059 --> 01:01:55.500 the same system. If you're adding a new turbine, if 01:01:55.510 --> 01:01:58.079 you're adding two new turbines. Then you're upgrading 01:01:58.090 --> 01:02:01.369 it and you're building a new facility. And I, and I 01:02:01.378 --> 01:02:03.860 think we're on the same page with that. That, that 01:02:03.869 --> 01:02:08.860 new facilities equal new megawatts upgrades while efficient 01:02:09.469 --> 01:02:12.320 and positive for the market and for that individual 01:02:12.389 --> 01:02:16.320 market participant. We're, we're striving for something 01:02:16.329 --> 01:02:21.188 bigger than that with this program. Exactly. I think 01:02:21.199 --> 01:02:25.199 if we look historically, um throughout Texas and in 01:02:25.208 --> 01:02:29.449 the manufacturing sector. I mean, we started with refineries 01:02:29.458 --> 01:02:34.349 that were built after spindletop blew in and many of 01:02:34.360 --> 01:02:36.898 them are continuing to operate today. And they've done 01:02:36.909 --> 01:02:41.478 that through what they may call an upgrade, which may 01:02:41.489 --> 01:02:44.800 be actually an expansion. It could be something that 01:02:44.809 --> 01:02:47.898 is integral to the facility where they go in and basically 01:02:47.909 --> 01:02:51.349 start with the foundation and you know, the bare bone 01:02:51.360 --> 01:02:54.559 structure. And build out something that is operating 01:02:54.648 --> 01:02:58.019 better than it did before and is meeting the same type 01:02:58.030 --> 01:03:02.739 of performance criteria. That the company would expect 01:03:02.750 --> 01:03:05.309 from that investment. And so I think when they, when 01:03:05.320 --> 01:03:08.300 they think about an upgrade or an expansion. Whether 01:03:08.309 --> 01:03:10.500 it is something internal to the plant or whether it's 01:03:10.510 --> 01:03:14.510 something external in in a field adjacent and is all 01:03:14.519 --> 01:03:18.599 new build. There is a, a very comprehensive evaluation 01:03:18.610 --> 01:03:21.500 that's done in terms of that investment and also the 01:03:21.510 --> 01:03:25.010 reliability of the investment moving forward. And so 01:03:25.019 --> 01:03:27.610 my thought would be and I'm glad we're going to take 01:03:27.619 --> 01:03:29.668 some more time to think about this and get stakeholder 01:03:29.679 --> 01:03:33.360 input. But um you know, we need all the megawatts in 01:03:33.369 --> 01:03:36.039 the grid that we can get and we need them as quickly 01:03:36.050 --> 01:03:39.860 as we can. And um this is this is something that will 01:03:39.869 --> 01:03:43.739 I think incentivize the urgency and something that's 01:03:43.750 --> 01:03:49.010 well worth additional consideration. And um again, 01:03:49.039 --> 01:03:54.050 100 megawatts enhances the reliability of the grid 01:03:54.059 --> 01:03:57.219 and enhances the safety of Texas. So I'm glad we're 01:03:57.228 --> 01:03:59.849 taking this up as well as the looking at the performance 01:03:59.860 --> 01:04:02.489 factor. And I guess my understanding is that these 01:04:02.500 --> 01:04:06.300 these are the only two items that you're um thinking 01:04:06.309 --> 01:04:10.159 will be subject to the discussion. I think potentially 01:04:10.168 --> 01:04:13.289 I have one other question, David. So you talked about 01:04:13.519 --> 01:04:17.849 comparing these facilities to a cohort from 2004. You 01:04:17.860 --> 01:04:21.579 talked through, why did you use 2004 as kind of the 01:04:21.590 --> 01:04:24.989 baseline comparison? Certainly. We wanted to make sure 01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:27.750 that when we looked at a representative sample of similar 01:04:27.760 --> 01:04:30.228 technologies that we had a large enough pool to draw 01:04:30.239 --> 01:04:35.079 on. To make appropriate comparisons, we thought that 01:04:35.090 --> 01:04:37.438 going back to 2004 would give us that large enough 01:04:37.449 --> 01:04:42.659 group. Um And that's the main driver. If we move that 01:04:42.668 --> 01:04:47.789 date into the future, we would restrict the pool of 01:04:47.800 --> 01:04:50.898 similar types of generation resources. And we don't 01:04:50.909 --> 01:04:53.099 want to run into a situation where we can't make a 01:04:53.110 --> 01:04:56.820 meaningful comparison of our units that are in the 01:04:56.829 --> 01:05:00.648 CBG program compared to those in the sample group. 01:05:01.840 --> 01:05:04.688 OK. OK. One other thing that I wanted to say was uh 01:05:04.699 --> 01:05:07.039 I've used this example a few times with folks. And that 01:05:07.050 --> 01:05:11.519 is um I worked for a generator a long time ago and 01:05:11.530 --> 01:05:14.708 we built a plant in the Rio Grande Valley called Magic 01:05:14.719 --> 01:05:21.289 Valley. And we were the very first Siemens 501 H turbine. 01:05:21.300 --> 01:05:23.969 Which was the most efficient turbine that Siemens had 01:05:23.978 --> 01:05:26.489 ever made. And the first one went in in the Rio Grande 01:05:26.500 --> 01:05:30.510 Valley. And the first year of operation was spotty at 01:05:30.519 --> 01:05:36.000 best. Because new equipment, new challenges, things 01:05:36.010 --> 01:05:38.610 like that happen with these electromechanical machines. 01:05:38.619 --> 01:05:44.750 And but since it got righted and fixed, it has run 01:05:44.760 --> 01:05:50.349 ever since. And I don't want to discourage the, the 01:05:50.360 --> 01:05:53.820 newer, efficient, most efficient technologies on our 01:05:53.829 --> 01:05:58.208 system. If they're going to get dinged because of, you 01:05:58.219 --> 01:06:01.878 know, a first year ARF or so. Anyway, I'd just like 01:06:01.889 --> 01:06:03.849 to work with you on that just to make sure that we 01:06:03.860 --> 01:06:07.219 capture that. We want those most efficient technologies 01:06:07.228 --> 01:06:11.519 here. This doesn't happen very often, but, you know 01:06:11.530 --> 01:06:15.829 a billion dollar investment is, is a big deal. Something 01:06:15.840 --> 01:06:18.728 like that would be, it would be sad if they did that 01:06:18.739 --> 01:06:21.300 based upon this. And then something happened with a 01:06:21.309 --> 01:06:25.719 vendor. Anyway, you get my point and I just hope we 01:06:25.728 --> 01:06:28.010 can talk about that a little bit internally. Yeah, 01:06:28.019 --> 01:06:29.719 I know, I definitely get that. And I think, I think 01:06:29.728 --> 01:06:31.938 we need to be cognizant of that again. You know, that 01:06:31.949 --> 01:06:34.050 would just be the first year of the 10 year bonus that 01:06:34.059 --> 01:06:36.809 they could collect. So I think, you know, as I've thought 01:06:36.820 --> 01:06:40.099 about this. I was happy to expand and maybe lower the 01:06:40.110 --> 01:06:42.668 bar a little on the loan program to make sure we got 01:06:42.679 --> 01:06:45.949 them in. I think this, the Legislature, in my view. 01:06:45.958 --> 01:06:48.349 Intended for this to be very aspirational to try to 01:06:48.360 --> 01:06:51.369 meet. And so I, I think we're, we're treading on safe 01:06:51.378 --> 01:06:54.090 ground if we try to make this a little more difficult 01:06:54.099 --> 01:07:00.300 to attain. I do agree with that exception that each 01:07:00.309 --> 01:07:03.739 year is independent of the other. So if you missed 01:07:03.750 --> 01:07:06.219 year one, because of your challenges, you're still 01:07:06.228 --> 01:07:09.418 eligible for years two through two through time. So 01:07:09.510 --> 01:07:12.340 Commissioner Glotfelty, one thing I may add. Is that 01:07:12.349 --> 01:07:15.079 the first test period for which each of these units 01:07:15.090 --> 01:07:18.159 will be measured will begin on June 1st of the year 01:07:18.168 --> 01:07:20.829 that follows their interconnection date. So they will 01:07:20.840 --> 01:07:23.349 have a little bit of workout time between that June 01:07:23.360 --> 01:07:26.168 1st date depending of course, when they come online 01:07:26.530 --> 01:07:27.340 Ok, that's good. 01:07:29.260 --> 01:07:30.079 Anything else? 01:07:31.820 --> 01:07:37.349 Chairman if I, if I may on the types of facilities 01:07:37.360 --> 01:07:41.469 eligible discussion. Because we're using two very 01:07:41.478 --> 01:07:45.750 similar sounding terms. I, I wanna be sure we, we point 01:07:45.760 --> 01:07:50.668 that out and that staff is clear. That you really discuss 01:07:50.679 --> 01:07:54.309 three different types of facilities that is completely 01:07:54.320 --> 01:08:00.458 new construction. An upgrade, which we as a term that 01:08:00.469 --> 01:08:04.369 staff use in their recommended preamble and, and that 01:08:04.530 --> 01:08:11.059 um would be an expansion of an existing facility. For 01:08:11.070 --> 01:08:14.789 example, by adding an additional unit is what I heard 01:08:14.800 --> 01:08:19.689 your conversation to be. As opposed to an up rate, r. a. t. e. 01:08:19.909 --> 01:08:27.579 Meaning you improve the existing facilities or add 01:08:27.588 --> 01:08:30.600 some equipment so that it puts out more megawatts. 01:08:30.609 --> 01:08:34.750 That's correct. Thank you very much. Ok, so then David. 01:08:34.759 --> 01:08:37.009 What I'd ask staff is to kind of follow up with us 01:08:37.020 --> 01:08:39.529 and I would ask this is the the market participants 01:08:39.539 --> 01:08:42.020 and folks in the room that are interested in this. Reach 01:08:42.029 --> 01:08:45.759 out on those limited purposes. Um around the performance 01:08:45.770 --> 01:08:51.659 metrics and um around, you know, the upgrade um up 01:08:51.668 --> 01:08:54.619 rate and new facility. And, and give us your thoughts 01:08:54.628 --> 01:08:56.378 I think those are kind of the the points that I, I 01:08:56.390 --> 01:08:58.939 kind of need more clarity on before I'm comfortable 01:08:58.949 --> 01:09:01.220 moving forward. And I do want to say that the reason 01:09:01.720 --> 01:09:04.939 I'm ok delaying this one meeting and, and definitely 01:09:04.949 --> 01:09:07.060 not longer than that. Is I think our notice of intent 01:09:07.069 --> 01:09:12.220 to apply opens May 1st. So as people are considering 01:09:12.229 --> 01:09:14.850 that for the loan rule, I think we need to have this 01:09:14.859 --> 01:09:17.789 solidified. So, um I'd like to get this done at the 01:09:17.798 --> 01:09:21.079 next open meeting. And Chairman Gleeson to put maybe 01:09:21.088 --> 01:09:25.079 a fine point on that. When you instruct others to comment 01:09:25.088 --> 01:09:28.069 on the performance metrics, what you all are addressing 01:09:28.079 --> 01:09:30.750 is the ARF component. The availability of reliability 01:09:30.759 --> 01:09:32.579 factor. That's correct. You all are comfortable with 01:09:32.588 --> 01:09:35.270 the PRF piece? Yes, great. Thank you. 01:09:38.239 --> 01:09:40.259 All right, thanks y'all. Great work. Thanks very much. 01:09:47.310 --> 01:09:52.779 All right. So I don't have anything until Item No. 01:09:52.789 --> 01:09:53.779 39. 01:10:00.640 --> 01:10:05.229 (item:39:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 55307) Item No. 39 is Project No. 55307. Review of Chapter 01:10:05.239 --> 01:10:08.668 27 rules for administrative services. Um I don't have 01:10:08.680 --> 01:10:11.789 any questions of staff for this. Um I was, I was good 01:10:11.798 --> 01:10:17.640 with this if you are. Hi, Rama. Hi. A real heavy lift. 01:10:17.649 --> 01:10:18.548 Appreciate all the work. Yes. 01:10:20.119 --> 01:10:22.279 All right. (item:39:Motion to approve notice of intent and publication in Texas Register) Then I'd entertain a motion to approve the 01:10:22.289 --> 01:10:25.149 notice of intent to review chapter 27 and the proposal 01:10:25.159 --> 01:10:28.529 for publication of rule amendments to chapter 27 for 01:10:28.539 --> 01:10:30.520 publication in the Texas Register. I 01:10:32.069 --> 01:10:35.659 so move. Second. I have a motion and a second. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Opposed? 01:10:35.890 --> 01:10:37.878 The motion prevails. Thank you Rama. Thank you. 01:10:40.439 --> 01:10:41.750 All right. Wait, wait, wait. 01:10:44.409 --> 01:10:47.869 All right. Go on. Oh no, no. I, I wanted to wait 01:10:47.878 --> 01:10:52.539 for another docket Item No. 41. Ok. Um well, I 01:10:52.548 --> 01:10:55.699 don't have anything on 40, so we'll move to 41. (item:41:Chairman Gleeson lays out Project No. 56335) Item 01:10:55.708 --> 01:10:59.989 No. 41 is Project No. 56335. Agency report to 01:11:00.000 --> 01:11:01.569 the 89th Legislature. 01:11:03.088 --> 01:11:05.338 Commissioner Glotfelty, I think you might have something 01:11:05.350 --> 01:11:08.548 to say. All I wanted to, I brought this up with staff. 01:11:08.560 --> 01:11:10.560 I just wanted to do it in the dias that under the 01:11:10.569 --> 01:11:14.378 emergency issues section. Can we ensure that there 01:11:14.390 --> 01:11:17.720 will be a nuclear power section in there, consistent 01:11:17.729 --> 01:11:20.279 with whatever we come up with the, with the report 01:11:20.289 --> 01:11:24.079 to the Governor? Rama Rastogi for Commission Staff. Yes. Yes 01:11:24.088 --> 01:11:26.560 sir. Thank you. Yeah, I think what might be helpful 01:11:26.569 --> 01:11:29.539 Connie. Is as we're fleshing out what's going to go 01:11:29.548 --> 01:11:33.329 in each item. That in each item on the table context 01:11:33.338 --> 01:11:35.640 maybe any of the issues that Commissioners have brought 01:11:35.649 --> 01:11:38.680 up. Just come by the offices and let us know in which 01:11:38.689 --> 01:11:40.810 sections of the report that will be in. Yeah, we'll 01:11:40.819 --> 01:11:43.899 certainly do that. Thank you. We're going to, we're 01:11:43.909 --> 01:11:46.369 planning to kind of bring a draft version of the report 01:11:46.378 --> 01:11:49.770 in early to for some. Great. Thank you. 01:11:52.180 --> 01:11:53.479 Thank you. Thanks y'all. 01:11:56.168 --> 01:12:02.208 I don't have anything on 42, 43, 44. Actually, let's 01:12:02.220 --> 01:12:06.509 go back. (item:42:Chairman Gleeson opens up item for update from Executive Director or Commission Counsel) Item number 42. Do we have an update from 01:12:06.520 --> 01:12:09.239 Commission Counsel or our Executive Interim Executive 01:12:09.250 --> 01:12:10.489 Director? We do. 01:12:12.708 --> 01:12:16.279 I would like to announce the promotion of Barksdale 01:12:16.659 --> 01:12:20.588 English to Chief Program Officer. In this role, he'll oversee 01:12:20.600 --> 01:12:24.159 market analysis rules and projects, Texas Energy Fund 01:12:24.168 --> 01:12:26.600 and he will retain responsibility for compliance and 01:12:26.609 --> 01:12:30.430 enforcement. Um have relied on him heavily during this 01:12:30.439 --> 01:12:35.149 last couple of months. And I'm pleased to recognize 01:12:35.159 --> 01:12:36.220 his contribution. 01:12:42.119 --> 01:12:47.369 In addition, I was just going to say Barksdale to do 01:12:47.378 --> 01:12:51.659 you know who the previous CPO was at this agency? I've 01:12:51.668 --> 01:12:54.220 been told sir. Barksdale English for Commission Staff. 01:12:54.229 --> 01:12:57.039 I have been told sir that I don't know anything. Okay. 01:12:58.600 --> 01:13:01.048 Well, I think what I would, what I would say is big 01:13:01.060 --> 01:13:03.878 shoes to fill in that job. Maybe the biggest. So, uh 01:13:03.890 --> 01:13:04.819 congratulations. 01:13:07.048 --> 01:13:09.970 Well, well do, do tell us. Is it Connie or is it 01:13:09.979 --> 01:13:13.000 you? Trust me, it definitely wasn't me. Okay. 01:13:14.989 --> 01:13:19.819 Um I'd also like to announce that uh Gina Abel 01:13:19.829 --> 01:13:22.418 will be leaving the Legal division to serve as our 01:13:22.430 --> 01:13:26.378 new agency counsel. In addition to our traditional 01:13:26.390 --> 01:13:29.470 agency counsel duties, uh Gina will also supervise 01:13:29.479 --> 01:13:33.739 central records in the PUC Library. Congratulations 01:13:33.750 --> 01:13:34.039 Gina. 01:13:38.869 --> 01:13:40.588 This is the type of news we're looking for in these 01:13:40.600 --> 01:13:44.899 updates Connie. Very good. Doing my best. All right 01:13:44.909 --> 01:13:46.819 I don't have anything for the rest of the agenda, unless 01:13:46.829 --> 01:13:49.789 you all do. (item:45:Chairman Gleeson adjourns meeting) All right. There being no more business 01:13:49.798 --> 01:13:51.918 before us. This meeting of the Public Utility Commission 01:13:51.930 --> 01:13:53.229 of Texas is here by adjourned.